Why All-Women's Schools?

Colleges & Universities Smith College
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<p>Here’s a partial list of women leaders who attended all-women’s schools:
(Part 1)

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<p>(Part 2) Note: some are even scientists! :eek:</p>

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<p>“As far as how many women go to the Seven Sisters after being accepted by the Ivies, the numbers are definitely very low. The same holds true with Amherst and Williams so there is nothing to be offended about.”</p>

<p>This is an obvious, yet misleading, statement. Obviously people who apply to Ivy League Schools plan on going to them if admitted. The average person admitted to an Ivy will almost certainly choose Harvard/Yale/Princeton over any other school, whether it a Seven Sister, Amherst, Williams, or UC Berkeley (a University that cellardweller praised in a previous post for its supposedly abundant undergraduate research). If you didn’t want to go to Ivy Leagues to begin with, why bother applying? Due to the competitive nature of the schools, one almost certainly would have to spend more time on an Ivy application than any other application. There is simply no point in wasting your time. In fact, why bother applying to ANY reach school when your number one choice is easier to get into? </p>

<p>Take me, for example. I personally have no intention of going to an Ivy League school (even if I got into one) so I won’t even apply. However, I know that one of the schools I will apply to is Smith. In that regard I am choosing Smith over an Ivy. However, since I won’t apply to an Ivy, and hence I can’t get into one, I’m not going to be included in any statistic. This is why cellardweller’s comment, while technically true, is misleading.</p>

<p>As for the same being true with Amherst/Williams, etc, I have encountered someone who chose Amherst over the Ivies.</p>

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<p>Arrianeag…another bright Smithie who can see through the cloud of dust put forth by other posters. Cellardweller’s comment was very misleading, and quite a no-brainer if you ask me. I think he/she might be running out of rants about Smith?? :wink: My D is in the same boat as you; picked Smith over applying to an IVY. Her friend on the other hand was admitted to Yale, and still choose Smith. :)</p>

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<p>I think he/she might be running out of rants about Smith?? ]]</p>

<p>I have one for her/him. Parking is a pain by Starbucks.</p>

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<p>"Arrianeag…another bright Smithie who can see through the cloud of dust put forth by other posters. Cellardweller’s comment was very misleading, and quite a no-brainer if you ask me. I think he/she might be running out of rants about Smith?? My D is in the same boat as you; picked Smith over applying to an IVY. Her friend on the other hand was admitted to Yale, and still choose Smith. "</p>

<p>Well, actually, I’m not a Smithie. I’m still a junior in high school, but Smith is, as of now, my 1st choice.</p>

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<p>And the wait at Sylvester’s is too long; even if the food is wonderful! ;)</p>

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Well…even more kudos to you! Let me ask you as a high school junior…Why an all-women’s school?</p>

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<p>Please, do not demean those of us who choose to go to women’s colleges by saying they are an alternative to those who could not gain admission into the ivies. This fact could not be farther from the truth. Many of us who have chosen to go to Wellesley, Smith, and other women’s colleges turn down merit scholarships from places like Johns Hopkins and Tufts, offers of admission from Ivy League schools like Columbia, Cornell, and Yale, and top LAC’s like Williams and Amherst. Why? Because for once in our lives we want to be given the same amount of attention that men have recieved all their lives. Example: how many people show up to support your high school girl’s basketball team? Now, compare that to the number of people that show up to support the boys. The same goes (whether you notice it or not) with academics. There is a very observable difference between women who have graduated from elite all women’s colleges and those who have graduated from other prestigious institutions; a confidence and leaderships ability that co-ed institutions do not provide in the same way. (See: list of female CEO’s of Fortune 500 Companies). Many of us pass up oppurtunities to attend top universities and co-ed LAC’s to experience the completley unique education that only a women’s college can provide.</p>

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<p>IRvirtuoso…where have you been all this thread? Great post!<br>

I have posted many times, especially in the beginning of this thread, about the inequality of the educational system. The facts do not lie, and it is reassuring to hear from someone who has witnessed it first-hand.<br>

Because these schools are designed for women, focused on women, and provide leadership for women ONLY!! There has to be a difference.</p>

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<p>“Well, actually, I’m not a Smithie. I’m still a junior in high school, but Smith is, as of now, my 1st choice.”</p>

<p>Given the huge historical advantage in admission rates for ED at Smith, will you apply ED if it is your first choice?</p>

