<p>For myself, location and physical plant would a huge part of making a college decision.</p>
<p>For my kid, it was the teacher that was the number one driving force behind his college selections. BUT having said that…he did not even explore excellent teachers at more rural locations as he wanted to be in or very close to an urban setting so that he could hear great music performed by ensembles other than the school ones. </p>
<p>My kid wanted to move the trumpet teachers from Duquesne to another school…he loved the teachers…did not like the school.</p>
<p>"My kid wanted to move the trumpet teachers from Duquesne to another school…he loved the teachers…did not like the school. "</p>
<p>And there is the rub. I am not a literature person and have no idea what that is supposed to mean but it sounds good and people say it in these situations.</p>
<p>A kid may find teachers he likes at several schools and make the decision on the programs reputation along with location, cost, physical plant, other opportunities, rural vs urban and on and on. Or sometimes they really like a teacher but there are too many no goes for that school.</p>
<p>So while the professor maybe the number one factor, it does not stand alone for most kids I would suspect.</p>
<p>You also have to weigh that you may only see that professor half an hour a week. There are many other hours of your life at that school. You may not see that professor until you are a junior.</p>
<p>That professor may go on tour and be gone for a semester or two. That professor may leave the school. So many things can temper the importance of the professor. Is the student going to transfer if the professor they went to study with leaves the school?</p>
<p>The more I think about this the more impossible to make the perfect decision becomes. Maybe I will tell my son to just flip a coin. jk</p>
<p>Actually, performance majors at DS’s schools saw the applied teacher MANY more hours than just 1/2 hour. Their applied lessons were an hour a week. The teacher also held a studio class…required…that was 2 hours a week…and he also coached the trumpet students in chamber ensembles…and he was DS’s advisor also. AND he saw this guy for FOUR years. They still have a very very strong relationship.</p>
<p>Forgot about studio. And yes some do lead ensembles as well. I was not trying to minimize how important the professor is in the decision. Just to point out that there are other very important factors as well.</p>
<p>Finding out if your professor often is off on tour or taking semesters off and just how much time you actually will get with them is an important part of the process. Often a big name professor that plays for a living is there to draw student applications. But does not end up teaching very much.</p>
<p>Smaller schools it might be less of a problem. As one professor may teach many things as with your son. I have also seen where you do not get that professor until you are a junior, a TA teaches studio, another professor teaches ensembles. So while your sons situation was all he could hope for, that is not always the case and asking a few questions could save a kid from problems.</p>
<p>Here is a situation from a student we know that is now a junior at a very good music school. He is a performance major that went there very much becuase of the professor for his instrument. First year his lessons and studio were with a TA. Second year his professor took a year off to perform. Third year finally half hour a week with the professor he went there for and suddenly that professor did not seem all that special after waiting for 2 years to get a half hour a week. So situations vary.</p>
<p>Did I not read in another thread here recently a student had their schedule moved to a lesson every other week and then the professor was off performing and missed the week their lesson was scheduled and had no lesson and did not even see the prof for a month?</p>
<p>I also kind of know a college instrument professor, I have heard him play, talked to him a couple times. BIG time conservatory situation. Hates the city his school is in. He flies in for 2 days to give lessons and flies out.</p>
<p>Here is a reply a buddy of my son got when trying to schedule a sample lesson with a professor. “I will not be in town”</p>
<p>That is it, no sorry, no I would like to meet you another time, no my schedule would allow for a meeting at this time. Great professor, world known player, apparently not the greatest guy or just not having a good day.</p>
<p>RE: the above…it was our kid’s experience (info from many schools) that student had a specific NUMBER of lessons per term. The applied teacher was responsible for providing those lessons AROUND their touring and performance schedule.</p>
<p>I do not know performance majors at major conservatories who are receiving their lessons from TAs because their professors are too busy jetting around the country or world. I think this should be run through Snopes! My understanding is exactly as Thumper’s: when professors cannot be there to teach a lesson, they will make it up at a different time, but that they will do all of the required hours in a semester, but perhaps not every week. </p>
