“I’ll just show them houses where 90% of people that fit their profile have purchased in the past.”
Which is profiling and discrimination!
It’s almost funny–the problem is that the realtors are racially profiling, and @OhiBro , you keep saying–no, it’s okay, they’re actually racially profiling.
You left out a relevant word.
“I’ll just show them houses where 90% of people that fit their racial profile have purchased in the past.”
… rather than look up and present actual information about school quality that people interested in school quality itself (rather than as a proxy topic for race/ethnicity as it is so commonly used) would want to see.
But of course, the agents didn’t do that at all, unless you ignore the part of the profile that includes their family situation, their expressed desires and their cost requirements, and only pay attention to the part of their profile that is their skin color.
If this were an academic study, sure, go on to examine both (all) sides. But this is a practical study in whether the agents conform to the intent of regulations. Are they equally “fair?”
I don’t need all the “supposes.” As in, suppose the minority “buyers” were themselves biased. Or that somehow it’s crystal clear what a white person means by “good” schools and magically not specific enough when a minority says the same.
This still serves to mask the problem. And seems (?) to me a way to just perpetuate argument.
Like it or not, these tests are run.
I don’t see any discussion of the race of the realtors. Surely that is very relevant.
How so, exactly?
Agents of any race can be racist*, and/or believe that racial profiling in an environment with significant numbers of racist buyers will help them close deals more quickly.
*against any race, including their own
It would be a very bad study if they chose only white realtors. And of course it’s interesting whether different groups of realtors are more, less, or not racist.
Holy anything, ucb. Are you trying to excuse what they did?
I find it astounding anyone can defend what happened here. It’s one thing to lay out the information to prospects and let them choose, but to assume that ethnic affinity is a driving force in buying a home, rather than price and school district ratings? Why would a good school district be different to those OC different races?
A friend of mine who is in a mixed race marriage felt that it was important that the school district and neighborhood where they live, should be somewhat diverse. They also wanted the best school districts. Their realtor showed them homes in the top school districts that were affordable to them and met their parameters, and also gave them info on the districts. Racial composition is often easily available for an area. The realtor did not even comment on that though the diversity desire was mentioned. Information was given and it was up to the client to sort that out.
No. Are you misinterpreting understanding the situation and motivations with approving of such?
UCB, imo, you’re projecting explanations.
Sometimes a thread is to vent and share responses to some situation. Not seek to offer myraid possible reasons for unfortunate behaviors, in counterpoint. What’s it going to come down to, an agent didn’t like a tester’s shirt, thought they could read something into that?
No idea where the repeat reference to “racist buyers” comes from. This was a particular designed and vetted test, just what it was. Agents are not ‘supposed to be’ racist and the paired testers presented the same info/desires, but were offered different options/info.
First rule of sales is to listen. Not assume, “Hey, these folks are Black, they really want x neighborhood.” And, “These clients are white, I know what they really want.”
If you do not approve of the test results, it isn’t coming through.
It’s hard to have a debate when words are put in to my mouth, followed by total disbelief in something that I never said or implied. ?
My comments have consistently made clear that a person’s profile isn’t defined by their race.
Again, not talking about racial profiling here.
Also, regarding the HUD link you provided (thank you), the steering example they give describes how a buyer requested a specific neighborhood, but was steered away. Not an indeterminate case where a person wants “good schools.“
And there was another comment from someone that suggested a similar profile between white and black should be handled exactly the same. I disagree because if that were the case, there would be no need for human interaction. This could all be done with computers. Yet, that hasn’t happened.
Roughly 70% of realtors have not attained a bachelor’s degree. They work in a tough business and deserve some respect and latitude for what they do, rather than being judged from the ivory tower by a few people that may never have needed a commission to feed their family. I’m not in the business of destroying people.
From the article:
“ the investigation reveals that Long Island’s dominant residential brokering firms help solidify racial separations.”
How would these firms be dominant if they didn’t listen?
Was it explicitly stated that this thread was only for venting or being outraged?
In any case, if you do not understand why something undesirable occurs, you will be less effective at figuring out how to stop or reduce it. Simply being angry and outraged is not necessarily effective.
You are misunderstanding what I wrote. I did not say that the test “buyers” were racist or expressed racist preferences (obviously, the test was intended to avoid that). The racist buyers are other customers at large who have “trained” the agents to expect unstated racist preferences among buyers, even if the individual buyer (such as the test “buyers” in this experiment) does not hold the assumed racist preferences.
“Dominant” has to do with sales achieved. Not a clue, at all, to whether their practices are fair. Which they so apparently are not, per this test.
The fact some agent can close a deal does NOT mean they are fair equally to all.
Is it OK to be a racially aware buyer? For example the couple above who preferred a diverse neighborhood? Being white, can I say don’t waste your time and mine showing me a house in a 90% black area? Is it morally better if I actively prefer to live in a 90% black area?
Not what the study looked at.
Yes. The fair housing standards deal with the denial of housing in some form or fashion, which would not apply here.
@OhiBro --the pairs of testers were demographically matching. The only relevant difference was race. So, what is the supposed non-racial profiling you keep referring to?