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<p>As for whether or not I will apply ED, that depends on whether or not I like any other the other schools I’m planning on visiting. I still hope to see the Claremonts, the Bryn Mawr/Swarthmore/Haverford area, and some UCs (I’m from California, very close to the UC Berkeley campus. My mom is a professor at Berkeley and used to work for Carol Christ, but that’s another story). On paper, however, Smith is probably my first choice. We’ll see. There’s also the SAT goof issue ---- i.e. Due to registration issues, I’m probably not going to take the SAT reasoning test until the beginning of next school year. If I goof on the SAT then, I’ll have to retake it even later, in which case it will be too late to apply ED. Grrrrr. Furthermore, if I apply ED and get in, I’m worried that I’ll feel bad about it. Applying to many schools and getting in to more schools means that I’ll be forced to look even more carefully (more overnights, attending more classes, etc.). Somehow that will make me feel more comfy with my choice. Dunno. Any suggestions?</p>

<p>As for the previous question of “why an all women’s school?”, I’m struggling with the same question. I’ve attended coed schools since preschool, and I’ve honestly felt happy about my experiences. However, I feel like something can be gained by spending several years in a single sex environment. Will I participate more in class? Will I gain self-confidence? Will I feel more comfortable socially? I don’t know. I have a feeling the answer is “yes” to at least some of the questions, but how will I ever settle the question without trying? Hopefully 4 good years at a women’s school will supplement 13+ good years at coed schools. If I don’t like it…well, at least I’ve learned a lesson.</p>

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Arianneag…I must congratulate you and your parents, as you sound like a very mature young lady. I’m sure you read many of the previous posts leading up to this point, and there is much research provided that supports exactly how you feel about all-women’s schools. They do support women in ways that coed schools do not; after all, they are formed to educate young women such as yourself. Is that an advantage? To those who choose to attend these schools, I believe it is. Something can and will be gained by attending a single-sex school, and you mentioned some of them above in your quote. I really am interested in the Carol Christ story though?? ;)</p>

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<p>I, like arianneag, am a current junior whose first choice is Smith. BJM8 asked why she’d choose an all-women’s school and while I’m not arianneag, here’s my take.</p>

<p>I didn’t start out thinking that I wanted to go to an all-women’s school but the prospect never bothered me; in eighth grade, my parents considered sending me to the local private all-girl’s Catholic school and I was delighted that they’d spend so much money to give me a good education when our local public school is the top school in the area. I figured that I’d get my life in order first before worrying about the guys. When I first began looking at colleges, my top choices has been (not all at once ;)) Stanford, Tufts, Johns Hopkins, Georgetown, and Smith.</p>

<p>The main reason why I’d like to attend Smith is that the girls WANT to be there. Many of my peers would never dream of going to an all-women’s college because “that doesn’t sound like fun.” I figured that those who do attend do so because of the intense academics and the focus on educating a woman. At the college level, it’s difficult for a parent to pick a college because it’s a good school and force their child to go there like it is possible with high school. Most of all, it seems that most of the Smithies WANT to be there and care about learning rather than seeing eduaction as a means to make lots of money. The statistics that show that most seek to fulfill the requirements for Latin Honors despite the school having but one graduation requirement also tells me that most girls aren’t so specialized that they don’t have breadth in their education. Yes, that is the point of a liberal arts education but something’s just that much more special when people knowingly go after it themselves without having anyone hold a gun to their head. The daughters of the posters here sound exactly like the people that I would hang out with; if there are 2500 other smart, young women like that to go to school with, why not? It creates a unique academic environment that I love. I’m not saying that that can’t be found elsewhere, but it’s just one of the biggest things I noticed about Smith.</p>

<p>I’m not sure if I wanted to go to an all-women’s school as much as I found my dream school and it happened to be all women. Of course, when people ask why I would go to an all-women’s school, I jokingly reply that I can party at Amherst and come home and still find all the toilet seats down. ;)</p>

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<p>I jokingly reply that I can party at Amherst and come home and still find all the toilet seats down.]]</p>

<p>Boy, next years applicants certainly are going to be a very bright bunch.</p>

<p>LOL–Thats a great line. </p>

<p>And you can let them trash their dorms and rooms, not yours. :)</p>

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WOW!!! Now, that’s a bit mature for a H.S. junior. Good for you.

