<p>LACalum, I surprised by what you said. It doesn’t make sense. Isn’t there an interview process with school officials and/or alumni? Part of the interview process is showing interest, being able to speak intelligently about Carleton, and writing a thank you note. Is the interview a negligible part of the admission decision?</p>
<p>I have no doubt that Carleton admissions officials read essays carefully and there are things you could write that would get you application thrown out in seconds no matter how good your qualifications are. The admissions officials no doubt play these “red flags staments” very close to the chest. As an alumni there are things I’d read in an essay that would make me just know that this excellent student is a terrible fit.</p>
<p>Carleton has dramatically improved its freshmen retention ratio over the years. I’m sure it put loads of effort into this. Essays are a prime place to do this. I could venture guesses about what they are looking for in essays, but I don’t know how helpful that would be.</p>
<p>Let me clarify jack63. First of all, yes, Carleton does have an interview process. However, as an alumni volunteer I can also tell you that it plays a pretty minimal role in the admissions process (the admissions staff will tell you the same about their on-campus interviews) and is primarily used as a way for students to learn more about Carleton and find out if it is a good fit for them (i.e. it is more a recruitment tool than an assessment tool). </p>
<p>And yes, I’m sure you are correct that the admissions office pays close attention to “red flags” in the essay or elsewhere in the application. And note that I never claimed Carleton doesn’t consider “fit,” as I’m quite certain they do. HOWEVER, “fit” and “demonstrated interest” are not at all the same thing. A student who has never seen the campus or talked to an alumnus can be a better fit than one who visits twice and emails 3 different admissions counselors. </p>
<p>Does demonstrating the qualities that make you a good match for Carleton (through your essay, recs, etc) improve your chance for admission? I certainly expect so. But does visiting improve your chances? Does writing a thank you note improve your chances? According to the admissions staff, the answer is no. And while this seems surprising, it makes sense to me given Carleton’s (and most colleges’) desire to have a geographically and socioeconomically diverse student body. Giving students who visit an advantage would mean favoring students with greater means or who live near the school. Putting a great deal of weight in “demonstrated interest” would favor those students who attend private schools and get a great deal of information and advice from their counselors (and put many 1st generation students, or students who don’t have the same access to this type of counseling and resources at a disadvantage).</p>
<p>My son can serve as a data point for LACalum’s case: he didn’t visit and didn’t interview and was accepted. I think “fit,” whatever the admissions office deems that to be, is the key. As I read more about Carleton, I was struck by how perfect it seemed to be for my son. And something in his application–essay, short answers, whatever–convinced the adcom that he’d fit in and add to his class at Carleton.</p>
<p>OP, you’re right about 31 being an excellent score, but this is sort of a hothouse environment where people are focused on the top colleges in the country. So, yes, it’s a great score, but, no, people aren’t overreacting when they suggest a second sitting. I completely understand your feelings, though. My son took both the SAT and the ACT only once. He really didn’t want college admissions to eat up his entire existence for his junior and senior years in HS. </p>
<p>As others have pointed out, the waitlist threads illustrate that test scores and GPAs don’t predict admission. Showing interest can’t hurt (unless you’re a pest about it).</p>
<p>Given reasonable stats (and those depend on your high school); I think the single most important factor could be intellectual curiosity. Surveys of students show that as being an unusual feature of Carls. Kids go to some colleges to prepare for a career, or have new experiences, or play sports. Carls love learning about stuff and talking about it.</p>
<p>For the OP, if very few people you know have 31, then you’re probably not at a high school that tends to send lots of kids to top LACs and Ivies. Being a stand-out at your school will be a big help. Scores are, to some extent, relative and if a 31 and 4.0 puts you at the top of your class, colleges like Carleton will recognize that as a significant achievement.<br>
Good luck - and have fun this summer.</p>
<p>To Youdon’tsay-
The 25th to 75th percentile of Carleton is 28-32, and a 31 in the top 2% in the NATION.</p>
<p>To some that advise taking it a second time-
This was my second time taking the ACT. The first time I got a 27, and the second time I got a 31. I know, quite a jump, huh? I was very nervous my first time. Nonetheless, I highly doubt I will be able to get it up much higher.</p>
<p>I spent a lot of time worrying about getting my score up in the 30s this past winter and early spring, so I am not all too enthused about taking the ACT once again.</p>
<p>To those who questioned the rigor of my courses-
My sophomore and freshman year, I did not take a load of advanced courses, but I did take a lot of math courses and loaded up on foreign language courses. The math courses that I took were advanced, however. This year, I am taking AP Calculus, AP Biology, and AP Psychology. I also took an independent study in Spanish. Next year, I plan on taking AP Statistics, AP Literature, PSEO Chemistry, and I will possibly take in independent study in AP Language (English course). My weighted GPA is a 4.1</p>
<p>You’ll love the summer science program. It’s the launch year, and the leaders are full-time faculty members, not adjuncts or part-timers. I suspect that if the faculty at the SSI like you, that might make a difference in admissions, I suspect.</p>
<p>I think that too many people possibly focus on that ONE and only dream school, only to be crushed by whatever vaguearies of the admissions process decree that this is not to be. My sagely parental advice is that you need to look for and apply to a variety of schools where you could be reasonably happy. Your college choice really is not your only destiny set in stone somewhere. Much of college success actually is determined by what you put into it. (I teach at …GASP…a community college and have seen several former students go onto successes that equal or exceed Carleton or even Harvard alumni.)
