To (All) the Colleges That Rejected Me

Parents Forum
501

<p>post 450 - youdon’tsay</p>

<p>I have spent a few minutes thinking about it since I often wonder why I would pay someone to help my kid with college apps and what value would they provide for me?</p>

<p>I am now wondering if it is some college consultant’s elaborate ploy as a last ditch effort to snag an admission from a waitlist. What if Suzy has a brilliant consultant who hatched a plan to have this letter in place to be published when the results came out and they were all negative with one or two tantalizing waitlistings? I can’t imagine that some distraught girl wrote this article overnight and got it published without some preplanning.</p>

502

<p>Yep. It’s just math.</p>

503

<p>texaspg, that’s what I think is going on here, with or without the paid consultant. And that’s OK with me, too. What I don’t like is pretending that she just wrote this off the top of her head, just happened to get it printed in the WSJ and, now, golly, look at all the attention I’m getting.</p>

504

<p>I am betting on Columbia Journalism or political science waitlist!</p>

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<p>My thoughts exactly. At this time of year, there are always “what can I do to get off the wait list” threads. I haven’t read any this year, but getting published in a national publication and appearing on national TV within a week after rejection day might be a pretty good suggestion.</p>

506

<p>A couple of things:</p>

<p>GFG, I agree with your overall statement (post 410) that upper-middle-class students of mixed ethnicity should not be classified as “disadvantaged,” or even URM. As an example (similar to examples you know of), a student I am familiar with has a very mixed background, half of which, by itself, is considered URM. Nevertheless, like students you know, she is advantaged – economically, intellectually (due to parents’ education) – and therefore, academically. She had excellent admissions results this year, better than her stats + (excellent but not superlative) e.c.’s have yielded to students of non-mixed backgrounds. I myself was surprised for about 30 seconds, until I figured it out.</p>

<p>She is hardly disadvantaged. And her lifelong community service involvement was encouraged by her parents from a young age – parents who are classic liberals, and let’s be clear that community service is a de rigeur upper-middle-class liberal activity (adult and non-adult).</p>

<p>To you (maybe even to me), she is not “diverse.” But to the colleges, she is, simply because she is of non-homogeneous background and thus “brings more than a singular viewpoint to campus.” I.m.o., having sat on various Boards, a lot of this is institutional. Boards will ask, “Hey, where is our ‘diversity’ component?” If an institution, whether a private K-12 school, a youth orchestra, or a college, can demonstrate diversity of some kind, they keep the Board happy. In my view, this is insider political correctness more than public P.C.</p>

<p>Regarding poetgrl’s post 451
I agree. Same size pie, a LOT more eaters.</p>

<p>But I also agree with PG: The size of the pie is artificially circumscribed, based on perceptions which are exaggerated, distorted, overgeneralized. Unfortunately, so much of it is about “rankings” that until two things happen, the favorite pie will be drooled over and the frenzy will continue.</p>

<p>(1)Employers have to start hiring outside of 10-15 schools, but with other considerations in mind. Many of you have said that employers do, but I have also read on CC some employers (posters) stating that “we only hire from X schools” (fill in 2-3 U’s). The question is, Why? There are many good STEM programs, many good business programs (accounting, finance, management, marketing), many good law schools & med schools. I understand the part about a proven track record for schools X, Y, and Z. But have grads from schools U, V, and W been tried? (for any of you who head such a firm?)</p>

<p>I ask because on the academic level, I know plenty of students who have graduated far outside of top 20 schools and have gone on to one of the top 6 Ivies for grad school. They can’t be losers, and the colleges can’t be that dumb to admit losers into grad school, given the tiny admit rate for prominent grad schools. It appears that institutions of higher education are far more open to talent from multiple sources than are employers.</p>

<p>(2)USNWR needs a credible competitor, with a goal to publish and market overseas. (Ahem)</p>

<p>As for the main subject of this thread, I am underwhelmed with the girl herself. She’s not evil, but she’s not “all that,” either. I guess if you get published somewhere, that makes you “special.” :rolleyes:</p>

507

<p>I don’t think there was Pre-planning. But, I’m sure there was post-polishing by sis and sending in to buddy at WSJ by sis, as well. </p>

<p>I have no more problem with that than I have with the legacy admissions at the places where she was denied. This, my friends, is the way of the world, as we know.</p>

508

<p>Bay, I’m not harsh. If you think about it, I’m one who says kids can do extraordinary things without curing cancer or starting a fake charity. That they can fit oodles into their lives beyond math competition practice. I’ve seen the genuine good many do- and don’t call it forgery or resume padding. I don’t mock urms tho I’ve admitted I don’t get athlete preferences. I laugh out loud at the witty kids and adore some who express themselves well, with grand perspective and affection for their topics.</p>

<p>Sometimes, in the rush to feel sorry for kids, blame colleges and talk conspiracy, yeah, I feel like the lone ranger. And sometimes I mention some easily avoided mistakes. If a kid can’t answer a Why Us? whataya gonna do? </p>

<p>I also advocate that kids get some help with their apps. They’re 17 and have never filled out something like that before. Their first inclination is often to either write a thesis-statement essay or reveal tmi. Not high cost folks, but some adult savvy to the process. It’s a positive to be able to seek help when needed. Yes, even once at an elite. Professionals do it all the time, irl. </p>

