<p>People don’t even know the ivies here. They have never heard of Brown, most certainly NEVER Penn (“PENN STATE?!”). My friend got into Davidson ED and she said it’s an ivy league, so we had an hour long argument over it. She still didn’t believe it and dismissed wikipedia as proof.</p>
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That really annoys me, too. I’m applying to Brown and find absolutely NOTHING appealing about say, Dartmouth or Columbia (although the former is more starkly contrasting.)</p>
<p>Calmom, I had much the same problem when I was at college. I was in the last class that applied to Radcliffe and the first to graduate from Harvard. We were even more a part of Harvard than Barnard is however.</p>
<p>OP, I use it correctly and would never think of using Ivy to describe anything but an official member. I don’t use “Public Ivy” or “Little Ivy” or “New Ivy” any of the other “wannabe” marketing language. But I have been known to use HYPSDMC. ;)</p>
<p>Now Barnard (I am anxiously waiting their decision on my niece as we speak) is a special case indeed. They are a part of Columbia U. but clearly have their own identity.</p>
<p>I use it to mean the “real 8” but cheerfully admit that it’s only because I’ve just read this thread that I can name all 8 without cheating.</p>
<p>Barnard gets a Columbia diploma as all Columbia University students do. It will have “Barnard College” on it as well where Columbia College students will have “Columbia College” on it and as Fu students will have that indicated, and other divisions will have their names on the diploma, but it will all be under the umbrella of Columbia University.</p>
<p>The technical definition is the athletic league. The Ivy League is a term not just limited to those colleges. There are high schools who have traditionally, and continue to call their sports league the Ivy league. So yes, Barnard is in the Ivy League as the students play in that league. But in the context of colleges, it is the 8 schools. </p>
<p>I know some Harvard graduates who refer to their alma mater as Harvard College, rather than university. Strictly speaking, many universities have many divisions, including Harvard, that serve as a main umbrella but are not the school that is so well known. Though Radcliffe is fully integrated into Harvard College, unlike Barnard, Harvard does have other divisions that are not so integrated, including the “night school”.</p>
<p>It’s an intercollegiate sports conference which is made up of 8 specific schools. No one adds colleges to the Big 10 or the SEC because they have “similar characteristics”.</p>
<p>It’s the name of a sports league that includes eight colleges and universities in the Northeastern United States. Nothing more, nothing less.</p>
<p>Some of the schools in this league have much in common with one another. Others defy the stereotype. </p>
<p>As a Cornell alumna and Cornell parent, I find it irritating when I see posts on this board that say things like, “Cornell doesn’t belong in the Ivy League. How can you have an Ivy League school where you can major in agriculture or hotel administration?”</p>
<p>The way you can have an Ivy League school that offers those majors is simply because that university belongs to the same sports league as the others. The fact that Cornell was founded much later than the other colleges in the Ivy League and with a different educational philosophy is irrelevant. </p>
<p>Ivy League is not a synonym for “most selective colleges in the country.” There are colleges that are more difficult to get into than some of the Ivy League schools. MIT and Stanford are the obvious examples. Nor is it a synonym for “best colleges in the country.” I don’t think anyone would claim that all of best colleges in the country are in the Northeast, and I would not argue that even within the Northeast, all of the best colleges are in the Ivy League (it would be hard to create a “best colleges in the Northeast” list that did not include MIT, Swarthmore, Amherst, and Williams).</p>
<p>The Ivy League is simply a sports league. That’s all.</p>
<p>Technically speaking, it is simply a sports league, but as with many things you need to take into account the context in which the term is used. My bet is that term “ivy” in terms of college does not refer to the plants growing on the wall. There are many different ways the term is used and it does not always mean the 8 specific schools.</p>
<p>It doesn’t really matter what the term “Ivy Leave” REALLY means. The term has obtained a reputation as being one of the elites; which the 8 original are part of. I personally mean the 8 when I use the term “Ivy League”. However, when the discussion is about prestige, high quality, low admittance, career making, etc… then I’ve made reference to “West coast Ivy”; usually meaning Stanford or other such prestigious schools not on the easter part of the U.S.; that have all the same attributes and benefits of the traditional Ivy League School (Including price most times). </p>
<p>Unfortunately; there’s too many labels for the schools one attends. Ivy League usually refers to the schools the EVERYONE SHOULD be trying to attend. It’s supposedly the BEST. In contrast; “Public” or “University of XXX” are usually looked down on when compared to the Ivy League school. With “Private” in the middle. The truth is; there’s absolutely no TRUTH to this thinking at all. Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Penn, Princeton and Yale are not better schools because they are “Ivy League”. And they aren’t Ivy League because they are better schools. The term is relatively recent, and the schools just happen to be one of the original colonial period schools. (most of them). But as for them being better; that is totally up to what you want to do with your life. If you’re into engineering and the hard sciences, no one is ever going to try and argue that an “Ivy League” is better than MIT, CalTech, NJTech. If they were to argue that, they are rationalizing and naive. Or if you’re looking for business, to not include Stanford, MIT, Northwestern, or some others is pompous. Or if into Agriculture, most of the “Ivy league” can’t even compare. Veterinarian; you can’t forget CSU in Ft. Collins. And research; if that’s important; some of the best research programs come from schools like Michigan State. And we haven’t even talked about the Liberal Arts. You then should be looking at Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore, etc… </p>
<p>The Ivy League just happens to be some of the oldest colleges. But oldest isn’t always better. Depends on what you want to study and do with your life. And yes, the Ivy Leagues can be the BEST at some things also. But that’s individual colleges within the university. As an overall school, they aren’t automatically the BEST because they are Ivy League.</p>
<p>xSteven, where in Maryland are you? I’m also in MD, and the people I know – and many students at my son’s school – know the Ivy League schools (and some end up in them).</p>
<p>Never heard the term “Ivy Plus” before.</p>
<p>If you’d asked me a few years back to name the Ivy League schools, I would have said Harvard and Yale. If you’d told me there were more I probably would have guessed Wellesley or Amherst.</p>
<p>Grew up in NY suburbs, in a very competitive public HS, where many classmates did attend Ivies, but we thought of them as individual schools, not a group. Our best female students often attended all-girl schools like, Smith, Wellesley, and Bryn Mawr, and our top lacrosse players headed for Princeton and UVA. My own college search consisted of visiting 4 schools that my GC suggested, and choosing the one I liked best that had my major. Students and parents just didn’t agonize over the process the way so many of us (myself included) do now.</p>
<p>"It’s the name of a sports league that includes eight colleges and universities in the Northeastern United States.
