Would you pay for an SAT prep class if this were your kid?

Parents Forum
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<p>I wonder if there are studies to show it does help. D apparently scored 2 points below “assured” NMSF status sophmore year, did not prep, and qualified easily Junior year, as did her BFF. Neither realized the implication of their Sophmore scores. I’ve heard of others that prepped and did worse. Of course that’s just anecdotal. There are always lots of private school students in the area (mine are in public of which typically only 4-5 out of 5 large HS’s qualify) that get NMSF. I don’t know if they prep, have more money and pay for prep, have smarter genetics, or just get a “better” education. </p>

<p>In retrospect was it good or foolish of me not to push D to prep? I suspect, if I told her if would give her a full scholarship + to the likes of OU, UCF, Auburn etc. she would have put up more resistance as it was her dream to go to a small LAC. I agree, some kids need help to get motivated, but you have to pick your battles and if SAT prep is one, you are indeed fortunate in a world in which some parents are worried about their kids getting decent grades, staying in HS, or being safe. </p>

<p>I’m glad your son feels good about the PSAT. I think it is a good sign. Let me know how he does. I’m a fool in that I’m still not sure practice helps. If it does, do we want our kids “over-reaching” academically or go to a school in which they would be a better academic fit?</p>

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<p>When I used to spend more time writing about preparing for the SAT, I liked to stress that the purpose of preparing adequately was to reach one’s TRUE potential. All too often, students fail to accomplish this by starting too late, relying solely on high school academic preparation, having other priorities, or simply lacking interest. </p>

<p>As I also wrote, the best preparation is a methodical and slow progression over time, and one that could espouse the progress in school. This way, it would NOT feel as a rush to prepare. </p>

<p>On the other hand, for some all that is needed is reviewing one or two tests and become familiar with the unique style and presentation.</p>

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<p>Seems like his unprepared for SAT is at average, combined with a B grade average. How would a vastly improved SAT help given his gpa? Doesn’t seem worth spending any money on to me. It would be different if his SAT scores were a lot lower than his gpa. You would also expect an increase in his SAT score from end sophomore to end junior year, regardless of any extra test prep.</p>

<p>Something to consider regarding his gpa. Colleges look for improvement. They will look at his junior year of HS grades- if these are significantly higher than the first two years that would show maturity occuring. Tell your son that this year counts a lot more than the first two years. Next spring he may be looking at a different level of colleges. Thinking of this year as a fresh start may motivate him in doing better/his best. Then you could revisit study for the SAT after first semester as it may be worth his while then.</p>

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<p>Unfortunately, most schools that offer big merit scholarships are “under-reaches,”
–which is the main reason most top students (like your D, who would be de-motivated by the prospect of going to OU, UCF, Auburn, etc.) don’t look at these scholarships. </p>

<p>Over-reaching at the top end–fear that “unqualified” kids are getting into top schools through steroid-induced SAT scores and are not only uncomfortably over-their-heads academically, but also muddying the waters for the truly gifted? A myth. It is common/realistic for a bright kid who tests well to increase scores by 100-200 points (10-20 on PSAT) by prepping. (Bigger gains, while not unheard of, are uncommon and unrealistic). You can’t take a 1500 and make it into a 2200. Is putting a 95% student in with a bunch of 99% students an academic misfit? Unlikely. (95/99 difference represents a 20 point gain on the PSAT–from around 203 to 223.) This type of gain might help a student get into a selective school or pass a scholarship threshold, but the school would not be out of his league. (btw, I am talking about gains from prepping, not soph-junior PSAT gains of 12 points on average–which could be from academic experience, more serious attitude, maximum prep/no prep etc.) </p>

<p>No way to compare the same kids taking the same test on the same day under the same conditions prepped vs. unprepped. But it makes sense that by practicing something over and over, you gain skills in doing that thing. No one would say, “There’s no way to practice for the 100m race. Either you’re a naturally gifted sprinter, or you just don’t have it. Training makes no difference. So get a good night’s sleep, eat a healthy breakfast, and get out there and run and see how you do!” And yet this is the sort of thing I hear parents/teachers/even a principal (!) saying about standardized tests. There are below-average athletes who can become average with practice. And there are excellent athletes who can be superstars through training and coaching. IMO the same is true for test-taking skills. Naturally ability is a starting point, but these skills can be learned/improved. </p>

<p>Practicing is reasonable. It is not an unfair advantage. It is free/cheap–it is not just for rich folks/private schools. I don’t care if a student takes 10, 20, or 100 practice tests. It shows that he/she is willing to work hard/plan ahead to achieve a goal. Is it necessary? Natural ability might get you there anyway, but for those who need scholarship $$, why leave it to nature/chance? If your toughest “competition” is prepping, why wouldn’t you do the same?</p>

