If you qualify for SS, and get your associates for free, you can transfer, but your tuition at the 4 year college isn’t free.
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Oh, it’s only 5 semesters
I just talked to my mom about safety’s and I told her Emory wasn’t a safety and stuff and I said my stats aren’t good and she said you never know. I think she’s in denial because she thinks the chance wonder stories are in the norm. I convinced her abt Spelman and smith college; hypothetically even if I got a 1500 these schools still aren’t likely
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Is there a college counselor at your HS who can educate your mom?
I think the YouTube/quora counselors are probs more educated in her eyes. I think it’s genuinely because she’s surrounded by superhumans who’ve gotten into these schools coupled by the fact she’s entitled. Whether she likes it or not I’m just not as mentally strong
The landscape of college admissions has changed dramatically from whenever the “superhumans” she is surrounded by attended. You have not mentioned your dad much. Can you talk to him about this?
I hate him. I think he doesn’t care as much (about Ivies) but does want me to achieve. I just don’t talk to him because he’ll say something sexist or stupid. I think the difference between the two is classes. He grew up poor but my mom was upper class
Those people are fairly recent. They just go to magnet schools and their parents don’t harrass them in other areas. Like the manipulation my mom has over my life is partly why I’ve broken down. I think I’d be much better if I had a normal family dynamic
Please consider finding out if your school offers college planning events for the students and families and focus on what you can do, not what you can’t. You will be in a better place if you try to look at things from a more positive, solution focused perspective. Do you attend a “brick and mortar” HS or a home-based/on line school?
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I don’t want to go to ivies and I’ve told her this. She’s making me apply to all these places and I like, I just can’t say no to her. And she knows I’m stupider than my siblings.
First choice Europe for me personally, after that I’d want to go to a women’s college or something and just vibe. I spent too much of my life stressing and worrying and I don’t want that genuinely. Maybe medecine is a bad idea I don’t know becuase I’ll obviously stress
I told her I was burnt out and she said we can do college visits, so I guess that’s the start of mental health.
She thinks I developed health issues due to stress like my stomach would hurt a lot whenever I would eat and I would throw up, so she kinda feels guilty I don’t know
Having the guidance counselor talk to the mother I think is a very good idea.
Sometimes people in a position of authority (such as a guidance counselor) can say the exact same thing that a student can say, but be taken more seriously. The parent might ignore it when the student says it, but listen when the guidance counselor says the same thing. @rosechild you might want to get a word ahead of time to your guidance counselor and arrange to have them talk some sense to your mother.
This is certainly my view on the issue. I might be slightly skewed since I have a daughter who is part way through getting a DVM (if all goes well she will be a doctor in 18 months, but her patients will all be large and furry and walk on four legs). The absolute determination that she has towards being a large animal vet is probably the most important quality that allows her to get through the 8 years of university and the long hours of study. I have watched while this determination and the associated hard work has allowed her to gradually get stronger and stronger in her studies. This is a tough path. You really have to be driven to do it, and I am pretty sure that this is just as true for a potential MD compared to a potential DVM.
Also exactly correct. All premed students need a plan B. This might be particularly true for a premed student who does not seem to be all that certain about medical school.
This also sounds like a good thing to consider.
To me it is sounding like one big advantage of U.Conn over Rutgers is just that it is further from New Jersey, and therefore would be more difficult for a parent from New Jersey to visit regularly. UVM of course has this same advantage but even more so. UVM is also a very good university in a very attractive location. Premed there is quite good and there is a hospital near or on campus. The premed classes at UVM will also have some strong pre-vet students (the required classes are the same and UVM is very good for pre-vet).
@rosechild A few wild and crazy thoughts have popped into my mind, but I am not sure if any of them make any sense for you.
