carolinamom2boys6895 replies223 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
What I'm saying @kchendds is a disciplinary action for bullying may be restriction from participating in the graduation ceremony. He probably feels untouchable as Valedictorian.
@carolinamom2boys yeah it's ironic when you said people who are bullies should be restricted from participating in the ceremony but obviously this is not the case because kids in school let him be him and no one cares since minority is the majority in D's hs. About 60% are Hispanic.
@cobrat Yes. It seems like it. My daughter has higher GPA than some of the nominees but she's not involved in a lot of school academic teams like the academic decathlon, Science or Math competition. She didn't have extra time after engaging in her sports all year long. That's why she will be the Scholar Athlete of the Year instead according to a list posted on the IB counselor's office (someone saw and told D). This kid has some influence in school according to other kids in school. Parents are influential in a way, I guess.
I keep wondering why everyone keeps calling this young man (who is presumably 18 and an adult) stupid and ignorant and in need to be educated about the positive impact of immigration?
It was stated right at the beginning that the young man was admitted to Pomona, one of the colleges with the smartest student bodies in the country. Now we hear that he may be valedictorian/student of the year.
He has said, in front of witnesses, to a US citizen of a non-white ethnicity, that she should be removed from the country because of her ethnicity. Um, the definition of a racist statement.
To those people who say "it might have been a joke", "it's just an opinion", "it's just ignorant because it's not possible/would hurt the economy" or tell the young woman to come back with a really sassy statement such as "I will remember this when you come to me looking for a job" I can only say "Really?!?"
Even if al this were true, it remains a racist joke, a racist opinion, a racist political plan, a racist comment telling another person she should be _removed_. You can't laugh, discuss, debate, educate, make sassy comments any more once you are _removed_. Try a bit of sassiness to the official deporting you.
No matter how small the chances of that happening in the US are: developed countries, some of them democracies, have moved to deportation of citizens/legal residents and illegal residents of minority ethnicities before. And the fact that it hurt their economies did not matter. Rational thought, education, human decency does not matter when racist politics gain traction.
The kid clearly has been in academic rivalry with the OPs daughter for a while. He'd probably love the have the OPs daughter removed from what he probably considers a race he must win at all cost. A bit of racism thrown in to put her down clearly comes in under all's fair here. And why should the OPs daughter no be offended if a young man deliberately tries to put her down like this?
If she wants to accept his apology, that's her right. It's also her right to report this to the school authorities because it probably will have offended some code of conduct. She may not want to deal with the fallout if the young man loses some of his awards, though. But agree with others: she is an adult, too, it's her choice. But just because it might be the smarter thing to let it go dos not change the racist nastiness displayed by this adult.
dyiu132811 replies55 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
@kchendds So, let us know the HS's student code of conduct and written policy on bullying and hostile environment (racial, gender) in the school. What's it say?
CCDD141082 replies2 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
edited May 2016
He has said, in front of witnesses, to a US citizen of a non-white ethnicity, that she should be removed from the country because of her ethnicity. Um, the definition of a racist statement.
Where did it say that she should be removed from the country because of her ethnicity?
I interpret his statement as an anti-immigrant and not a racist statement.
"XX just told me that he hopes that Trump will deport me and I should go back to my country"
She is a US citizen. The US is her country. What would her "own country" be based on other than that she is of (presumably) Chinese ethnicity and place of birth?
This young man has expressed his own hope that she should be deported.
Is it likely that's going to happen? No. But not totally out of the realm of historical precedent (internment for Japanese Americans was not deportation, but bad enough. Ethnic Europeans were not interned BTW).
Was he serious? Probably not.
Why does that make his statement any less racist?
intparent36291 replies644 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
I think the OP's kid is Hispanic (but let me know if I am wrong, OP). So the comment is pretty clearly based on the D's ethnicity. It is echoing what an unfortunately significant number of adults (including some prominently in the news today) think is an acceptable bigoted comment. My guess is that the OP's D was born in the US -- so what else would it be except an ethnically based slur? (and it doesn't matter whether the D is Hispanic or Asian or African-American -- all have been targeted by these types of comments.) It is ugly.
