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<p>He is not eligible for General Studies as it is for non-traditional students and he has not had a break in his education, nor has he a compelling need to attend part-time.</p>
<p>Hey bball, I am going to Rice in a few days. It gave me the best financial aid by far (a difference of about $10,000 in grants over 2 years). Also, it is easy to get to (an 8 hour drive- so I wont have to pay for plane flights or hotels etc ), it’s in a big city, I hope to get involved with the Baker Institute, and I will be able to take more classes than at Cornell or UVa because I wont have anymore gen-ed, and it allows students to take 5-6 classes instead of 4-5 like Cornell. But, since I am paying for college by myself, the superior finaid was the biggest factor. For what I want to do, Rice will suit me well. I want a job in the northeast that pays decently, but I am not really wanting to do investment banking with all those crazy recruiters. I am looking more at the fed reserve, CIA, Economic development and stuff like that before a grad school to get a master of public policy and possible PhD. </p>
<p>As for the topic, how much engineering does he have left? If its not too much, and he is willing to stay in school for an extra semester, then why not just take polisci classes at Columbia without getting an official degree. He will learn what he wants to learn and if he wants to go to law school, I dont think good grades in another schools arts and sciences college will help anymore than good grades at Columbia’s CAS. Unless it would be all engineering from here out, I suggest that he take the minimum number of classes needed for the degree and load up on the politics classes that he is really interested in. If he does really well on the LSAT, I am sure he could get into some good law schools. </p>
<p>Whew, that was long.</p>
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<p>Most of those schools are going to be beyond his reach. Many schools have a minimum GPA for transfer and even for those that don’t a 2.6 is not going to get you into those top tier schools.</p>
<p>suchow,</p>
<p>If your son can pull his GPA to as high as mathematically possible, he could have a chance at a good law school. I recommend posting in the law school forums, since there is one individual who also did engineering, did not have a stellar GPA, but still made it into a top law school.</p>
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<p>Have fun! Rice is such a wonderful place. Did you get any housing?</p>
<p>Echoing nspeds, people with engineering backgrounds are in high demand for patent law. I would suggest your son look into this.</p>
<p>As others have said, the most important thing that he can do is get his GPA as high as possible. After two and a half years, it’ll be difficult to bring it up a whole lot, but any improvment would be good. Also it’ll show an upward trend in grades which will be helpful. The only other advice is he needs to start preping for the LSAT. If he can manage a steller score on that, he’d greatly improve his chances.</p>
<p>This passage brings to light the harsh reality of grade deflation where that person wants to move on to competitive employment or grad school. </p>
<p>Engineering as a general rule has grade deflation. I think that the regular college at Columbia has like a 3.4 or higher average graduating gpa (see gradeinflation.com and follow the trend for Columbia). </p>
<p>I bet this student gets into all of the surrounding State U’s if he wants (e.g. SUNY, Rutgers, UConn, ect). They all know about this program and how difficult it is, and if he takes summer or winter classes he can cut the graduation time (if he wants).</p>
<p>I agree with nspeds, just work hard at columbia. Law admissions people are not daft, they would probably figure out why your son transfered. After all, most of the schools has has a good shot at will have a weaker polisci department. Just do as well as possible and study, study, study for the LSAT.</p>
<p>Nspeds- yeah, I have housing at Will Rice college. I am excited, I have had to live at home so far to keep college cheap. I am finally able (with a lot of debt) to get out of my home town.</p>
<p>I think Brown, University of Chicago, Berkeley, and Georgetown are at least out of reach. Has he considered the University of Michicagan? -I think their average transfer GPA is around 3.3, but considering your son is at Columbia engineering… And Michigan is not at all a bad school, AND it’s cheaper than a private. If he’d rather study polisci than engineering, I think it would be a pity to spend the last year and a half of college studying subjects he hates. If he scores stellarly on the LSAT and could up his GPA to around 3.3 by the time he graduates, some solid public law schools would def be in reach.</p>
<p>I am completely confident he could up his GPA by graduation if he isn’t in engineering. With an engineering degree, it will be lower. And, he’s not the least interested in patent law. He’s wanting to get into international law. </p>
<p>His SAT was 1520 and upon graduating high school had completed a number of AP classes, and had a GPA of 4.6. He was a Presidential Scholar and National Merit Scholar and was awarded the local Rotary scholarship. His record prior to going to Columbia was amazing, with athletics and community service to top it off.</p>
<p>I find it hard to believe schools won’t look at this situation. And, if other schools in the area are aware of the problem at Columbia, wouldn’t a place like NYU consider him?</p>
<p>NYU is certainly easier to be admitted to than a top-tier university, so I’m not sure. One thing you must consider though, when looking at high shool GPA, is that different high schools vary very much in how competitive they are, which is why college GPA is much more important for transfer admissions. I went to a charter hs, but the average valedictorian from my home high school, for instance, could not get into an ivy, simply because our school system is so poor and unchallenging. I would suggest you contact transfer admissions counselors directly to ask about how seriously they would consider your son’s case. Often, transfer admissions counselors are willing to be fairly direct with you.</p>
