<p>That’s not surprising at all, considering West Point was founded based on Civil Engineering.</p>
<p>Here’s some more interesting stuff:</p>
<p>Aerospace: USAFA in second (big surprise) and USNA tied in third with Embry-Riddle in Prescott, AZ</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/engineering/nophd/enns01_brief.php[/url]”>http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/engineering/nophd/enns01_brief.php</a></p>
<p>Wow.</p>
<p>I had heard from a mid. at USNA that on I day 2004, kids were admitted who did not have appointments but showed up nonetheless. I don’t know about other years. I do not know the number, but as I recall it was more than one…of course they all had noms and were medically qualified; but had received their rejection letters. Got to admire their tenacity…still, pretty risky when you are assured of acceptance at another academy!</p>
<p>Per PM’s comment - those who showed up had nominations and medically qualified - cc’s son was NOT nominated to USNA and that is a very big distinction. Thus, the last minute showing up doesn’t seem in any way logical. Per Zaphod’s comment, once a nomination is declined, you’ve shot that one and that member of congress is not likely to give you another shot unless there is a really, really good reason and he is better than all the other highly-qualified MD candidates. </p>
<p>Thus: What does your son want to do with his life? Hold out for USNA (I agree with your comments --we are from MD -which is why he worked on going to USMMA as he is a sea engineer type) - perhaps he could finagle the NAPS deal with the academy - that is the best road into Annapolis with more wiggle room – even if overqualified. But USNA has to WANT him.
OR be pleased as punch with USMA or USAF - truely fine institutions that most others would give their eye teeth for, especially if looking for career military and leadership training.
OR go civilian U and try again next year.
How wonderful to have choices - and I wouldn’t call any of that “settling” nor should you.</p>
<p>Just for the record, there is a C4C at USAFA right now that was a plebe at West Point last year…he wanted to fly, so he transferred and started all over again.</p>
<p>Zaphod wrote:</p>
<p>“One thing your son needs to understand, however, is that if he receives appointments this year and turns them down, he will NOT get them next year. Neither the Academies nor the politicians will waste their time with someone who they offered an appointment to and then turned them down.”</p>
<p>Sorry but this is completely NOT TRUE. There are several mids at USNA (I have met them) who received nominations and appointments to USNA and turned them down – not for medical reasons, but because they believed they were not ready and had too much integrity to accept an appointment that rightfully belonged to someone else. </p>
<p>They each then entered civilian college and opened a new application the following fall and pursued a new nomination. They received nominations from the same sources the second time – in one case the applicant received multiple nominations the second time around. They received appointments a second time from USNA.</p>
<p>One is from MARYLAND: one of the toughest states to get a nomination in.</p>
<p>It seems this really depends on the MOC. I spoke with our Congressman and he told me that he would be reluctant to offer an appointment a second time unless there were some very good explanations. I imagine that there generally would be.</p>
<p>Thank you everyone, this was the kind of dialogue we were looking for and has been very helpful. Someone was correct when he said showing up on I-Day with a nomination but no appt versus showing up without a nom is different. I had not thought of it that way, and that was the type of qualifiers and information we were seeking.<br>
He is going to contact the congressman and senator from which he received duplicate AF nominations and see if anyone has declined their USNA appointment. But from what I understand it is a very long shot. He will also ask why he wasnt nominated for his stated first choice, perhaps some insight there will help his decision. Oiixxgs comments were helpful, he will also ask if this is a possibility at all.
Zaphod, I will ask my son to respond directly to you, but he was a little leery of this site when I first found it. He was afraid it would be full of misinformation and hearsay, but I havent found this to be true. It has helped me understand the processes overall. And interestingly, the evolution of the process as well. Certainly I will pass along your thoughts on possibilities post-USAFA and USMA. He also agrees with you, not me, that the mids would respect an academy transfer for seeing the light as he put it !!
