<p>I am a little surprised to see how strongly people came out in favor of packaging for college admissions.</p>
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<p>Thankfully for me it is not even an issue. My kid is not going to apply to any academic college and will instead pursue a passion.</p>
<p>What is distortment?</p>
<p>Ecazndb8r,
Did you happen to read any of the “are colleges racist” thread? There seems to be a fair amount of bleeding over of some issues from that thread to this one, so some of the comments here, if you didn’t follow that behemoth thread, may seem a bit out of context here. Its understandible if its confusing.</p>
<p>For those in favor of volunteering, what about donations instead?</p>
<p>Like that one, ^ for instance.</p>
<p>^ Thank you, that thread was already out of control when I logged on (after a hiatus of months) whereas this one was just started. In many ways, I think I’ve already given my honest opinion of what I think of EC’c. On the other hand, I’ve also found several posts on this thread to be disquieting(which is possibly evident by my last two posts. I apologize in advance to anyone if the tone is overly harsh.) and felt it necessary to respond. W’ll see where it goes from here.</p>
<p>IP, why donations? They don’t really show involvement on part of the individual, and if you want community service padding, I offered a couple options that should be similar to regular performing, which I’m assuming you child does fairly often. The benefit of volunteering comes from engaging with others. If your child is against that, or simply doesn’t want to do it, they aren’t alone by any means, but I’d suggest trying a few forms before giving it up entirely. Volunteering is something that many people find enjoyable, and that urge to help people, not the number of sandwiches maid and distributed, is what is valuable (for college, but more importantly, as a human being).</p>
<p>On the topic of pushing, this is my philosophy. If the kid wants to pursue EC X, then (s)he has to put in a minimum of three hours of practice every day into it. Otherwise, no support from parents. If the kid wants to add EC Y on top, OK, an additional 3 hours of practice is then added on. So on and so forth.</p>
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<p>ECaz, Thankfully we don’t have to worry about resume padding, but sheer brilliance will be enough (or lack of brilliance will be detrimental). My point about volunteering is that not everyone likes it. Many people do find it enjoyable, and I am all for them going and volunteering. Many others don’t, and I am all for them not volunteering. There are many ways to give back to society. Mine (as an adult) has been donations.</p>
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<p>That’s so cynical. I thought colleges valued applicants who pursued their passions and didn’t do things to package applications.</p>
<p>No problem, ECazndb8r. It is hard to follow all this stuff.</p>
<p>Bottom line, IMO, is that any student, regardless of ethnic background, needs to stand out if applying to top schools, especially those with acceptance rates in the single digits. There are many ways to “shine” and for one’s passion about <em>whatever</em> to stand out. The essay is usually a top choice for that.</p>
<p>A good friend of mine has a DS who is a strong student, respectable standardized test scores (not of the scales, but good) lots and lots of accolades, awards, involvement in music, drum major, captain of Odessy of the mind team, etc. She tended to go on about him and how sure she was that he would be such a prize catch for any school that they would be falling all over themselves to get him. (He was applying for 7 yr BA-MD programs). Her jaw dropped when I finally told her “at those schools, he is a dime a dozen”. She simply didnt know. She thought he was a superstar. In the environment/school he will be attending he will be a superstar, but in many, including several that didnt even call him for an interview, he was not. Point being, one does need to understand how to present their strengths, their dreams, their goals. I dont consider this “packaging”, which has a negative connotation, I consider this how to “apply smart” (if that makes sense). The kid who throws a few weeks/months of allowance at an organization for the underpriviledged is going to look very different from the one who organizes a fundraiser and playground-building event for a homeless shelter.</p>
<p>IP fair enough, but I’m assuming that if your child is the one making donations, they will be doing it with YOUR money. This takes out the personal involvement part of the equation. As I tried to emphasize, volunteering can be done w/o thought of padding. If your child has no interest in helping others(I can’t quite believe that) then, yes, they can not volunteer, and as you said, that will have no impact on their college choice. However, if the urge to help IS there, there’s no need to be making soup if you burn water when boiling it. There are many ways to volunteer</p>
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<p>Fully, fully agreed! You only live once. What’s the point in doing something that you do not find personally interesting and personally fulfilling?</p>
<p>This is precisely why I am against pushing kids to volunteer unless they want to volunteer on their own. In the latter case parents should completely help kids find volunteering opportunities.</p>
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<p>But that has nothing to do with ECs, and volunteering is not the only way to give back.</p>
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<p>They don’t have to give back when they are a kid. They can start to give back after they get a job. I started donating when I was 25 and have been steadily increasing it at the same rate as my income growth. I think helping others is natural human tendency. One has to be a sociopath to not help others. But there are so many ways of helping.</p>
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<p>I agree with this statement. I’ve edited it to make it more general. So, it’s not just ‘typical Asian ECs’ that are seen as ‘the kiss of death’, but a host of other supposed no-nos in the college application process that adcomms hate because they see them so often.</p>
<p>These include stuff like, for athletes, don’t write about ‘the Big Game’, or don’t write about any game for that matter. They see too many of those essays. They know you’re an athlete and they want to see some other side of you. But what if you spend 30+ hours a week at your sport, and it is through your sport that you can explain/reveal most about who you are? Don’t adcomms use the essay to get some insight about the applicant as a person? </p>
<p>Or don’t go on summer mission trips–too many kids are doing that now and it isn’t unique enough or seems like just a rich kids excuse to vacation. Find some other EC to do. But suppose you are very active in your church, and these kinds of activities are important EC to you?</p>
<p>My feelings are there is nothing wrong with doing this so-called no-nos, you just ,as you put it, need to find a unique way to talk about them. </p>
<p>So it isn’t just Asian families that have to put up with this kind ‘conventional wisdom’ regarding ECs and the college application process.</p>
<p>Why the arbirtary rule of “3 hrs/day” for any selected EC? That seems excessive. If the kid wants to try out several things, or wants to have one primary EC and some secondary ones, there would not be enough hours in the day for them. That might make for one stressed out and not extremely well-rounded peson.</p>
<p>Can someone please tell me what this all-state violin player is all about?</p>
<p>IP I applaud your giving back I just wanted to say that it isn’t necessary to wait until you are, in fact, making a paycheck. Certainly you can, and I’m sure your child has much to do these days. However, the opportunity to give back is always present, I was highlighting this not only towards you, but also for anyone else reading.</p>
<p>sklvr, thank you for making my thoughts more widely applicable. I originally limited it only because the thread topic was Asian</p>
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<p>The light comes from understanding what college admissions are. The dark tunnel is the questionable almalgam of irrational claims of discrimination, misguided entitlement, prejudice, and the incessant need to question the integrity of judgment of people who are trusted to make the right decisions, and last but not least, to obvious quest to find newer ways to beat the system as the old mousetrap has ceased to yield the “reasonable” numbers.</p>
<p>[All</a> State Orchestra](<a href=“http://www.gmea.org/Divisions/Orchestra/All%20State%20Orchestra/AllStateOrchestra.htm]All”>http://www.gmea.org/Divisions/Orchestra/All%20State%20Orchestra/AllStateOrchestra.htm)</p>
<p>Top musicians may try out for participation in their county band/orchestra, and for their state one. Competition is not easy, and auditions can be tough.</p>