<p>I believe that has been pointed out by way of everyone that answered “because I don’t want to be an actuary, I want to be an engineer” or something similar.</p>
<p>Ok. Next debate, who drive better cars, actuaries or engineers?</p>
<p>Who cares?</p>
<p>**warning, gross generalization up ahead…*</p>
<p>Actuaries, but that’s just to compensate for their dull jobs.</p>
<p>haha, that post just made my day.</p>
<p>Hah, awe poor actuaries and their lives.</p>
<p>But yeah, this thread is funny and was really ended at that whole “because I don’t want to be an actuary, I want to be an engineer” like boneh3ad said and then there was another “why?” at some point and people said “because actuary is boring” and then actuaries got mad because they’re so not boring, engineers are boring and so is kodak. Kodak is where most engineers end up and it’s boring. Then engineers said “you know what’s more boring than kodak? still actuary”.</p>
<p>Really, it’s all relative interests. And the money stat was a lie.</p>
<p>But I seriously love the threads in this engineering place, it’s funny.</p>
<p>Personally, I think actuary-ism is boring. Hence, my foray in technology and magic stuff like that.</p>
<p>Technology is magic you damn heretic.</p>
<p>lucky2010, +100 for an awesome thread synopsis.</p>
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</p>
<p>I think you mean magnets.</p>
<p>I came across this site and saw your interesting discussion about engineering vs actuarial science. </p>
<p>I graduated from engineering school 15 years ago with a MSEE and then went for an MBA at an ivy league school. </p>
<p>I worked in telecom for a while, but mostly I worked in semiconductors. I also moved into management. </p>
<p>I’m now working towards becoming an actuary. I work for a Prop Casualty insurer and am studying for my 5th exam. </p>
<p>I would recommend actuarial science as a career. If you are interested in money, yes actuarial science does pay better (if you are a fellow) than engineering. I know since I was in management and made well over $100K a year plus bonus and options. </p>
<p>But, starting salaries may be lower than engineering. Once you’ve passed 3 exams you will already be above average starting engineering pay. </p>
<p>But, apart from the money the work is interesting if you like business and mathematics. Also, the work environment is comfortable and as an actuary you are well respected (vacation, pay, bonuses, travel, leave at 4pm, etc)</p>
<p>Now, this is the important part about actuarial vs engineering. </p>
<p>As a starting engineer you will very likely be working in a highly process driven environment, you will not have much say in the work for you first 3-5 years in the job. Your coursework may help you, but most likely you will need to learn things not taught in school. Engineering standards, requisition processes, test and measurement (this is ye majority of work you will do) and regulations. </p>
<p>I know you may say, but I’m smart and I want to design X or Y, look at my engineering project!</p>
<p>Sorry, all that will do is get you a job. Remember, engineering is highly related to the manufacturing industry and overall job growth for engineers is really low, so most likely you will be filling the space of a retiring engineer. Competition is somewhat high and whatever school work you have may help you stand out, but when you get in you are just a new hire. </p>
<p>You may work on testing a component of a missile system, but you will not be designing anything critical. Remember, engineering involves processes and minimizing risk. </p>
<p>You may work on a software project, but again only on a small part. </p>
<p>Now, you may say, but I’ll be better and move into management or marketing. </p>
<p>Sure, and that could happen, but then you are not working as an engineer, you are in business and need to focus on costs, schedules, forecasts, etc. </p>
<p>Another thing, engineering staff and overhead is a large part of costs for a tech company. These costs need to be minimized, so it is difficult to justify paying more, especially since they can hire an H1B candidate or outsource. If you work in the government, or a defense contractor, pay and benefits will be better though. </p>
<p>Now, getting back to actuarial. The company I work for has 45,000 employees, and yet has only ~240 actuarial fellows and about 200 actuarial students (you are a student even though you are paid) in various stages of the exam process. </p>
<p>As a percentage of costs, actuarial is very low for the majority of organizations. </p>
<p>So, this is an important reason pay and benefits are high. In effect being an actuary you are an elite employee. If you pass the exams you are almost guaranteed an executive level job within your career. This cannot be said for any other profession, period. </p>
<p>Anyhow, I’ve written enough. </p>
<p>Good luck all on your chosen fields.</p>
<p>If I was advising a college student, I’d say talk to some engineers and some actuaries before you decide the path to pursue. What’s the job like day to day? Do you do something different every day, month, year? Or, are you looking at the same widget for years on end as an engineer or the same mortality table every day as an actuary. </p>
<p>Also ask yourself. Do you like building things and taking things apart? Do you like CAD software or working with spreadsheets? Working alone vs. working as part of team? All these things influence job satisfaction, which is ultimately going to contribute to your financial and personal success/satisfaction.</p>
<p>You also want to get a sense of the “culture” of working in these fields. I work with actuaries. They are a unique group. A little on the quirky side, at least in my office, and mostly men.</p>
<p>Based on my research, there does not seem to be that many jobs for actuaries:</p>
<p>“Job seekers are likely to face competition because the number of job openings is expected to be less than the number of qualified applicants.”</p>
<p>“Nonetheless, growth may be, to a degree, offset by corporate downsizing and consolidation of the insurance industry—the largest employer of actuaries. Life insurance companies, for example, are expected to increasingly shed high level actuarial positions as companies merge and streamline operations. Pension actuaries will also experience declining demand. This is largely due to the decline of defined benefit plans, which required review by an actuary, in favor of investment-based retirement funds, such as 401ks.”</p>
<p>[Actuaries[/url</a>] </p>
<p>“U.S. insurers and actuarial firms increasingly are outsourcing, offshoring, and importing actuarial talent from abroad, industry experts report.”</p>
<p>[url=<a href=“U.S. Insurers Increasingly Outsourcing Actuarial Work to Overseas Talent”>U.S. Insurers Increasingly Outsourcing Actuarial Work to Overseas Talent]U.S</a>. Insurers Increasingly Outsourcing Actuarial Work to Overseas Talent](<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos041.htm#projections_data]Actuaries[/url”>http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos041.htm#projections_data)</p>
<p>I’m no big fan of engineering, but I still think it is a far better field than actuaries. Go onto USA Jobs and there is only 1 actuary job. But look at engiener positions, and there are tons more. Plus there are lots of govt. engineer jobs that are not listed on USA Jobs.</p>
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<p>Then what motivates you to be here?</p>
<p>I have a minor in math, so if I feel the need I’ll switch</p>
<p>
Actually, those exams very hard to pass. They keep the number of those who pass to a very small percentage. That’s one major reason why you’re very well paid. If you can make it, you’re very well compensated.
</p>
<p>In this economy, NOBODY is guaranteed to a job regardless of your credentials. People really need to stop thinking that they can just walk into a job if they have the “right” credentials.</p>
<p>Actualy the number of people who passed the first exams is quite large. These numbers are just for 2008:</p>
<p>Exam 1: 5629
Exam 2: 4342
Exam 3: 2643 (Both combined)
Exam 4: 1637
Exam 5: 428
Exam 6: 293
Exam 7: 273
Exam 8: 201
Exam 9: 188</p>
<p>i can’t wait for the day Homer gets a job. maybe we won’t see him here anymore. Still interviewing Homer? I hope so.</p>