One wild thought is “Canada”. It is closer than Europe and generally relatively safe and might make your mother less nervous. The education system in Canada is also relatively similar to the US. For example changing majors is relatively common in Canada. It is however far enough from New Jersey to discourage frequent visits. The biggest and best known universities in Canada, particularly McGill and Toronto, are famous for grade deflation and are therefore probably a bad choice for a premed student. However, there are other options. Mount Allison is the top ranked “small primarily undergraduate” university in Canada, and is very good. One odd fact is that the first gay marriage that was eventually declared legal and valid in any western country was performed in Canada by a Mount Allison graduate (there is a bit of a story here that I could repeat if asked). Acadia in Nova Scotia is similarly very good. Both of these are in nice but small towns. Queen’s, McMaster, Calgary, Alberta, and UBC are similarly very good, and are generally larger and in somewhat larger cities. Because the US and Canada share a system for accrediting medical schools, you can get a bachelor’s in one country and an MD in the other (but getting an MD in Canada is very tough unless you are a Canadian citizen or permanent resident).
Another wild thought comes from the apparent desire to become independent from your mother on a reasonable time scale, such as by the time that you get your bachelor’s degree. I wonder whether you are good at mathematics, and if so whether something like computer science would be a good major. The point is that a person with a bachelor’s degree in computer science can have a good career without needing any additional education.
Even in the “medical, biology” sort of area another thought comes to mind. One daughter majored in biology. I have consistently heard that people with just a bachelor’s degree in biology have a tough time getting a job. Her experience was pretty much the opposite. The issue appears to be that as an undergraduate student at one point due to a change in major she needed to take 4 lab courses at the same time (which at first glance seems like a bad idea). She discovered that she loved working in a laboratory and is good at it. She then pretty much spent as much time in a lab as possible for the rest of her bachelor’s degree, including getting involved in cancer research. Then she graduated and took a job working in a lab doing medical research. Basically while her premed friends were off getting medical experience, she was in a lab growing cancer cells, which she is still doing today. This suggests an option that might be an alternative to medical school, and that can get you self sufficient and on your own more quickly.
Once you are both 21 years old and financially self sufficient there will be a limit to what you mother can do in her attempt to run your life.
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Yes, this sounds stress related. In the US our high school students are in general under way too much stress, and it sounds like your mother is making things worse.
I am wondering whether this will be better when you are in university and away from home. I do not know how to predict this.
I wouldn’t be that pessimistic. (I mean, yes, they definitely aren’t safeties, if that’s what you mean by “likely,” but I don’t think they’re out of reach either.) The median GPA for accepted students at Spelman is 3.88, and that’s typically weighted; you said your weighted GPA was a 4.02. Your SAT is in the top 25% of admitted students at Spelman. Admissions are holistic and there’s no guarantee, but there’s no reason you need a 1500 to get in there. In fact, a majority of their applicants are applying test-optional, and you’re still well above average even among those who choose to submit a score.
At Smith, median SAT is 1415, so you’d probably want to apply test-optional unless you raise your score, but your GPA is right around their median, so you’d certainly be in the running.
Do you think it’ll be possible to visit these schools?
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I def dont want my mom seeing smith. From what I heard the lgbt culture there is vibrant. But that makes me feel better. I’ll try and raise my score by 150 points
Hopefully she’ll get mad and cut me off or vice versa. Our interest will never align. I’m not being pessimistic I just know her
This is very detailed and I appreciate you taking the time to write this all out. She doesn’t really like Canada and abroad scares her. I might to a career that’ll be easily transferred unlike medicine. Congrats to your daughter. I’ll probs do something like marketing or some niche language thing or like neuroscience I don’t know
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Which is better:
School A: 5-10% undergrad accpeptance rate. 1400-1500 Average SAT. 70-90+% med school acceptance (usually a minimum GPA or MCAT, or just those who are recommended by an advisory board)
School B: 35-75% undergrad acceptance rate. 1250-1350 average SAT. 70-90+% med school acceptance (often with no, or lower GPA extra qualifiers).
It depends. First, undergraduate schools med school acceptance data is almost never apple to apple and often fudged. I’m not getting into that too deep here. Also not going to get into WHICH med schools, because while important that would require a comparison of every school and the range of students at them and I’m already going to be too wordy.