My son has a very close friend at USAFA, just through Recognition, at Annapolis, and several acquaintances at WestPoint, and he has respect for all academies. We are planning to visit USAFA & USMA in April. But still, there is a certain connection to the Naval Academy for Marylanders. I imagine it is the same in NY & CO.</p>
<p>What/Who is MOC?</p>
<p>Thanks</p>
<p>Your son always has the option of enlistment. If he enlists after high school he could reapply to USNA with a presidential nomination and potentially head to USNA before he even completes training.</p>
<p>True, it is a risky option… he may not be accepted, or something may go wrong. But it is worth a try if he desires to attend there, and may be a more viable option than trying to reapply for a congressional nomination in a competetive district like you described.</p>
<p>Of course, you could always move to Montana or something :D</p>
<p>Best of luck to your son, whatever he ends up doing.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>member of congress (your congressman or senator)</p>
<p>Most of the majors with the title of “engineering” at USMA are accredited by the Engineering Accreditation Commission of the Accreditation Board for Engineering and Technology (ABET), and as another post indicated a couple of the engineering majors are ranked high nationally each year, as are some curriculums at the other academies.</p>
<p>However, none of the academies will likely ever be ranked as the #1 engineering school in the nation. That position has been held by my alma mater for the past 7 years and will likely continue to hold that position for the next century or so. (Check out the link in the prior post if you want to find out the name of the college.) I am saying this not to brag, but back in the dark ages when I was in high school USNA was also my top choice. I received the nominations, but had trouble with DODMERB was finally cleared, but was not admitted. As ZAPHOD pointed out life goes on and you roll with the punches. Things have turned out good for me.</p>
<p>Now one of my sons is a Cadet at USMA majoring in engineering. Early on his first choice was USNA, but after visiting both academies and spending the overnights, he changed his mind and never looked back.</p>
<p>As far as the transfers after graduation, we know a graduate from USMA Class of 2005 who was commissioned in the U.S. Navy. He spent a semester at USNA as an exchange student, then went back to USMA and graduated and requested an interservice transfer. Rare as was pointed out but achievable. His dad (retired U.S. Army officer) and three siblings (all USMA grads.) were not too happy, but he did what was right for him.</p>
<p>Your son needs to consider the things that were offered to him and make a choice as to what is right for him. Some opportunities may come around once in life. Good luck to him.</p>
<p>I know of at least one person (and there are many more, I’m sure) that was die-hard USMA but only received an appointment to USAFA. He ended up going to USAFA and is loving it. He never looked back. I think that there are certain intangibles present at each academy that we cannot perceive of until we actually get there–like the culture and the “feel” of the place. You never really know if you made the right decision until you get there and have seen the good and the bad. Your son could end up going to USAFA and love it (or USMA). Or he could receive an appointment to USNA next year and get there and hate it…I don’t know; none of us do. It’s all about making the decision he thinks is the right thing at the time, living with the consequences (good and bad), and making the most of the experience. Good Luck to you and your son!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Then I stand corrected.</p>
<p>However, if I were Supreme Military Dictator, I’d put a stop to that practice immediately.</p>
<p>What do you mean, “You don’t think you’re ready”? No? So then why the HELL did you apply in the first place and waste everyone’s time?</p>
<p>If I ever sit on the board of admissions, I will immediately circular-file any candidate who pulls that crap. If you apply, and you get in, either show up or don’t, but either fish or cut bait!</p>
<p>Sorry, but there is ZERO justification for that. ABSOLUTELY NONE.</p>
<p>The law allows the class to be filled using up to 150 candidates with NO NOMINATIONS. The intent is to use these fills only when they are short of qualified candidates with nominations who accept.</p>
<p>It would be a lot less of a “shot-in-the-dark” if your son pounds the admissions folks with his desire to attend USNA and convince them that he would absolutely jump at the opportunity if given. Of course all this is assuming his record can hold water compared to many of the candidates already offered appointments through nomination.</p>
<p>Good Luck!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>When was the last time THAT was used?</p>
<p>I wonder if the backpack toters that showed up on I-Day were from the waitlist? That would seem to make much more sense.</p>
<p>I have no idea. However, it is a clear loophole for a HIGHLY qualified candidate who, for some reason was unable to obtain a nomination, to nevertheless obtain admission. I’m not saying it is done, just that the law allows it.</p>
<p>The mind boggles…</p>
<p>Oh! Dad2B, I wasn’t saying the 150 wasn’t true. Wasn’t even really thinking about that, just the anecdote about the backpack toters from cc3701a! Perhaps an alternate possibility, just as yours was. Didn’t mean to step on toes!</p>
<p>And cc3701a, Welcome to the forum! Really, it has been said many times, that we are just putting the various pieces of the puzzle together here, and it seems each person has had such a different experience that we each put in our 2 cents and let the reader pick and choose what is applicable. You seem to be the first here to have asked this particular question, and it doesn’t seem any of us here have direct experience, so please keep posting your findings. Perhaps, eventually, we will begin to form a clearer picture of this whole process. Until then, grab some chocolate, some merlot, or whatever poison suits you and settle in for the rollercoaster ride!:)</p>
<p>Oh! Forgot to say good luck whatever your son decides!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Two bottles of Dos Equis Amber on an empty stomach (I’m a cheap date.).</p>
<p><zaphod rolls=“” to=“” starboard=“” off=“” the=“” keyboard=“” and=“” discovers=“” what=“” a=“” lovely=“” weave=“” shade=“” carpet=“” of=“” this=“” hotel=“” has…=“”></zaphod></p>
<p>Dang. I’m behind. Sorry, guys, that’s what happens when there is still 2 feet of snow on the ground and you have to gear up to let the dog in! I’ll go back to lurking quietly. </p>
<p>(tiptoes back off to remote corner of the country…)</p>