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<p>Atomom, I wholeheartedly agree with all your points. Especially this:</p>

<p>“I don’t care if a student takes 10, 20, or 100 practice tests. It shows that he/she is willing to work hard/plan ahead to achieve a goal.”</p>

<p>Which I think proves my point. It should be the kid’s work, planning, and achievement, not the parent’s. If my child asked me to help them, I would buy the book and help them find appropriate practice tests. I would give them resources (short of paying lots of bucks for a review session). But, I wouldn’t beg, cajole, and pay for them for motivation. That should come from within the student. I honor the student who is willing to work hard to achieve his/her goals.</p>

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<p>The “pay them” needs to be viewed in the proper context of the OP question! </p>

<p>In this case, the question was about paying 500 dollars for a group SAT class. Fwiw, this is something that PLENTY of parents do as it appeals to their sense of obligation and perhaps guilt. And also something many of the “SAT Prep Pirates” exploit with passion and abandon. Watched a Sylvan Center commercial lately? Or read a flyer from Princeton Review, Kaplan, or Revolution Prep? </p>

<p>My response was that the chances this would lead to absolutely NOTHING positive were extremely high. The suggestion to pay or “bribe” the kid is that it would be a BETTER use of the same money, and actually not be a real expense as the transfer of funds between parents and children are rarely considered a cost.</p>

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<p>It is reasonable to buy resources to assist your child in test taking. And, I agree that expensive prep courses are a waste of money and the money can be better spent on other types of resources. But I disagree that using that money to encourage motivation is a BETTER use of the same money. The amount of money isn’t the problem, it’s using external motivation to encourage your children to do something for themselves. I never paid for grades either.</p>

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<p>I pushed my D. to take SAT prep. class. She said it was complete waste of time. She self-prep for ACT and did better in ACT than SAT.</p>

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<p>Not many kids will ask their parents to buy them a Blue Book.</p>

<p>As a parent who wants to help my kids get scholarship $, it is not too much work for me to buy the book and say, “Kid, between now and (date) you are going to do the practice tests and exercises in this book, and this is how it will be divided up” or “Remember, kid, that tomorrow at 9am you’ll be taking the SAT at the kitchen table,” or “Look, you missed two similar grammar questions in one section. Here is how that structure works. . .” This is a very small investment. My kids willingly do the work without being paid. However, if I had to wait for the motivation and initiative to come from them, I’d still be waiting.</p>

<p>Most kids, mine included, are not motivated or savvy enough about the process to know where to start and what to do on their own. Nothing wrong with parental encouragement, coaching, organizing, reviewing (prodding, nagging, bribing, etc.) Whatever gets the job done for your kid. If my kid gets scholarship, that will be his reward. (And mine.)</p>

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<p>“Nothing wrong with parental encouragement, coaching, organizing, reviewing (prodding, nagging, bribing, etc.) Whatever gets the job done for your kid.”</p>

<p>And that’s where we disagree. I’m just giving you a perspective from my own small number of 2 kids. No matter how much encouragement, coaching, organizing, and reviewing would have changed either child’s scholarship opportunities and they performed to their abilities. One was showered with opportunities and rejected them all, and the other is going to a fine state flagship. They both stayed within the budget (cost of a state school) I set. Again, parent motivated SAT prep (S did spend some time on prep while D prepped by helping a friend) would not have changed any of that. I will guarantee it would have added to individual and family stress. IMO, raising independent and internally motivated kids is more important than a scholarship opportunity that my child may or may not appreciate. Of course, parent motivated SAT prep probably has very little to do with a kid’s independence and internal motivation and you should continue to do what works for your family and kids. My more hands off methods seems to work for us.</p>

<p>What’s a blue book?</p>

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<p>They are born different, to the same family, I would not know how to make them motivated or not. One was perfectionist who would never touch anything that he did not care to do, si he did not have it done. Another is perfectionist at everything that needs to be done, the only thing I did was to try to unglue her from her homework. However, when she was 5, I told her once (never repeated it) that her homework is priority #1. She is a college senior who still operates under this priority. She did self. prep for ACT for one week, about 1 hour/day, doing only math. She needed high score to compensate for predictable low in Verbal. She has accomplished her goal. Taking class would not have helped, since she needed customized approach. I was there with her going ready to help if she had questions. She has asked me for assistance several times. Material was old, mostly middle school, she did not remember.</p>

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<p>Blue Book = The Official SAT Study Guide–put out by the College Board, with 10 practice tests.The cover is blue, so–in the SAT prep world–it is called The Blue Book.
(Not to be confused with Kelley Blue Book = car prices.)</p>