Something else to think about is that although Carleton is a really great school, at Carleton and those like it, your 31 ACT (or even your 36 ACT) will not grant you great distinction or financial gain. The same son who was refused by Carleton was offered admission and terrific merit aid by several schools that are lesser ranked, by virtue of that 32. After visiting some of these, I really believe that he will be just as happy as (and wealthier than) his brother at Carleton. Truth be told, a few of these seem a bit more diligent in their advising, off campus studies and internship programs.
In short, don’t box yourself in mentally to only one school. Keep your options open and your mind clear.</p>
<p>To get into Carleton, it’s best to have an interest in what the College is interested in: creativity, quantitative inquiry, visual inquiry, interdisciplinary science (including data modeling), interdisciplinary environmental studies. These initiatives cut across the disciplines. And now there is a humanities initiative on campus that is going to have a good effect as well. Display in your application, more than anything, an overall passion for learning. </p>
<p>My son got a 31 on his ACT and got accepted to Yale, which he applied to because he liked its info letter. He got rejected at Bowdoin. Go figure. The best thing to do is to really want to go to a college because you like its values. The college knows a good match when it sees one.</p>
<p>I guess I am now leaning toward taking my ACT a third time. Do you think I will be able to improve it by much? The first time I took it I got a 27, and the second time a 31. I have a feeling that the highest I can get it would be to a 32. It would be nice if I could get it to a 33. Does anyone know from experience how much I could take another leap in my score?</p>
<p>That’s interesting to know MJ. I guess what I should do is apply to as many well respected and interesting colleges as I can (within my budget); therefore, there will be a chance that one will accept me… whether it be Carleton or not.</p>
<p>I need advice, Carleton is a LAC, and they pay as much attention to your recs and essays as they do to stats. Bad stats are likely to keep you out (in most of the cases), good stats won’t necessarily get you in. Your ACT is good, I am assuming GPA corresponds to your score, too. Pay attention to the essays and just presenting yourself in general - it matters a lot.</p>
<p>Okay. I was thinking that I would probably have to take two subject tests. I was thinking of taking Math 2 and Bio E. I am taking Physics and Chem next year, I wouldn’t do well in the social studies, and I am not too sure about English. Then, are those two a good choice?</p>
<p>I’m sorry for all of these questions, I am sort of stressed out right now. I didn’t realize that a lot of colleges wanted subject tests. My parents are not the type that push me, and they are not entirely knowledgeable on applying to college. It’s all been off my motivation and initiative to look into things.</p>
<p>I<em>Need</em>Advice - Carleton does not require SAT IIs although they are recommended. Since they aren’t recommended, they’ll probably only help your credentials. That said, if you’ll be applying to a variety of schools, others may require 2 or 3.</p>
<p>LACalum,…refering to your post a few days ago… It’s fair that Carleton does not give students who have the means to visit and interview on campus an edge in admission. I’m sure you are right on this, however I did mention there are alumni interviews. This way a student in Hawaii can interview without flying to Carleton. While these interviews may be a minimal part of the admission decision, my understanding was that as an alumni you write appraisel of the student and this is included in the student’s admission file. I’m sure there are 100 or so cases every year where an admission decision is a tough call and is based on some pretty minimal differences between students. In my opinion it would be foolish not to show interest in Carleton and take the interview seriously.</p>
<p>Of course. I think you should certainly take every interview seriously regardless of how much weight it carries. And you certainly don’t want to do anything that would raise red flags. But I still stand by my assertion that it would be a VERY small number of cases that would be decided due to “demonstrated interest” at Carleton. Not interviewing or visiting campus won’t keep you out, and visiting three times and writing 6 thank-you notes won’t get you in. Focus on showing you are a good fit (intellectually curious, passionate, non-competitive) rather than on declaring your love for Carleton.</p>
<p>My son was accepted to Carleton in 06 with no SAT IIs. My other son applied to a pretty wide variety of LACs this year and was accepted to most of these without SAT IIs. (We are very rural so our kids would have to travel at least 200 miles each way to find a testing location I don’t think the lack of SAT II’s kept him out of anywhere.) I would say take them if they are available to you. If you are really displeased with the results you don’t have to submit them.<br>
Something good to start thinking about and cultivating are the teachers who you will ask for reference letters. This is important for scholarship programs too. Think of those who know you well and who also take the time to write well. I’ve reviewed scholarship applications for several small foundations/organizations and it surprised me how the quality of those reference letters varied even when the teachers really liked a student.
Good luck!</p>