Forgot that - most places in Europe want a card with a chip - not as big a deal anymore since most US cards now have chips.
Most US cards have chip and signature NOT chip and pin. US cards still require a signature - the chip creates a unique transaction identifier. For most US cards, the PIN is used to withdraw cash from an ATM.
An unattended kiosk (train depots, tickets for venue entry, public transportation etc) will likely require a chip and PIN because there’s no one to take your signature.
http://www.transfirst.com/blog/emv-cards-chip-and-signature-vs-chip-and-pin
The difference seems small… but the difference can leave you standing at the kiosk while the train leaves.
Very helpful information and I think I finally under stand the difference between chip and sig, and chip and pin.
If they only have the pin, that is a true chip and pin with no signature, how do you use it online?
I would think online you don’t sign. I think you don’t have to type in pin, I would think. Isn’t it basically same as debit cards? When we were in Europe before we had a chip, I used my debit card when I couldn’t use my credit card. It was no big deal.
I am looking at Fidelity Visa Signature. It looks like you get 2% back only if you deposit it to your fidelity account. If you don’t have a fidelity act, is it worth opening one to get rewards? Seems a bit pain.
Here in the US, we shop online without pin or signature. I assume it is the same in other countries.
I wonder why the US decided to go chip and sig instead of chip and pin when they finally got around to embracing chip technology?
@Iglooo The Fidelity account is free and very hassle free. Another benefit to it is your ATM/debit card with the account allows for free ATM use anywhere in the world. Even if the ATM charges a fee, you will be reimbursed for that which is very handy if you travel or move a lot. My local bank does not offer that.
I’ve watched my European relatives use their chip and pin cards online. It has a double layer of protection. After entering their pin they receive an SMS with a verification code. This then needs to be entered into the online authentication process.
It does cause a problem if you don’t have your cell with you, or you change numbers (like we do) when traveling internationally. So far, we’ve not had to use the chip/pin for an online purchase.
Banks think US consumers are too stupid to use a PIN.
Well ok, it’s a little more nuanced than that, but that’s what it boils down to. Never mind that US consumers have been using debit cards and ATM cards with PINs for decades, or that the rest of world seems to be able to manage. Essentially, banks were worried on an individual basis that if they required a PIN, consumers would think their card was a PITA and switch to a non-PIN card from a different bank.
Merchants want PIN cards, since they’re the ones mainly hit by card-not-present fraud (vs fake card fraud). But it’s the banks that didn’t want to “burden” consumers with requiring a PIN since they’re not as affected by that particular type of fraud.
^^ Ha…too true. H worked for large CC processing company. Headed up division to bring newer, higher level of security, system online. It would have cut fraud by a huge percentage. Large CC company decided the fraud was cheaper than the new system and dropped the project.
So, here we are…
As of two weeks ago, Cap One’s website offered to set up a PIN for me and gave me a phone number to call when I tried to do the travel notification (which they don’t require anymore).
As per the Capital One site :
9. Is a cash advance PIN the same as a PIN for Chip & PIN credit cards?
No. Your card is on chip & signature technology and doesn’t require a PIN for transactions. Your cash advance PIN is only required for cash advances at an ATM.
So it’s still chip and sign. The pin is for cash advances.
Thank you for mentioning if H and I carry the same card and our billfold is stolen we are without any!!
I have a question on the same line. I just got a call from State Farm visa of a fraudulent credit charge at a home depot in the same state but 200 miles away. How does one charge our card at a Home Depot? a fake card? online with our number? They are sending me a new card and of course I now have to change 11 accounts that are automatically setup.
I am thinking now that I need to use one card such as the State Farm Visa card just for automatic payments like cell phones, cable, etc and get a new card for using at the grocery store, gas, etc. Would this eliminate fraud charges on the State Farm visa or am I unrealistic in this?
“How does one charge our card at a Home Depot? a fake card? online with our number?”
Could be either. I had someone charging groceries in Turkey once.
It’s an inconvenience to have your card replaced, but I wouldn’t worry about fraudulent charges too much. The CC company is on the hook for them not you, @rockymtnhigh.
I have had a separate card for online purchases for probably a dozen years now. It never leaves the house and lives next to my computer. My thinking was that the online card would get compromised and I would be grateful that the one in our wallets was safe.
Funny thing is the ones in our wallet have been changed about every 6 months - I used it in target during the target security breach, in Michael’s during that breach, in Home Depot during that breach, and so on (I seemed to always have shopped in the wrong place at the wrong time.)
The online only card was just changed due to a security breach for the first time (a hotel I booked online that had an issue).
We have autopay from our checking account which thus far we have never had hacked. When we’ve had it from CCards, the account expires and then we have to give a new number, etc., which is bothersome, as well as when there is a reissue due to fraud. For most of our accounts, H and I have different account numbers, so if one of our cards is compromised, the other card is generally fine.
My preferred card is the USAA card that provides 2.5% cash back and is chip & pin and chip & signature (preferring the latter). I haven’t tried it in Europe, since we haven’t been there since getting it. In Asia (Taiwan), we had no trouble getting all of our US credit cards accepted and none of the 3 busloads of tourists we traveled with had any problems spending their CCards either.
When we were in S Korea, similarly no one indicated they were having any problems with any ic their CCardsand folks were using a significant variety. I know that United Explorer has no foreign exchange fee, nor does USAA and the CapOne Spark business visa. The Schwab debit card refunds any ATM fees.
We had a month worth of fraud on our CapitalOne card that neither we nor they caught right away. It started almost the day after we got our previous statement. There were dozens of charges to Waffle House, Golden Corral, gas stations, Papa Johns pizza in Tampa. They also bought auto insurance with the card! CapitalOne flagged one a Burger King charge and sent an email. That’s how it was first detected, but after many, many charges that completely did not fit our card use pattern or location. Then CapitalOne cancelled the wrong card (they issue different numbers to different family members) ugh. It was a mess. We think it all started after we bought airline tickets online on a South American airline with a Florida office. I think there was a crooked employee there.
@LBowie , that is the part I don’t get. This appears that a fake card was made or how else could you charge at those places. If the crooks are able to make fake chips or strips, etc then really what can you do?
^After several compromised card incidents, that’s what we do. One card has all the auto payments and never leaves the house or gets used online.