<p>All better than calling it s crapshoot, pretending it’s all incomprehensible, leaving a bright kid adrift- or mocking those who got a seat.</p>

509

<p>Fwiw, I happen to think that the reactions on CC might have been different had the girl posted her essay in a slightly different form in this forum.</p>

<p>There have been plenty of whining posts over the years on CC, and I do not believe there has been many “Yep, you are right!”</p>

510

<p>Totally agree, xiggi.<br>
My problem with Suzy is that she mocks. On TV, she claims she wanted to write about the process. She didn’t. Said she wanted to note the rat race, crapshoot, business model. Instead we get wearing a NA headdress (as if that’s how it goes,) starting a fake charity (who believes that’s legit?) getting a meaningless internship. She didn’t tell what she did do. Did suggest that the better, more effective choice would have been something more scammy or at least suspect. Just doesn’t hit my funny bone.</p>

<p>Someone please make me laugh. Tpg?</p>

511

<p><a href=“1”>quote</a>Employers have to start hiring outside of 10-15 schools, but with other considerations in mind. Many of you have said that employers do, but I have also read on CC some employers (posters) stating that “we only hire from X schools” (fill in 2-3 U’s).

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<p>But employers already DO hire from a lot of schools. It’s just that a handful of employers (Goldman Sachs, McKinsey, Bain, etc.) are overvalued on CC or treated as though they are the only employers who ever hire anyone, ever. </p>

<p>More to the point, when employers only hire at certain schools, it is not because they are making value judgments that only students at Schools X, Y and Z are smart and other students at other schools, well, who could be bothered. It’s as simple as getting a target-rich environment and not spreading their own resources too thin, that’s all. </p>

<p>But back to your point - employers DO hire from plenty of schools. It’s just that you have easily-impressed parents and students on CC who don’t think that – oh, an entry level management job at Target headquarters in Minneapolis (or whatever) could be the start of a very fine and lucrative career. But, you know, their loss. If they all want to chase after the same few places and think those are the “only good jobs,” then let 'em. The future belongs to those who take a broader view of the workplace.</p>

512

<p>Thank you for elaborating on your outlook, lookingforward. Sometimes your criticisms come across as downright scary, and because you are an excellent writer, I have to assume it wasn’t unintentional.</p>

<p>Adding, I never liked the “why us” question on the app. What exactly, are colleges expecting to hear, other than “You have my major and the ECs I want, I’ve visited and loved it and the people I met, I like the location and I can afford it.” It seems like a big “duh” question to me. I’m a fairly well-educated adult, and I can’t figure out what would make an awesome answer to that question.</p>

513

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<p>To the best of my knowledge, Columbia does not offer Journalism as an undergrad major. Their famed school of journalism is a graduate program only.</p>

514

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<p>Bay, there is a certain segment (very large, actually) applying to drool-over “elites” who truly and actually have no idea why. Overwhelmingly, it is the parents who are dictating these choices. Secondarily, it is peers. I know this in a very intimate way; I know whereof I speak. I.m.o., if you do not know why you are applying to a college, you don’t deserve to be admitted. (Same for a job, Bay.)</p>

515

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<p>Okay, but I just gave a comprehensive “why” answer that would apply to any applicant for any college. What else are the colleges looking for, is my question.</p>

516

<p>"Someone please make me laugh. Tpg? "</p>

<p>I have found that I am more juvenile than my 14 year old in terms of what amuses me. It is so bad xiggi just told me he is in no mood for jokes because I have been needling him.</p>

<p>Coureur - did not know about no undergrad journalism at Columbia. I thought someone I knew was looking into going there last year but might have been just writing/English major.</p>

517

<p>Ah, see, to me - the answer is incredibly obvious. It’s NOT “You are well known for my major and I loved all of the people when I visited and I really love your location in the big city / in the burbs / in the country / next to the ocean / next to the lake / next to the river and your professors are all awesome too, and look! so and so is a famous alum and one of my heroes!” And when my kids wrote stuff like that, I made them go back and excise it.</p>

<p>To me, the answer to the “why us” question is – what is it about YOU (the candidate) that complements what you sense to be our ethos, our values, our sense of service, our purpose, and makes us feel that yeah, you’d be a good addition to our community. </p>

<p>I think too many students are way too literal in answering this question, and give the standard platitudes about how the campus was so pretty and the professors so award-winning and so forth, and it entirely misses the point. And I don’t blame adcoms for being tired of such platitudes.</p>

518

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<p>Take it two at a time in your head. Bay, if I said to you, would your kids like, say, Duke or U of Chicago better (just to pick two schools that have some sharp cultural differences), you could articulate which one they’d prefer and why, right? So … what is about them that would make them productive, useful members of the XX community, and less so of the YYY community?</p>

519

<p>PG,
I understand what you are saying. What bothers me about it is, that if the colleges are looking for a certain answer, why don’t they say so? If they cannot articulate what sort of answer they are looking for by asking the right question, why should they expect the students to do anything different? I guess you are saying they are in a sense trying to “trick” the applicants into figuring out what they really mean.</p>

520

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<p>The phony aspect of holistic admissions is that many students will apply to both Duke and Chicago, and in the Duke/Chicago essays they are expected to explain why Duke/Chicago is uniquely right for them and why they are just the right kind of students for Duke/Chicago.</p>

<p>In few other countries does the application process require such ingratiation (less polite phrases come to mind).</p>