NOBODY here has said the comment was OK. I have read the entire thread and EVERY ONE here agrees the comment was wrong and that it was racist. The disagreement comes in how it should be handled. Just because some posters do not feel that this comment warrants the authorities, or God forbid some may actually think the kid should get his diploma does not make those people in agreement with racism. We have much bigger issues with racism to focus on and that in NO WAY means I am ok with the comment or with the way the OP's daughter was treated.
carolinamom2boys6895 replies223 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
No one has said the " kid shouldn't get his diploma" @bhs1978 . What several people have said is it's a privilege to participate in the graduation ceremony, and that because of his bullying and inappropriate comments, he should not participate in the ceremonies. That is very different from not receiving a diploma .
twoinanddone22407 replies14 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
Even if this boy said exactly what OP's daughter reported
XX just told me that he hopes that Trump will deport me and I should go back to my country
(and I doubt it can ever be proved that he said exactly that), I think it is his opinion and I would not find it to be bullying. He said he HOPES it will happen. We all know that Trump can't deport citizens. I was asked by a teacher if my daughter had any books 'from her own country' when discussing her reading level. I explained to this teacher (who was an extreme racist) that my daughter was a citizen, that her country was the USA, but that yes, of course we had lots of books about China at home (and Ireland and Africa and Mexico and about dogs and space travel-lack of books was not the problem).
In reading the posts by OP, it's clear she and daughter have a rivalry with this other student. Both students compete for the same awards, both are in a top group of students. I'm sure every word out of her daughter's mouth is not perfect either. OP knows a lot about this students (applied ED2 to Pomona as an athletic recruit, claims to be Hispanic for some awards but doesn't like being Hispanic?). The remark was not an isolated comment.
This just seems like schoolyard drama to me. In a few weeks daughter never has to see this boy again.
intparent36291 replies644 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
"Schoolyard drama" like this has gone on for way too long. And this kid will go on to make similar comments, secure in the knowledge that a fair number of adults think it is just fine even if it does violate school policies or basic human decency.
younghoss3165 replies18 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
edited May 2016
Careful readers here know the schoolgirl is a naturalized citizen. Deporting those here illegally is nothing new; it has been the law and the duty of the Feds to do so for years, though some now want to see the laws changed. One 20th century president even did an internment of citizens.
No doubt this boy's comment was an insult. Does one insensitive comment, even if based on one's ancestry rise to the level of determining he is a racist? Some here say yes, but I say we have too little info to intelligently judge. Even so, a high school kid having racist beliefs isn't illegal. Robert Byrd was a long-time U.S. Senator. Woodrow Wilson was a 2 term President.
Let's remember too, that sometimes when a person is looking for an insult, they go at what they perceive as a "weak point". A person overweight, is likely to have weight as a target, or a kid with glasses is called 4 eyes(I was), nothing new there, but fortunately I'm not a special snowflake.
I think like some others, this is schoolyard drama and should get the proper attention, which in my mind is next to nothing. Insults can occur with a racial overtone or not, and we must all remember we do not have a right not to be offended. As some newscasters are now pointing out, our freedom to speak here in the U.S. includes even speech we don't agree with.
Has this high school girl even insulted another? Has she ever said someone was too fat? Too skinny? Bad complexion? Bleached hair? If someone "in power" like an H.R. director the girl wanted to be hired by said this- then yes I would be concerned. But not by some high school boy's insult.
@twoinanddone they didn't compete for any of the same awards. They have male and female award in both Student of the year and they both will get the "scholar athlete of the year" for their own gender. There's no competition. Most importantly, my daughter doesn't like to compete with others. She is the type of kids who wants to compete with herself only. "A better me today than the me yesterday". She loves the idea of coexistence.
There's no hatred between the two and it's purely his belief that got to his head. He said he feels terrible about hurting my daughter's feeling because she's a good friend to him. My forgiving daughter already forgave him but it probably won't change his point of view as a big picture.
HarvestMoon16200 replies28 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
edited May 2016
I think his thread illustrates how people can interpret comments very differently. Speaking personally, if someone told me he hopes I get "deported" I don't think I would pay much mind. I understand though why someone of another background might react differently. Especially if they were from a first generation family or a member of a group that is currently being targeted by a certain media personality.
Likewise if someone made the comment about books "from her own country" I would not have been insulted either. I would just assume that the teacher was not aware of where my D was born.
Sue226110 replies108 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
It sounds like this has been successfully dealt with. He acted like a jerk, she called him on it, he apologized. It may take him a few rinse and repeats for the lesson to fully sink in, but he understands he hurt her feelings and seems to feel bad about it.
coolweather5875 replies82 postsRegistered UserSenior Member
edited May 2016
In your first post you said your D was upset by the text message two days ago and the boy has been known for racist for a while. For how long? The kids in school did not make any complaint to the school admins? Is it possible your D and other kids collect all the facts about his behaviors in the past and ask the witnesses to go to talk to the school admins?
Yes @coolweather he's known for being racist and sexist but he had never attacked anyone directly like he did to my daughter. Even he might have but no one has come forward and said anything. Daughter actually had a small talk with the councelor (not a complaint btw) and asked for advice. He even said that guy was just being a guy acting immaturely. School officials know how he is obviously. I guess it's all settled and my problem is solved because H didn't blow up the case at the end.
P.S. This guys has very little friends and my daughter probably is his only female friend. So I doubt he would have too much opportunity to offend people. He does it in social science class but you get to voice your own opinion, don't you?