<p>No way of knowing, after the fact, if prep did or could’ve changed scores for a student.</p>

<p>Do you think prep makes it possible for a student to perform <em>above</em> his/her abilities?</p>

<p>Staying within budget is the important thing. Merit aid may be a crucial part of college financial plans for some, but not for others. My (first 3) kids were not independent and self-motivated in SAT prep–but who is? Personally, I wasn’t content to watch them–due to lack of knowledge/experience–do little/no prep. Having my help in this area benefited them and our whole family. They were cooperative and pleasant to work with, so it was not stressful. </p>

<p>Bottom line: Prepping at home is possible. It doesn’t cost much. IMO, it can help raise scores if done systematically. Don’t do it if you don’t want to.</p>

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<p>“Do you think prep makes it possible for a student to perform <em>above</em> his/her abilities?”</p>

<p>No, but I expect it can help them get their best “potential” score. I can say that S’s math score (his achilles heel) went down after self-prep. I think his first score was pretty much in line with his ability. </p>

<p>“They were cooperative and pleasant to work with, so it was not stressful.”</p>

<p>Suspect that’s a big difference in our families :)</p>

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<p>Just a couple of thoughts on the OP:</p>

<p>-In terms of spending money on an SAT prep test, with some examples given excepted, it probably won’t hurt. Will the kid goof off or take it seriously? We have no way of knowing, in many cases past performance doesn’t indicate future performance, and for me it isn’t wasted money to try something that could potentially have payoff, this isn’t putting 500 bucks on a horse…it is trying to find some way to help the kid out. On top of everything else, there may be an unintended consequence IMO, in effect it is like telling the kid "why should I spend 500 bucks on you for an SAT prep course, it is wasting good money on you who doesn’t even get good grades’ (Again, I am not saying that is anyone’s intent, far from it, I am saying it could be misinterpreted). </p>

<p>It also depends on the test prep, from what I recall from my own time, not all prep is the same, I would recommend checking around to see if others have used this program. </p>

<p>I can speak from personal experience, even with kids with good grades and such, there is a method to taking these tests, and often the test prep is more about teaching an approach to taking it, things like time management, things like how to weed out answers or otherwise work it…seen a lot of really bright kids with 4.0’s astounded at how their SATs came out, saw others who I thought were indifferent students do incredibly well <em>shrug</em></p>

<p>And from my view (for what it is worth) it could be worth it, because he may be one of those kids who ends up doing well on the SAT but doesn’t have great grades, who shows promise but hasn’t done well in school, for any number of reasons. That might help him get into a school if for them he is borderline, and any edge can’t be a bad thing IMO.</p>

<p>-The other thing that stands out is the question, why are his grades so indifferent? Has he always had these kind of grades, or did they drop? Does he have trouble with study skills, time management? Whatever you do with the SAT, I also think it is important to see why the kid has these kind of grades, because in many cases that isn’t going to change in a college setting, could even get worse. My suggestion may be to try and figure out why, and maybe find ways to help him build up that side, not for the short term, but rather for longer term needs. </p>

<p>-He may want to try a community college or other two year program simply to see if that is in fact what he wants to do. I obviously don’t know the kid, but maybe the 4 year college route is not for him, maybe he would be better off with technical/career training…by trying a community college or the like, it is an introduction to college level courses and coursework, to see how he does, and he could then transfer if he found he wanted to go that way.</p>

<p>I wish you well.</p>

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<p>“Do you think prep makes it possible for a student to perform <em>above</em> his/her abilities?”</p>

<p>-I do not think so. however, I think it is possible for a student to perform <em>above</em> his/her abilities (no connection to prep). Some kids are lazy and at the same time are very gifted test takers. Yes, they can perform on tests beyond their ability in classroom.</p>

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<p>^^musicprnt, thanks for your thoughts. S got great grades in middle school, then started tanking in HS. He says the material is harder (no doubt it is), but I think the main problem was that he didn’t see the relevance of school to anything in his life. I say “didn’t” because I think that’s changing now-- he’s beginning to see, maybe in part thanks to his PT job, that in order to have a good quality of life, he has to have an education. Working in a pizza place for minimum wage is fine for now, but won’t cut it in the long run. Just last week the LCD screen on his phone broke, to the tune of a $200 repair. I told him I am more than happy to send it away for repair, but he’s gotta pay. That opened his eyes a bit-- $200 is more than he makes for 2 weeks of work. I’m hoping as time goes on, he will begin to see more clearly the value of an education, and that in turn will fire him up a bit to do better in school.</p>

<p>To my original question, I think I’ve made a decision-- blue book it is. Thanks to everyone who gave their viewpoint. Much appreciated.</p>