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Statue-esque

TatinGTatinG 7309 replies119 threads Senior Member
The statue debate just keeps rolling with more and more historical figures getting caught up in it.

I certainly hope no one here condones vandalism. I despise it. If Confederate statues come down, it should be through lawful means: public referendum or a vote of an elected body. The statues should be placed in a museum. I don't think the statues of Confederates should be removed in battlefield parks (where they add to the historical understanding) or in cemeteries (where defacing or removing memorials to the dead is just wrong).

But.... now the activists are coming for Abraham Lincoln! . See the controversy at UW-Madison.

Fresno State has a statue of Gandhi that some students are petitioning to be removed.

U. S. Grant's statue was torn down by vandals in San Francisco. Who do they think was responsible for winning the war to free the slaves? Who freed the only slave he was gifted when he himself was very poor?

Protesters in St. Louis want the statue of King Louis IX (St. Louis) taken off Art Hill. They also want the city renamed Confluence or Scott. And they beat up those who were trying to protect the statue.

An innocent elk statue was burned in Portland. It's unclear what politically incorrect thing the elk did.

I worry for historic homes like Monticello where security measures have been stepped up.

This is just violence for the sake of violence and shows true historical ignorance and intolerance.
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Replies to: Statue-esque

  • melvin123melvin123 1880 replies34 threads Senior Member
    Anger and violence and hate is killing us.
    You are my fellow human being, my brother.
    Please, everyone, let’s stop all this hate.
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  • TatinGTatinG 7309 replies119 threads Senior Member
    When the Confederate statues come down it should be by lawful means, as I said in the first post. Not by violence and vandalism.

    But as for statues of Washington , Lincoln, Grant, Jefferson, the vandals who deface and destroy need to understand history. A person need not be perfect to be great.
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  • alhalh 8915 replies49 threads Senior Member
    edited July 4
    Two years ago a local confederate statue was toppled by protesters. That night I was at a celebratory party with white southerners, most of whom have family roots in the area going back 200 plus years. Some had children and grandchildren at the protest, supporting the toppling
    Everyone was contributing to legal defense fund for arrested protesters. .

    The next week an extremely liberal and progressive white friend, born in the Midwest, lived in CA most of her adult life, and retired to this southern community about ten years ago, sat in my parlor absolutely livid the statue hadn't been removed by lawful means. She had been out of the country when it happened. If she'd been here , as a community organizer, she would have arranged more public meetings to debate removal. There hadn't been enough discussion.

    My ill considered, automatic respose, was that we'd been talking about this in the south for decades. The statues were controversial even before they went up. I wish she'd been in town to see all the parents bring their young children to the site the next day for solemn impromptu history lessons.

    She said (loudly) "No one asked me what I thought. I wasn't around for all that discussion. This just wasn't right. Everyone didn't have a voice in this decision"


    I understood and sympathized with her point of view, but don't find it very practical. Even before considering whose voice really matters with regard to these monuments.


    Still good friends. She's still mad about the monuments.


    I still think she's just flat out wrong

    edited July 4
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  • inthegardeninthegarden 1789 replies31 threads Senior Member
    ^ 1868.
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  • inthegardeninthegarden 1789 replies31 threads Senior Member
    @alh, that’s one of the most powerful things I have ever read.
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  • alhalh 8915 replies49 threads Senior Member
    edited July 4
    It's the answer to any debate.

    It's all I'm posting on any monument thread going foward.
    edited July 4
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  • ucbalumnusucbalumnus 83795 replies743 threads Senior Member
    alh wrote: »
    The next week an extremely liberal and progressive white friend, born in the Midwest, lived in CA most of her adult life, and retired to this southern community about ten years ago, sat in my parlor absolutely livid the statue hadn't been removed by lawful means.

    She said (loudly) "No one asked me what I thought. I wasn't around for all that discussion. This just wasn't right. Everyone didn't have a voice in this decision"

    Hmmm, maybe a sense of self-entitlement?

    Also, "extremely liberal and progressive" on some issues does not necessarily mean that on all issues. Also, some parts of the Midwest and California are (or were) racially conservative.
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  • roycroftmomroycroftmom 4597 replies40 threads Senior Member
    It would be a good time to remember the problem of selective enforcement-if we do not prosecute those who pulled down Lee, we won't prosecute those who pull down Lincoln, either. Maybe the answer is to have statues erected to no one, but is this how adults would decide that result-by mobs running around pulling down everything in sight?
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