<p>I believe you mean Jehovah’s Witnesses. According to what I’ve read recently, the 144,000that’s 12,000 from each of the twelve tribes of Israel, for those of you keeping score at homewill rule alongside Jesus in Heaven, but millions more will live in God’s paradise on Earth. That doesn’t sound so bad to me; I’ll take either one.</p>
<p>There’s no hell, by the way, no eternal torment. The punishment for evil is simply oblivion. The wicked just won’t be resurrected on Judgment Day, but they won’t suffer. The reasoning is that God is good and would not inflict such cruelty on any of his creation, and furthermore that this would violate the covenant that Jesus suffered on our behalf, so that we wouldn’t have to.</p>
<p>It’s not just NY, of course -certain other large cities, too. But I think this is largely the case. And of course there are all the transplants, and people who still have roots in those places. People, whether non-Jewish or Jewish, tend to take a bit of that city attitude along with them wherever they go.</p>
<p>I don’t dispute that there are certain cultural biases and characteristics that can be associated with many American Jews, especially of the New York variety. Hating Christians isn’t one of them. Though caution and wariness have been, for the reasons that Woody Allen and Sacha Baron Cohen parody in their films and Jon Stewart mocks almost daily. (Thus, most American Jews “get” Woody Allen, in films like Annie Hall. And many if not most American Jews also “get” Sacha Baron Cohen.)</p>
The link above has more info on Dr. Baron-Cohen, and a photo (you’ll see the resemblance).</p>
<p>As another aside, I grew up in NY (the suburbs) but I wasn’t terribly assertive or “pushy”. I do talk very fast, though, a common northern phenomenon. When I went to my NE LAC, we were encouraged to question, to challenge, to inquire, to push each other and ourselves to make each other think, to explain or justify our thoughts and beliefs in discussions. Classes were often lively discussions/debates, which I grew to very much enjoy, and it changed the way I thought and learned. Then I moved to the south. Armed with these attributes, I was then probably seen as a pushy northeast Jew. Go figure.</p>
<p>I was an officer in the US Navy for 10 years, and never saw any anti-Semitism. There simply aren’t enough Jews in the US military to have the critical mass needed to be prejudiced against. In other words they aren’t on many people’s minds, for or against. I literally knew four Jews in my 10 years. Two were officers, two were enlisted. They performed fine and I never heard a word against them. The US military is such an amazing conglomeration of ethnicities, religions, and languages, that singling out one group for discrimination would be quite odd. I did hear one officer complain that the Mormon sailors he knew didn’t go in for the usual off-duty “team building” activities, but that was all the anti-religion I heard.</p>
<p>It seems odd that some of the people who criticized my earlier post basically accused me of anti-Semitism for pointing out what ANY statistical anyalysis shows…that Jews are in the US military in percentages far below their % in the general population. A 30-page pamphlet and some familly anecdotes don’t do much to disporve those stats. It’s also true that they aren’t the only group that is far underrepresented. Perhaps their low numbers are made particularly noticible because (1) the Israeli soldiers (including many Jews raised in the US and other countries who’ve gone to Israel to fight during times of war) have fought so bravely and effectively, and (2) a huge part of the US military and foreign policy in recent decades has been pro-Israel and against Israel’s neighbors. Given these two factors, I think it’s sad that their numbers in the US military are so low.</p>
<p>I am beginning to think that I led/lead a very different life here in Minnesota than those in NYC. It would never even cross my mind to think “oh, that person is Jewish or a WASP or Mormon, or Christian…” I may at times register a person’s color, height (my youngest is 6’5" so I always notice height) or attitude, but simply as a brain reflex. I was brought up to believe that all people are equal and all people are good and that it is their ACTIONS that differentiate them not their genetic makeup. Some individuals portray good behavior and some do not play well with others.</p>
<p>I am Swedish and Lutheran and we have our own stereotypes to worry about!</p>
<p>I think you grossly overestimate the number of Americans in Israeli combat units. According to a report in Israel’s largest daily newspaper, in 2007 a record number of American Jews – a total of 150 – moved to Israel and enlisted in the IDF. </p>
<p>And you can’t just go and fight, then walk away. Non-Israelis who enlist in the IDF commit to 14-18 months of active service (plus three extra months of Ulpan for those who don’t know Hebrew) with the possibility that the minimum service time will be extended for unlimited periods. </p>
<p>Kajon-
I did notice, the few times I was in Minnesota, the lack of ethnic diversity (that which can be discerned by the color of one’s skin) there. It makes me wonder if the schisms and group alienation occurs when there is more diversity, not less. Less groups, less divisiveness. Just a thought to muse.</p>
<p>These comments as to why jews are under-represented in the military were interesting
</p>
<p>Truth be told, there are also relatively few jews in public safety (firemen, policemen, etc). In many cultures, especially in past generations, children followed in their parents footsteps or took over the family business with respect to business/work endeavors. Many jews who emigrated to the US a century or so ago went into the clothing or drygoods field. Many were merchants in small communities, or perhaps stayed in the banking/financial fields of previous generations in the old country. It was simply what they knew. Certainly not too many jews were welcomed into the German army, so its not likely they’d have considered a military career when they escaped to the US?</p>
<p>from Wikipedia, I concede, but coincides with my understanding:
“A higher percentage of German Jews fought in World War I than that of any other ethnic, religious or political group in Germanyin fact, some 12,000 died for their country.”
