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</p>
<p>I’m not surprised to hear that, I could tell it from your writing, I love it.</p>
<p>If you can’t be #1, then you won’t be valedictorian. That’s about it.</p>
<p>I am not fixated on Yale, I am not whining, I don’t want to be valedictorian, and I know that going to a top university is not the only way to success. I could have posted this in any forum, I just happened to choose Yale. It is only one of many colleges I would like to attend. I am also not trying to whine or rant, I am trying to get across a point that not many are grasping. The thread title implies not school ranking but just a general idea of being number 1. I don’t care for the title of valedictorian. </p>
<p>Here is how I can prove to you that I want to go to a place like HYPSM simply because I want to, and not because I think it is the only way to success. I want to be a Physician. Here is how to become a Physician:
- Graduate from high school and go to the nearest state school with tons of scholarship money, barely paying anything
- Graduate with a 4.0 from the classes that are probably easier than a class from a well-known college, study for MCAT, make a subpar score
- Get accepted to nearest state med school, pay very little and graduate with little debt
- Graduate, go to nearest residency for your chosen specialty
- You now get to practice as a Physician</p>
<p>Here is also how to become a Physician:
- Make your high school years as hellish as you can, somehow get highest grades possible in extremely rigorous coursework, be very involved in your community and a sport, be highly involved in your chosen extracurriculars, study all summer for PSAT, make national merit, study all summer long for SAT, get a score from 2200-2400, get very close to teachers for good recommendations, write a million essays, all of them have to be extremely great</p>
<p>Here is a two-way road, choose your path
2a. Get rejected from every school you apply to, go to nearest state school
2b. Get accepted into at least one reach</p>
<p>Let’s assume 2b. </p>
<ol>
<li>Maintain great grades in extremely hard classes, graduate without a 4.0 and over 100k in debt</li>
<li>Get a great MCAT score from all of those years of extremely hard classes, make it into a top private med school OR go to nearest state med school
(Assume the former)</li>
<li>Graduate with over a quarter of a million dollars of debt</li>
<li>Get accepted to a prestigious residency OR not
(Once again the former)</li>
<li>You are now able to practice as a Physician</li>
</ol>
<p>The first way seems a lot easier, right? Also, in the end, one MD is no different from the other, both doctors will be paid the same amount, both will be an equal amount of successful. So why would I want to put myself through the latter path? Because I want to.</p>
<p>I actually think I have understood all along what your are trying to say and I agree with it. Based on the kids who I have seen who are consistently rejected it is too hard to get into schools like Yale anymore. But it’s hopeless to try to say that on these forums because then you get overwhelmed with students who say “I am just Joe Student and I got into Yale. Anyone can get in, you just need to apply.” I don’t know anything about the person who posted this, I don’t know if they are telling the truth or not. But based on what I have seen if they really are just a regular student and they got into Yale then they got lucky, because most of the time regular students won’t get into Yale.</p>
<p>I did not say I’m a regular student – I said I was a regular top student. I’m in the top 10% of my class and I get all As. However, I did not have a perfect or close to perfect SAT score and I know that there are plenty of Yale applicants just like me who got rejected. What I meant was that I don’t think anything distinguishes me from other TOP students applying to Yale. And I did not say anyone can get in and they all need to do is apply. I said that you never know what could happen, so try your best on the application and know that you have a chance.</p>
<p>I agree with your analysis, but my question is: who do you think has the more fulfilling journey?</p>
<p>so…what part of my application did you pick out for the “special hook” part. Seriously, I know I got in for things which aren’t as easily quatifiable as grades and test scores. No, mine weren’t shabby. They got me poast the first round, but again, 70% of people who apply get past the first round, the challenge is sataying in after that. So what do you want to do, you spend every post ranting about how hard it is to get into Yale, is that the only reason you want to go? You look good “exposing” everyone who tries to say something positive by bringing up how great their stats are, (their stats are good, what else do you expect from Yale?) but you ignore the evidence that it’s possibloe to get in w/o being #1. Yale doesn’t wanht valedictorians w/ 2400’s, they want PEOPLE. What do YOU want?</p>
<p>“Make your high school years as hellish as you can, somehow get highest grades possible in extremely rigorous coursework, be very involved in your community and a sport, be highly involved in your chosen extracurriculars, study all summer for PSAT, make national merit, study all summer long for SAT, get a score from 2200-2400, get very close to teachers for good recommendations, write a million essays, all of them have to be extremely great”</p>
<p>My high school years were very fun.</p>
<p>I got a 4.0 in the most rigorous courseload available at my school.</p>
<p>I played two varsity sports and love my community.</p>
<p>I started a club, was President of another, and earned a spot in another selective and prestigious club (outside of school)</p>
<p>I was a National Merit Finalist without studying “all summer.” Two other students at my school of 800 also were Finalists and didn’t spend much time studying (although that’s probably an aberration).</p>
<p>I took three SAT practice tests and took the test twice, the first time getting a little under 2300 and the next time a little over.</p>
<p>I didn’t see “getting close to teachers” as a chore.</p>
<p>I wrote three essays to apply to six schools.</p>
<p>I was accepted to Yale SCEA</p>
<p>The bottom line is that you have a bizarre view of what getting into an Ivy means. If you like to do what you have to do to get into an Ivy, then do it. If you don’t like to do it, then don’t do it and stop whining about it–calling it “hellish” to go through with. I didn’t post this stuff to rub it in your face, my point is that most unhooked applicants you’ll find at Yale did all this stuff–and enjoyed it. The more you cry about all the terrible things people at Yale make kids go through to get into their school, the more I think you’re going to be unhappy there.</p>