<p>My son sometimes has a two hour or even two+ hour lesson, if one of his teachers has been traveling the week before. But he has never had a stand-in TA—not once, and nor do his friends who are studying at all the big name conservatories. We only went to one school where the teacher’s main claim to fame was that he was a “resident teacher”, meaning that he did no traveling at all. It turned out, S thought he was a bit boring anyway, so that positive descriptor did not sell him anyway.</p>
<p>If other people have experience that TAs are teaching in place of the assigned studio teachers (except in extenuating circumstances, like prolonged illness, perhaps), I hope they will chime in.</p>
<p>Our experience follows that of thumper1 and -Allmusic- as well. Lesson time lost due to faculty traveling/performance commitments was always made up, often in spades. </p>
<p>Policy for lost group studio time MAY be different than private instruction, as sometimes the time block is more difficult to reschedule around a larger quantity of participants with often conflicting schedules. </p>
<p>But it may well be an institution or department specific function. It is definitely one of the “must ask” questions in preliminary investigation of a program, and if the policy is universal for all faculty or if it is an instructor specific decision.</p>
<p>Agreed on the teachers here too. My son’s private teacher will sometimes teach on a Sunday to get the hour in per week. It’s pretty unthinkable now that I’ve witnessed a year of conservatory training to have him not be taught by his main lesson teacher for the prescribed number of hours.</p>
<p>For a VP major, the issue of a “traveling teacher” can be very hard to work around. While an instrumental student could, if asked, put more than one lesson into a week, voice majors, especially the younger ones, may not be able to handle that. D loved the school before she had met the woman who would become her teacher( and is rapidly becoming a mentor and friend), but that meeting cemented the decision that she had definitely chosen the right school. Combined studio classes and performing with those from other studios bring voice majors into close contact with other members of the vocal faculty so it doesn’t hurt to learn all one can about them too. D has quite a lot of contact with her teacher each week- a lesson, which usually runs over the scheduled time, two studio classes and often an appearance during an opera rehearsal too. When my kiddo managed her fast footwork over the rough terrain and injured her ankle, it was her teacher who came to the rescue, making sure D had her cell phone number, checking in on her several times and helping to put things in motion so that proper medical care was received. I don’t think you can underestimate the importance of the roles that a teacher plays at this level. I can’t imagine how awful it would be to have to deal with a bad placement and to have to deal with a teacher/student relationship that just doesn’t work.
As for college performances, D called me the instant that she saw the cast list for the fall opera scenes performances and saw her name- she knew I wouldn’t miss it for anything and once she’s on stage, her mind is on what she’s doing there, not on who is in the audience.</p>
<p>Going to throw something out there,just as a possibility: could someone be confusing a TA for a teaching assistant?There is a big difference, at least in the violin world. Often, in the violin world, you might get assigned to the studio of X (going back a number of years,let’s say Galamian at Juilliard), but a lot of the time you would actually be taught by teaching assistants of his, people like Sally Thomas, Dorothy Delay and the like were once assistants, before becoming ‘full teachers’ in their own right. I am not saying this is what others have experienced, it could be some teachers have used TA’s, but I wanted to point that out.From my understanding, with a Galamian you spent most of your time with the teaching assistants, working on technique, scales, basic work on the repertoire, and the ‘great teacher’ i.e sob taught you the nuances i.e browbeat you over the ‘details’ :). </p>
<p>If a teacher is also an active performer, then if they are taking on students on a full time basis (rather then being a ‘special teacher’, who comes in a couple of weeks of the year,like Joshua Bell at Indiana), they should be required to make up lost lessons and such IMO, otherwise what is the point? While it may be cool to use TA’s to fill in, so to speak, which in my book would be additional teaching, it is not the same thing as seeing the ‘master’, and shouldn’t be a substitute for it.</p>
<p>musivprt you seem to understand the situation. Not sure why others did not understand. There are many teachers in name that rarely teach or as you say with JB, stop in for a week or two. And teachers often take a semester off where they do not teach at all.</p>
<p>And being taught completely or mostly by a teaching assistant or grad student especially in the first year or two is common from everything I have heard, read and seen. Some here had fortunate kids that had the professor they wanted there every week or had time in their schedule to do make ups.</p>