There were also prominent Jews in the French military of the time (including Dreyfus).
There is nothing inherently anti-military about US Jews either. They fought valiantly in World War II.
But in the time of wars without great popular support, absent a draft, middle class college-age kids are likely to stay in school and go on to careers if they can.</p>
<p>Don’t know when you were in the Navy, Schmaltz, but its also quite possible people didn’t openly identify their religious affiliation. If you only met 4 jews in 10 yrs, thats odd, and sad.</p>
<p>My H grew up on Okinawa. When they didn’t have a Rabbi on base, his father was the lay leader. They had a pretty decent turnout for services. His mother would occasionally hold island-wide Seders for all the bases and would get over 200 attendees from all 4 branches (draftees and officers) as well as civilians working for the military (lots of those). Granted it was in the late 60’s -early 70’s and it was draft time, but there were certainly more than 4 jews. If you aren’t looking for them, you won’t find them.</p>
That’s very true, but the numbers of Jews in the U.S. military now is quite low, lower than their percentage in the overall populations. Still, I’ll bet that when you correct for socioeconomic status, it may not be very different at all from any other group.</p>
<p>“You mean those non-drinking Mormons didn’t want to go out to bars with the guys and get drunk? What a surprise.”</p>
<p>Hardy har har. The unit where the anti-Mormon guy was was in Hawaii, where there are year-round softball leagues, charity fundraisers, etc. There was occasionally beer at these events, but not usually. It was sort of expected that officers, senior enlisted personnel, and middle-level enlisted personnel who wanted to show their leadership would attend a lot of these events. I never saw the point of judging a person by what he/she did off-duty, but this one officer disagreed. I was rather stunned by his comment, as it was the first time I’d ever heard anything like that. Way too many people see a few military movies and think they know how the military works. It’s far far more politically correct than you’d think. I was in way before don’t-ask-don’t-tell, and there a lot of male and female homosexuals, and I never saw anybody bust their chops. I did hear on officer make a borderline offensive comment once about a gay sailor, and he got chastised by his peers. My last boss was a Jewish lesbian, and she was one of the best officers I ever worked with or for. The only things that were unforgivable sins were using drugs and being crappy at your job.</p>
<p>Don’t know when you were in the Navy, Schmaltz, but its also quite possible people didn’t openly identify their religious affiliation.</p>
<p>I was in virtually all of the 1980’s. The concept of people being able to “hide” something like their religion in the close quarters of the military lifestyle is pretty farfetched. Your whole life is in your personnel records and security clearance file.</p>
<p>I will never forget the day of the shooting at the local Jewish Community Center where my children had attended camps, etc. Our entire area was on a lockdown as they searched for the shooter. There are some memories that don’t leave you.</p>
<p>You said you hadn’t met but 4 Jews in 10 years, Schmaltz. Thats totally different from anyone trying to “hide” anything, or from your looking though the personnel files of everyone you meet to find out their religion. Surely you aren’t implying you did that. This article [Officer?s</a> Death Highlights Dearth of Jews in the Military ? Forward.com](<a href=“Officer’s Death Highlights Dearth of Jews in the Military – The Forward”>Officer’s Death Highlights Dearth of Jews in the Military – The Forward) says that while only about 4700 in the military have formally listed Judaism as their religion to put on their dogtag, it is estimated that about 1% (10-14,000) of the active military are Jewish. If only about 2% of the US population is Jewish, thats not that big of a discrepancy between the base US population and corresponding representation in the military.</p>
<p>By the way, 4% of the military in WW II was Jewish. Wanna take a wild guess why?</p>