Agreed. There are other colleges and universities “in the same league” academically as the Ivy’s. That does not mean they are not better or worse, they are just not one of the 8 colleges. I am surprised the question was even asked.</p>
<p>Oh, it should be whatever one wants it to be! </p>
<p>The purists can cling to the strict notion of the original Ivy League. Some might even decide that the eight schools were originally different --Colgate football anyone? Others, including the Barnard families might continue to discuss all the benefits of the affiliation to Columbia University (the shared facilities, the almost similar diploma that does indeed have Columbia on it in addition to Barnard, the fact that Barnard graduates can apply for jobs by sending columbia.edu emails, and on and on.) Others from Columbia might object on the grounds of different selectivity, is not part of Columbia’s listed UG, and claim Barnard lowers the prestige of Columbia. </p>
<p>At the end, it makes little difference, and attempts to be “duplicitous” about the affiliations will be ignored or … condemned. A decision that the holder of the diploma will have to make many times. As far as parental bragging, I’d say let them have it. After all, the oohs and the aahs might mask the occasional smirk from the “establishment.” </p>
<p>Obviously, if one needs to add the qualifier “one of the Ivy League” to his or her own alma mater’s description, chances are that the audience does not really … care, or simply knows better.</p>
<p>There are people who think Duke is an Ivy League. I think Stanford is already mentioned…</p>
<p>No they’re not.</p>
<p>As far as I know, when people say “Ivy” they usually mean Brown, Cornell, or any of the “lower level” Ivies. People who go to HYP would straight out say I go to “H/Y/P” instead of “I go to an Ivy.” </p>
<p>Seriously, if you’re attending Harvard would you say “I go to Ivy”? And everyone whom I know said “Ivy” ended up in the “lower level” ones, it’s funny.</p>
<p>Sorry - I just have to ask:</p>
<p>Why would anyone, when asked what college they attend/attended or their child attends/attended, NOT come out and say the actual NAME of the school - no matter what school it is. Is it supposed to sound more modest if you say “an Ivy” rather than Harvard or Yale, or less embarrassing if you say “an Ivy” rather than Cornell or Brown? (And Brown is one of the schools my child applied to as his favorite Ivy. I mean neither Brown nor Cornell any offense. From some of these posts, it does seem that some people look down on them however. I don’t get it.) And my goodness, would someone ever say “a NESCAC” school if they really mean some other small prestigious LAC NOT part of this group? A “Big 10” school for Rutgers? Schools are what they are.</p>
<p>I totally understand the point of the original post; I just don’t understand why anyone would ever not name the actual school to which they refer, or if they don’t want to name the specific school on these boards for some type of anonymity, why would they refer to any school that is NOT in the Ivy League as an “Ivy.” It’s not really a gray area. There are 8 Ivy League schools. Be proud if you went to one. But be just as proud if you went to any other college that was the right one for you (or your child if that’s what your talking about).</p>
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<p>I’m with you in not understanding why this happens, the matter of parents referring to colleges that aren’t formally in the Ivy League </p>
<p>[Ivy</a> League - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivy_League]Ivy”>Ivy League - Wikipedia) </p>
<p>when claiming, “My child attends an Ivy.” But that does happen on College Confidential threads. It’s definite enough what is an Ivy League college (there are exactly eight of those) and what is not. It’s more ambiguous what is an “Ivy plus” college, </p>
<p><a href=“"Ivy plus" site:.edu[/url]" - Google Search”+site%3A.edu</a> </p>
<p>and that phrase “Ivy plus” exists to denote a broader, less exactly defined group of colleges each of which might be a called “peer” college to one or another of the eight Ivy League colleges. I don’t get why people who aren’t referring to ivies call them ivies, but it happens here.</p>
<p>The only time I have heard the term “ivy plus” was in a thread here a while back about these ivy league alum parties (maybe singles parties? i forget), there was an article about it, and they mentioned that some “ivy plus” schools were allowed to attend, too.</p>
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<p>I agree. Both my daughters went to real Ivy League schools, one to an “upper” Ivy League school and the other to a “lower” one. In neither case, when asked, have I ever answered with anything other than the name of the school. Answering with “she attends an Ivy League school” would be ridiculous.</p>
<p>I’m having a hard time envisioning a circumstance where this “problem” might actually come up.</p>
<p>I had never heard the term “Ivy Plus” until this thread. Ancient Eight, Seven Sisters, of course, knew those terms…but Ivy Plus, never heard before.</p>
<p>Oh, and while I’m at it, I have to admit I’m not too crazy about either the title “Little Ivies” or “New Ivies.” Sounds like you might be trying just a little too hard with those nicknames. </p>
<p>Just my opinion.</p>