Theothermuse and arianneag are inspirations for us all, gives us hope for the younger generation. This level of the thought process and maturity simply moves me (do I sound like Paula Abdul?) If Smith is lucky enough to grab the two of you, they will be the better for it. I can’t wait to welcome you to Smith next year!</p>

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<p>NATIONAL CENTER FOR EDUCATION STATISTICS
U.S. Department of Education
Office of Educational Research and Improvement NCES 97-982
Findings from
THE CONDITION OF EDUCATION 1997
regarding Women in Math and Sciences</p>

<p>Here are some excerpts from this important study done in 1997. I have been introducing many of these findings throughout this thread: I think it speaks volumes as to why women’s colleges are both necessary and valuable for the young women who choose to attend these institutions, as well as taking a hard look at the inequities that do exist in middle and secondary schools. Enjoy:

  • A gender gap in science proficiency scores begins to appear at age 13.
  • Men score higher than women on the SAT mathematics and science
    Achievement Tests, as well as on the mathematics and science Advanced
    Placement (AP) examinations.
  • Data from the late 1980s and early 1990s indicate that 7th- and 10th
    grade boys and girls are equally likely to say that they enjoy mathematics
    and science. Among 12th-graders,however, a gender gap emerges in
    science.
  • A gap in the career aspirations of boys and girls in science or engineering
    exists as early as eighth grade.
  • While male and female high school seniors are equally likely to expect a
    career in science or mathematics, male seniors are much more likely than
    their female counterparts to expect a career in engineering.
  • Male first-time college freshmen were more likely to choose engineering as
    an intended field of study, while female first-time freshmen were more likely
    to choose professional fields, education, and social sciences.
  • At the postsecondary level, women are less likely than men to earn a
    degree in mathematics, physical sciences, and computer sciences and
    engineering. The exception is in life sciences degrees.
  • The salary differential between women and men in comparable scientific
    jobs is still evident.
  • a gender gap still exists with respect to mathematics and science, and it
    widens as students climb the education ladder.
  • Even though women make up about half of the labor market, they are both
    underrepresented in jobs in scientific fields and are paid less than men.
    Some of these differences can be explained by differences in the field
    chosen, level of experience, and level of education. Overall, there are still
    substantial differences between women and men in mathematics and
    science fields, and these differences appear as early as middle school.</p>
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<p>Women’s Colleges and Student Satisfaction
Paper and Discussion
<a href=“http://www.ed.gov/pubs/WomensColleges/chap2fin.html[/url]”>http://www.ed.gov/pubs/WomensColleges/chap2fin.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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It appears that women are nor being treated fairly and equally at coed colleges as well. Not because the institution purposefully neglects women, (I know of none that would purposely do that) but because they do not have the same knowledge of how women learn as all-women’s colleges. Women who were satisfied with their education at women’s colleges were also concerned with issues such as faculty diversity and books by women included in the curriculum. Increasing faculty diversity and increasing the visibility of women in the curriculum are ways coeducational institutions can better serve their female students.
The third paragraph of this introduction struck me vividly, as Smith has a great ADA program for just those types of women. A very important aspect of that community.</p>

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<p>Theothermuse, it’s awesome that we’re in a similar situation. I happen to agree with a lot of the things you said about Smith. I did get a very strong sense of enthusiasm among the student body. I remember my tour guide said that she spend time studying abroad in Easter Europe to hear the “other side of the story” about communism in the Cold War. I was amazed by her genuine concern for the accuracy of what’s she is being taught ---- that’s NOT something you’ll find at very many other schools. </p>

<p>Another point: Coming from the West Coast, people always warn us about East Coast intellectual “snobbiness”. As a consequence, I had some negative expectations about Smith and other schools on the East. However, when I visited, I did not get any sense of “snobbiness” at Smith at all. I felt very welcome there. In fact, the first student I talked to was a friendly girl at the admissions office who was VERY excited to find out that I came from the Bay Area. On top of that, three different students came right into the office and starting talking to me on the couch. I never could have asked for a more pleasant and welcoming first impression of the campus. And BJM8, thanks for making me feel even more welcome!</p>

<p>If you had asked me 5 years ago, I would never have considered a women’s college. This is largely because of the fact that my aunt hated Wellesley. However, after talking to a girl who’s at Wellesley and LOVES it there, I figured that times have changed and decided to be more open-minded. I threw in some women’s colleges with the coed bunch on my “research” list, and sure enough I became interested in Smith. Now it’s my 1st choice.</p>

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<p>For Cellardweller:

Since you asked, I got the answer from your own alma mater. In 1999, as I’m sure you know, MIT did a self-study on the Status of Women Faculty in Sciences at MIT. Here are some excerpts from MIT:

Now I don’t know as much about MIT as you, but I do know that this would not exist at Smith or any other all-women’s college. To MIT’s credit, they have established a committee of women faculty in the dept. of sciences, and have made progress. :slight_smile:

So, that’s where I got the information. Any more questions?</p>