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<p>He went to a private high school that sends a lot of kids to Ivy schools. A very good school, highly regarded and competitive.</p>
<p>Alright, sounds good then. I think your son should contact a transfer admissions counselor at NYU and be as specific as he can about his situation, then ask them if he’d possibly be a strong candidate.</p>
<p>NYU might be an excellent move for him. It has a top-notch law school. He might look to see how many students the law school there takes from NYU undergrad.</p>
<p>I’m much more familiar with Columbia College than with the policies at SEAS. But, I know at the college it’s actually possible to graduate without a major. Is that possible at SEAS? Would it give him more flexibility for his course choices?</p>
<p>Is there a major within SEAS that he could do better at? I know they have applied sciences and math and not just engineering, and that students there can do a concentration in econ.</p>
<p>Has he tried the transfer to the college? I realize they make it difficult because traditionally SEAS has been easier to get into, and they don’t want students to use it as a backdoor way to game admissions into the college. But he clearly is not in that situation. He’s stuck it out in SEAS for five semesters, and based on his stats very well might have gotten directly into the college. I realize Columbia administration is not the most flexible of institutions, but has he at least tried arguing a genuine change of interests?</p>
<p>If he stays where he is and graduates in engineering, he might consider an intermediate step before law school. For example, he might go on for a masters in something more closely related to poli sci. Thinking along similar lines, is there an advantage to him taking a year off and then coming back to Columbia in General Studies?</p>
<p>Posting here has been one of the most productive things I’ve done to try and sort out this issue. You have all been very helpful. Of course if anyone has anything to add I’m happy to continue on but I wanted to take a moment to thank all of you. Also, it has been suggested that I might do well to post this in the Parents thread so that I can get some feedback there, so I may do that. </p>
<p>Based on all the information we’ve gathered, he is most likely going to stay at Columbia this semester and take classes that will more closely match his goals. While in his last semester there he will apply to other schools, and transfer in the fall. We don’t see much point in getting a degree in engineering if he wants to go into int’l law, and will not be able to bring up his GPA there.</p>
<p>NYU is looking better and better - we checked out their Transfer Admissions FAQ on their admissions forum and there was a lot of helpful info. Looks like his GPA there would consist only of his grades received at NYU. That could really be a fantastic opportunity. We’ll confirm this with a counselor.</p>
<p>Looks like his GPA there would consist only of his grades received at NYU. That could really be a fantastic opportunity. We’ll confirm this with a counselor.</p>
<p>This is true for his new GPA at NYU. If he transfers to NYU, or for that matter any other 4-year university, his GPA will be “reset” and only new classes from his new institution will be calculated into his GPA. HOWEVER, his GPA and grades from Columbia will be calculated BY LSAC - which is the law school organization that calculates final GPA.</p>
<p>Every class he has taken at Columbia, with poor grades, will be seen and accounted for by <em>all</em> law schools. </p>
<p>So if he receives a 2.0 from columbia with 60 cdr and a 4.0 from NYU with 60 cdr - his final LSAC (Law school) GPA will be 3.0</p>
<p>As one other poster mentioned here, if your son has few Engineering requirements to go, he should consider finishing his major requirements and loading up on other classes to bring his GPA up. </p>
<p>International law is not very well understood by most people on this board, myself included, but in <em>no way</em> does having an Engineering undergraduate degree preclude one from entering the international law field.</p>
<p>As long as he brings his GPA up and possibly consider taking a year off in-between college and law school, to have his senior grades calculated into his final GPA, and receive an extremely high LSAT (174+), he’ll have a good shot at top 14 law schools.</p>
<p>transfering to anywhere is going to be VERY tough for him. It’s best for him to somehow manage to take some polsci class where he’s at.</p>
<p>suchow,</p>
<p>bball87 was kind enough to post your situation on the parents thread. Here are some of the responses. I hope that it helps.</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=135847[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=135847</a></p>
<p>honestly, i would recommend him to stay at Columbia and get his degree in engineering while taking many other humanity courses to bring up his GPA. A degree from Columbia is truly remarkable to begin with, and I don’t think he has a great shot of being accepted to any “top tier” schools. They look at a 2.6, and then they look at the next kid up and they see a 3.6, and it just won’t do it.</p>
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<p>Nice idea, but the course work involved with the engineering courses is SO difficult, at least for him, that there really isn’t time to add on other courses in Humanities, etc. Also, if you want to stay beyond the four years, that is to graduate after your class, you must submit a waiver/petition to do so, and you don’t walk. If you are not progressing toward your degree at the appropriate rate, they put you on probation of different levels depending upon the severity of the situation.</p>