<p>You should try hard in school and only do ECs that you enjoy. If you’re ever saying “wow, I’m going through with this torture but at least I’ll be Ivy League” my guess is that you’ll eventually either end up unhappy at an Ivy or you’ll not be able to take advantage of the benefits of going to an Ivy.</p>
<p><em>sigh</em> I’ve been trying to figure out why the differing points of view on this thread. The only think I can conclude is what Eliana said</p>
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</p>
<p>I think the perspective is different for the students who were admitted and the students who weren’t, and there isn’t a whole lot in the area of qualifications that separates the two.</p>
<p>I’m not young, thirty years ago I was applying to colleges. Back then it was enough to get into a school like Yale if you were at the top of your class, had good test scores and were good at one EC. I’m not kidding, if you had those things in all likelihood you would be admitted to a school like Yale. Probably not 100%, but in all likelehood. I remember some of the students who were to Stanford and Harvard. They really weren’t that remarkable, just the straight As, decent test scores and something else going for them.</p>
<p>It isn’t like that anymore. You can now be that kind of student and not get into any top schools and not any the rung down from them either. I know the students and I’ve seen what there admission results are like and it is a totally new ball game these days. It’s frustrating for those of us who know what kind of stellar students our kids are and then their admission results don’t reflect that.</p>
<p>I think there is a different perspective for those who get in and those who don’t. I apologize to anyone I have offended with my posts on this thread.</p>
<p>MSauce said everything I wanted to say.</p>
<p>second that</p>
<p>My expected response from SheenR is going to be "I’m not complaining. Doing these things COULD be fun for me…I’m not crying about anything!</p>
<p>“I WANT to do all the hard things. They’re just so hard! I don’t like them. I like them. But I don’t want to do them.”</p>
<p>Note to people planning on posting in this thread: please read through before jumping to the last page and posting. I have already clarified many times that I do not want to be valedictorian and that I know you don’t absolutely HAVE TO BE valedictorian to get into NOT JUST YALE but ANY SCHOOL OF IT’S CALIBER. I put such emphasis because people still aren’t understanding that there is no existing fixation on Yale. </p>
<p>MSauce, </p>
<p>I’m not complaining. Doing these things COULD be fun for me…I’m not crying about anything!</p>
<p>I WANT to do all the hard things. They’re just so hard! I don’t like them. I like them. But I don’t want to do them.</p>
<p>^Lol. I’m glad you’ve cheered up :).</p>
<p>And I’m also so glad that I didn’t know anything about college admission when I was a freshman.</p>
<p>so…you don’t really care about Yale, you just want to get in any school of that caliber…
What you really seem to want is the prestige, the “Ha I prooved I can do it, righr?” See, thing is, while that is in itself laudable, it can’t be everything. Why Yale? btw, it IS on the Yale supplement. I’m trying to understand what you want out of this thread you created. Do you want to have the “It’s impossible to get in an Ivy League” confirmed? Yeah, a lot of qualified people are rejected, but you have to play to win. I didn’t think I’d get in when I applied, I just knew that I owed it to mself to apply since I had a shot. And no, I didn’t kill myself to get into college, I (some would say stupidly) did everything the way it was “saupposed” to be done. Study? Sure. I almost never stayed up past midnight. EC’s? I did what I really enjoyed doing, if they didn’t help for college I might have not worked quite as hard but I passed up things that would have padded my resume to make time for what I wanhted to do as well. Grades? I see people cheating in my classes all the time, I don’t. Sometimes my grades are worse than their’s. What gives? Who cares? What are you looking for here?</p>
<p>“Now, I say you to, what if I am not number 1?”</p>
<p>“Please, do not try to deny that people other than only the best get into Yale.”</p>
<p>“not number 1” = not “the best”
Looks like you answered your own question and then left no room for argument.</p>
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</p>
<p>Says who?! What a doctor gets paid is highly variable. There is no “standard” physician salary. I know some wonderful doctors who don’t make as much money as my real estate broker/investor husband (state school educated, not even the flagship by the way). What a doctor makes can depend on his specialty, his talent at that specialty, his reputation, the area of the country where he practices, where he did his residency and fellowship, and on and on. Doctors within the same specialty in the same city can have variable salaries. Have poor peer relations and you do not get patient referrals. Work for THE prestigious practice and you have more patients calling than you have time to see. Work in a field that doesn’t have to take insurance and you are talking big money. Well known in your field-well, you get asked all over the country to give speeches and get all the financial benefits that entails. Work as a doctor in a rural setting with an indigent patient population and good luck getting even close to the same pay as another doctor working in the big city with affluent clients. </p>
<p>It’s possible to strictly go the state school route and become a wildly successful doctor, and it’s possible to have the most prestigious pedigree on the planet and barely eke out a good living, depending on a variety of factors. Just getting the MD behind your name guarantees absolutely nothing. Let’s face it, though, the Harvard medical school grad will likely have an edge getting his foot into the door of the big prestigious practice. So your premise is somewhat flawed.</p>
<p>This might be a silly response, but can you explain what “OP” stands for?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>OP means “Original Poster” or “Opening Poster”.</p>
<p>Thirding MSauce. Although I only wrote two essays to get into eight schools, and I never took an SAT practice test. </p>
<p>Why on earth do you assume that (hypothetically) you’ll get either get rejected everywhere or get into a reach? Match schools are matches for a reason. Futhermore, “state school” is not a death sentence. Assuming that classes will be easy or that you’ll get a subpar MCAT is ridiculous. </p>
<p>You also assume that going to a top school will require going into debt. It doesn’t. Period. </p>
<p>Finally,
"I WANT to do all the hard things. They’re just so hard! I don’t like them. I like them. But I don’t want to do them. "</p>
<p>If you like them, they’re not hard. And if they’re hard, you’re probably doing the wrong things or the right things the wrong way and you won’t like them.</p>