Replies to: Racist comments from a male senior, what should we do?
@cobrat Yes. It seems like it. My daughter has higher GPA than some of the nominees but she's not involved in a lot of school academic teams like the academic decathlon, Science or Math competition. She didn't have extra time after engaging in her sports all year long. That's why she will be the Scholar Athlete of the Year instead according to a list posted on the IB counselor's office (someone saw and told D). This kid has some influence in school according to other kids in school. Parents are influential in a way, I guess.
It was stated right at the beginning that the young man was admitted to Pomona, one of the colleges with the smartest student bodies in the country. Now we hear that he may be valedictorian/student of the year.
He has said, in front of witnesses, to a US citizen of a non-white ethnicity, that she should be removed from the country because of her ethnicity. Um, the definition of a racist statement.
To those people who say "it might have been a joke", "it's just an opinion", "it's just ignorant because it's not possible/would hurt the economy" or tell the young woman to come back with a really sassy statement such as "I will remember this when you come to me looking for a job" I can only say "Really?!?"
Even if al this were true, it remains a racist joke, a racist opinion, a racist political plan, a racist comment telling another person she should be _removed_. You can't laugh, discuss, debate, educate, make sassy comments any more once you are _removed_. Try a bit of sassiness to the official deporting you.
No matter how small the chances of that happening in the US are: developed countries, some of them democracies, have moved to deportation of citizens/legal residents and illegal residents of minority ethnicities before. And the fact that it hurt their economies did not matter. Rational thought, education, human decency does not matter when racist politics gain traction.
The kid clearly has been in academic rivalry with the OPs daughter for a while. He'd probably love the have the OPs daughter removed from what he probably considers a race he must win at all cost. A bit of racism thrown in to put her down clearly comes in under all's fair here. And why should the OPs daughter no be offended if a young man deliberately tries to put her down like this?
If she wants to accept his apology, that's her right. It's also her right to report this to the school authorities because it probably will have offended some code of conduct. She may not want to deal with the fallout if the young man loses some of his awards, though. But agree with others: she is an adult, too, it's her choice. But just because it might be the smarter thing to let it go dos not change the racist nastiness displayed by this adult.
I interpret his statement as an anti-immigrant and not a racist statement.
She is a US citizen. The US is her country. What would her "own country" be based on other than that she is of (presumably) Chinese ethnicity and place of birth?
This young man has expressed his own hope that she should be deported.
Is it likely that's going to happen? No. But not totally out of the realm of historical precedent (internment for Japanese Americans was not deportation, but bad enough. Ethnic Europeans were not interned BTW).
Was he serious? Probably not.
Why does that make his statement any less racist?
In reading the posts by OP, it's clear she and daughter have a rivalry with this other student. Both students compete for the same awards, both are in a top group of students. I'm sure every word out of her daughter's mouth is not perfect either. OP knows a lot about this students (applied ED2 to Pomona as an athletic recruit, claims to be Hispanic for some awards but doesn't like being Hispanic?). The remark was not an isolated comment.
This just seems like schoolyard drama to me. In a few weeks daughter never has to see this boy again.
No doubt this boy's comment was an insult. Does one insensitive comment, even if based on one's ancestry rise to the level of determining he is a racist? Some here say yes, but I say we have too little info to intelligently judge. Even so, a high school kid having racist beliefs isn't illegal. Robert Byrd was a long-time U.S. Senator. Woodrow Wilson was a 2 term President.
Let's remember too, that sometimes when a person is looking for an insult, they go at what they perceive as a "weak point". A person overweight, is likely to have weight as a target, or a kid with glasses is called 4 eyes(I was), nothing new there, but fortunately I'm not a special snowflake.
I think like some others, this is schoolyard drama and should get the proper attention, which in my mind is next to nothing. Insults can occur with a racial overtone or not, and we must all remember we do not have a right not to be offended. As some newscasters are now pointing out, our freedom to speak here in the U.S. includes even speech we don't agree with.
Has this high school girl even insulted another? Has she ever said someone was too fat? Too skinny? Bad complexion? Bleached hair? If someone "in power" like an H.R. director the girl wanted to be hired by said this- then yes I would be concerned. But not by some high school boy's insult.
There's no hatred between the two and it's purely his belief that got to his head. He said he feels terrible about hurting my daughter's feeling because she's a good friend to him. My forgiving daughter already forgave him but it probably won't change his point of view as a big picture.
Likewise if someone made the comment about books "from her own country" I would not have been insulted either. I would just assume that the teacher was not aware of where my D was born.
P.S. This guys has very little friends and my daughter probably is his only female friend. So I doubt he would have too much opportunity to offend people. He does it in social science class but you get to voice your own opinion, don't you?