Getting over the “prestige” mindset is difficult, but for those looking to eventually go to med school it is way down the list of important factors. More important is what do you need to succeed, and who offers it that you can get access too (grades and $$). If you are capable of a 510-520 on the MCAT, you will probably get there at any good school:
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Is the school sized so that YOU have a chance to succeed and access to actual guidance? When you see impressive research or similar opportunities, how available are they really to the average student or just the top 1%? One of DS’s initial interests was the big (23K students) top state school. We had a call with the person in charge of their pre-professional (pre-med, pharm, vet., etc.) advising. They made it clear about the type of experience successful pre-med applicants need, but also made it clear that they can’t help all of the 200-ish students that apply to DO or MD schools from there each year find the right experiences. And that’s just the 200-ish that apply, forget about the ones who fall out or don’t get recommendations from the college. Of those 200-ish students applying, less the 100 get accepted. He quickly discovered he would prefer smaller schools (3-6K students), where it was clear that they viewed every student interested in “pre-med” as deserving of support and guidance. Most of schools only have 10-30 MD/DO school applicants a year, but year to year 70-100% of them get accepted and often to top med schools. Most “prestige” schools are not big schools, but some do have big “pre-med” programs with 200-ish med school applicants a year.
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Is the school going to try to “weed you out” or are they going to help you find where you best fit? The above was more about school size. This is more about “prestige” schools (Either Ivy’s, Vandy, etc. or schools known for attached medical schools, think JHU, CWRU, etc.) vs. more “average” LAC schools that happen to have very good biology/chem/“pre-med” departments. First off, at a prestige school, the student applying for “pre-med” is just another high stat among all the other very high stats applying to the school in general. My DS was waitlisted at one “prestige” school, and the waitlist letter said he would be awarded $65K (about 75% of cost of attendance) merit scholarship IF a spot opened up and he made it in off the waitlist. Just seems crazy to me, but this is emblematic of the pressure at such schools. With so many qualified candidates that they are turning away, many who “deserve” merit to attract them, it is no wonder some of the schools become known for “weeding out” or even grade deflation. “Prestige” reputations are secure, and if some students don’t make it or need to change majors, that only re-enforces their elite status. And, if a person falls out or the advisory board doesn’t recommend them, then they don’t typically get counted against their med school acceptance stats. Additionally, while a school like CWRU may have enough research and connections to support 200-ish pre-med students, other “prestige” schools do not. Meanwhile, at a more “typical” LAC the average applicant to the school overall is often in the 1200s, making acceptance and merit scholarships more likely for those interested in “pre-med”. Also, they have a vested interest in seeing each student succeed, and usually enough research and connections to easily provide (and often require) opportunities to each of the 10-30 pre-med students. While these type of schools will also have some students naturally fall out of a “pre-med” track, support and accessibility to find a new path is often better.
Some schools that fit what I discuss above that we actually looked into and were impressed with or I have routinely heard good things about in no particular order:
Juniata College
Rhodes
Centre College
Kenyon
Lipscomb
Furman
Wofford
George Washington
Saint Louis
I’m sure there are probably dozens of others out there, and knowing what other factors are important could help isolate/find them.
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My understanding from this thread is that the student doesn’t really want to go to med school, but it’s the only pathway her mother will support.
OP— you can be “premed” with any major you like. Premed is a list of required courses but is usually not an actual major at most colleges. And most kids who want to be pre-med change their minds once they are in college and either find something that interests them a lot more, or they realize that the premed workload takes more
time and effort than they want to give.
So I would not worry too much about the premed designation. You can major on whatever you want and start down the premed path if that’s necessary for parents to allow you to attend college, and then hopefully pivot to something you prefer once you are enrolled.
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As the pre-health advisor at the school my DS selected told all the “pre-med” students, there are something like 20 different “medical” things you can do of which medical school is only one. Many students decide one of those other paths along the way, and you don’t have to decide now. Since there is no “pre med” major (some even major in business or finance), you can explore those or even non-health options while you decide what you want to do. The next step is selecting a school though, and maybe my thoughts help broaden what your mom will consider even if you ultimately don’t choose med school.
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Doesnt college literally not matter for like the majority of careers. Its not like I want to treat the president of the United States. I’ll look at all these schools tysm. I told my mom no to Johns Hopkins because I heard of the cut throat weed out
Also congrats on ur daughter. I’ll look at these schools