Mom- lots of these good jobs for psych majors ARE related to psychology. Evaluating test/study data; mapping out human behavior; understanding different personality traits and how that impacts decision-making; being able to read a complicated study and tease out the findings and conclusions.
They just don’t have the word “Psychologist” in the title. For that he needs a doctorate.
@mommdc - not sure why you addressed me?
I am referring to schools that do not meet need yet the parents go $100,000+ in expensive Plus loans to have their precious child at that school.
No school or major is worth that kind of debt and I think it’s a dumb decision.
What do you want us to say?
But that does not apply to OP, no crazy Plus loan debt.
@blossom, yes, I agree. I did not phrase it very well. Maybe he had only looked at obvious “psychologist” job postings, I don’t know.
Geneva: $35,450 for residential undergraduates’ billed costs only (not including books and misc expenses). So $23,450 plus books and misc expenses if student has a $12,000 scholarship. For commuter, several thousand dollars less (room and board = $9,770, but food and utilities at home plus transportation means that the savings will be less than that by commuting). https://www.geneva.edu/student-accounts/tuition_costs
Youngstown State: $23,407.28 for residential out-of-state undergraduates’ billed costs only (not including books and misc expenses). Note that Youngstown State offers in-state + $240 per year ($17,747 for billed costs only) for residents of some Pennsylvania counties. http://cfweb.cc.ysu.edu/finaid/sec_tuition.cfm
I.e. Youngstown State’s out-of-state list price appears similar to (or significantly lower than if the OP lives in the specific counties) Geneva with the $12,000 scholarship. Youngstown State’s only ABET-accredited program is chemical engineering: http://main.abet.org/aps/AccreditedProgramsDetails.aspx?OrganizationID=357 . It does not look like Youngstown State is too difficult to get into as a transfer student: http://cms.ysu.edu/administrative-offices/admissions/admissions-process .
But if he only lost his $10,000 scholarship (that’s what he got last year) and all other aid would be the same he would pay $18,000 if he stays on campus, $8,000 if he commutes. He can commute to Geneva, but not to Youngstown I assume.
Also if he wanted chemical engineering he could stay at Geneva.
OP needs $10,000 or less. Only possible with the scholarship or by commuting from what I see.
"2nd son … is taking Chemical Engineering (1st year) but his grades have slipped due to a bad Breakup… he will loose a $12,000 scholarship if he doesn’t get them back up … we can’t afford to carry this… (as we’ll have another son starting this year too)… so the dilemma is…
Should we just have him go to the lowest cost PA school in our state, Drop the Engineering…
Is a CHEMISTRY degree worth very much… I really don’t know… After 1st son’s mistakes… just feeling pretty lousy about prospects in this day & age."
A bachelor’s is ChemE is difficult, but more employable than a bachelor’s Chemistry. Additionally, at most schools, grades rise after freshman year. I would be in close contact with him and understand whether it is possible for him to get back on track.
I would try to understand where he is mentally, and try to convince him that no matter what he wants to do, trying to get through this semester with decent grades is going to make it easier.
I would also try to understand: Is he going to all his classes and discussion groups? Is he getting academic support for subjects he is struggling in? Does he have a tutor? In general, what can be done to get him through this semester?
Chemistry and ChemE salaries are significantly different with a Bachelors degree.
American Chemical Society, 2014, inexperienced graduate, Bachelors, median salary:
Chemistry: $36,900
Chemical Engineering: $67,300
http://www.acs.org/content/dam/acsorg/careers/salaries/secure/salaries/new-graduates-2014.pdf
I disagree that GPA doesn’t matter. If you are just getting out of college and have no experience, recruiters will stick to interviewing the kids with higher GPAs. It is the only metric they have. I presumed we were talking about seniors and new grads here…
Once you have some experience, I agree, GPA becomes irrelevant.
Agreed. An older cousin who graduated in engineering with a cumulative GPA just a smidgen under 3.0 in the late '80s found he needed several more months after graduation before he landed his first post-college job.