<p>But what you say, T57, doesn’t jibe with the experiences of real people who are telling you otherwise here on this forum. You have numerous parents and students, from a variety of different schools, telling you that they or their children are NOT taught by teaching assistants or graduate students! It is not that they are so fortunate, but that this is the protocol, not the exception. Musicprnt’s child is not in college yet, so he/she is relying on hearsay, exactly as you are. The rest of us are either in the midst of the experience, or in the case of some posters, through it. </p>
<p>Again, parents of or students who do not have the experience of being predominantly taught by a single assigned studio teacher, please speak up! Spreading rumors just makes potential auditioners and their parents needlessly anxious.</p>
<p>musicprnt: What’s a TA if not a teaching assistant? The only other abbreviation I’ve heard is technical assistant, but that doesn’t seem to apply in this situation.</p>
<p>Sorry Allmusic, not hearsay at all as I have spoken to students in that situation as well as professors that have said they do it. To think they do not exist because of a handful of parents here have not seen it, well that is your right to conclude.</p>
<p>As far potential auditioners, if they read any amount of information one of the first questions one should ask is “will my lessons all be with a professor or with a teaching assistant”.</p>
<p>Frankly I am shocked that anyone with as much information as the two of you would not know that in many programs teaching assistants and grad students give the lessons to first years. Maybe you are thinking the program is not up front about it. Most are very upfront. So those auditioners should not be anxious just informed. No its not a rumor and no it is not rare. It certainly is not true at all or even most schools but it is out there in significant numbers. Enough so that some advice books remind students to make sure and ask about it.</p>
<p>Seems like someone has a problem with everything I say or do here, even when it is backed up in books. I better return to lurking.</p>
<p>If teaching assistants are giving the lessons the first two years…that would be WELL KNOWN within that music department and would certainly be out for all to know. </p>
<p>My son WAS a T.A. He never (not even once) gave the lessons for the applied teacher on his instrument. He had many other responsibilities. However, at his school…it was also quite clear that the applied teacher was responsible for the lessons, not a T.A.</p>
<p>DS applied to UMDCP. The applied teacher there taught ALL of the performance majors on the instrument BUT T.A.s taught ALL (ALL…and for four years) students who were education majors. That was the school’s policy. The applied teacher gave master classes and some studio classes for ed majors, but their private lessons were taught by T.A.s…this information was very well publicized.</p>
<p>DS auditioned for 7 schools and visited at least 7 more as an undergrad. He applied to 4 grad schools and visited a couple more than that. As a performance major, he would have had his lessons from the applied teacher in all cases (some conservatories, some universities) and most of these teachers had very active solo or ensemble careers.</p>
<p>Just a little checking around the internet confirms what Trumpet57 says -though students may also during the semester get lessons from regular faculty:
Thus, several Juilliard faculty have teaching assistants. Just look at the website. Dorothy Delay famously had them. They do some of the teaching at least for certain faculty.
John Perry at Colburn has teaching assistants - he teaches in several schools and is not there all the time.
San Francisco Conservatory has teaching assistants.
Then there are schools, Bard, for example, where there are faculty of lesser fame, and more renowned faculty teach on a more occasional basis.
On the other hand, some schools have no teaching assistants - particularly schools with no graduate students.</p>
<p>In communicating with admissions people in various music schools, I have heard (mainly from some state universities), situations in which music ed students are taught by graduate assistants and also situations in which students seeking BM degree in composition, music theory, music history/musicology, etc. (in which they had to audition on a primary instrument or for vocal performance, take private lessons, do ensemble work, etc.) are assigned to graduate assistants unless or until they are at the level of the performance majors AND there is room in studio of one of the faculty who is willing to teach the student). And in one large state university we were looking into as a possible “safety” school we were told that even performance majors there are taught by graduate assistants for first 2 years in most cases.</p>
<p>At the 2 NY State Universities we spoke with, none of then undergrads were being taught by TA’s or GA’s. Potsdam and Fredonia.</p>
<p>At Northwestern, my son, as a composition major, would have studied with a grad student on his primary instrument, if he decided to take lessons, which was not required. At Michigan he would have been in the regular studio with the primary professor. At Bard, since he didn’t audition into the conservatory studio, he would take lessons with the professor in the college and not in the conservatory.</p>