This was despite having plenty of relevant experience from part-time/summer jobs some of which would be considered paid internships today. Some interviewers immediately ended the interview once they found his cumulative GPA. In contrast, engineering classmates with 3.0+ GPAs were getting multiple job offers with less work experience. Sometimes as early as their junior year.
This experience was one reason he made it a point to suggest younger cousins like yours truly and later, his own kids to do whatever they can to keep their cumulative GPA above a 3.0 to avoid the struggles he encountered right after college due to his sub-3.0 GPA.
Where does $18,000 net price at Geneva come from if the list price is $35,450 and he has a $10,000 or $12,000 scholarship?
There are no worthless degrees, but there are students who graduate with degrees but haven’t developed marketable skills and thus do not command a high wage. At some point it’s on the student not the school to develop those skills. There are many free online courses like Coursera that help develop some of those skills and supply some certifications.
If your S loses his scholarship, then he needs to figure out what he’s going to do. I don’t think a PA program is that great anyway. That said, we need to raise our children to be resilient, so if he’s screwing up his life over a breakup, the kindest thing you can do is to just let him fail so that he can learn how to pick himself up. Your planning his next move isn’t going to teach resilience, it will just start the vicious cycle of not taking responsibility for himself all over again.
@ucbalumnus, last year his out of pocket cost was $3,300 I think plus the $5,500 loan.
Let me see if I can find the post with the aid package.
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/18721068/#Comment_18721068
08-11-2015 at 9:14 pm
Now I will give the breakdown of the package on the other side of this paper…
Source:…Fall…Spring …Total
Federal Pell Grant… …$1,113…$1,112…$2,225
Federal SEOG Grant …$400 …$400…$800
PA State Grant (est)…$1,811…$1,812…$3,623
Alumni Scholarship…$5,000…$5,000…$10,000
Geneva Grant …$3,800…$3,800…$7,600
Griffith -Royal Scholarship…$500…$500…$1,000
Perkins Loan…$500…$500…$1,000
Direct Loan (Subsidized)…$1,750…$1,750…$3,500
Direct Loan. (Unsubsidized)…$1,000…$1,000…$2,000.
Total…$15,874…$15,874…$31,748
Ok, from http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/18721039/#Comment_18721039 , it looks like the net price is $9,832 (including $6,500 of loans offered), and $10,000 of the scholarship is subject to maintaining a 3.0 GPA. So net price could go up to about $19,832 if the scholarship is lost, unless other aid is increased.
Chem E is hard. Many first year students are surprised by the difficulty and get some low grades. But for those that stick it out, learn how to study and when/ how to get help they can graduate into a job paying $65000 or more.
Is he already on probation?
What was his GPA? What does it need to be above? What grades does he need this semester to bring the GPA to acceptable number? Is it possible?
He needs to tackle this head on. Join study groups. Go to the tutoring center at school. Talk with his advisor. Talk with his teachers. Get help by asking for help.
He has to want this badly enough to buckle down and succeed.
To the older posters: can you find the thread from the dad about his engineering sons struggles who turned things around? The OP might find it worthwhile.gosh, who was that? It’s on the tip of my tongue…
Here you go . Shrinkraps son did graduate but it wasn’t easy.
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1263136-parents-of-engineering-freshman-p1.html
If he thinks chem is too hard he might consider mechanical or civil engineering also.
And briefly, I bet the employment opportunities are slim to none in your area for son 1. He needs to seriously expand the area where he is job hunting.
@sax,I think they check the GPA at end of spring semester.
https://www.geneva.edu/financial-aid/aid-types/scholarships_awards
@ucbalumnus, yes if everything stays the same with the aid, but without the $10k merit, the price of $19,832 is correct.
But then again, it would depend if Geneva would keep giving the other grants and I think with two in school the EFC is also lower this year. And if son 2 got SEOG and the Perkins loan again, he can take out $6,500 loan in addition if he is at sophomore standing.
The good part is he could potentially commute, saving the room and board portion of $9,800 I think.
OP can chime in with what son 2 had particular problems with, but I think Calculus was part of it. I don’t see that getting easier later in engineering.
I don’t know if son 2 was interested in engineering or if that seemed more marketable.
Other than chemistry, what other things interest him and did he excel in something especially in high school?