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Stanford vs. Princeton

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Replies to: Stanford vs. Princeton

  • BaelorBaelor Registered User Posts: 3,640 Senior Member
    I apologize and invalidate your complaint by clarifying I meant diverse racially when I made that comment you quoted

    The amendment is noted. Nevertheless, we still haven't gotten any closer to resolving the general claim of Princeton not being as diverse.

    So although I agree that Princeton is less diverse racially, I DON'T accept with evidence the claim that Princeton is less diverse (even on a socioeconomic level).

    EC pops.? Not entirely sure what that is, sorry.

    East Coast.


    And you're exactly right -- the geographic diversity is not so clear-cut. On the other hand, it is easy to tag a school as not very diverse geographically if, for example, 90% of students are in-state.
  • Omega SanctionOmega Sanction Registered User Posts: 172 Junior Member
    So although I agree that Princeton is less diverse racially, I DON'T accept with evidence the claim that Princeton is less diverse (even on a socioeconomic level).

    According to Best Colleges - Education - US News and World Report, here is a list of the Ivy League + Stanford by percentage of Pell Grant recipients (very low income students in the context of college students as a whole)

    Columbia - 17%
    Dartmouth - 15%
    Harvard - 14%
    Cornell - 14%
    Stanford - 13%
    Brown - 12%
    University of Pennsylvania - 11%
    Princeton - 10%
    Yale - 10%

    Princeton ranks 2nd to last (assuming US News actually breaks ties at the two significant digit level). The only reason I don't quickly conclude from this that Princeton is less socioeconomically diverse than its peers is that the percentage of Pell Grant recipients only tells part of the story. Unfortunately, the rest of the story probably doesn't come with enough open data. I am, however, inclined to think favorably of Princeton due to Princeton's more distinguishable financial aid policies at higher levels of income, but this is difficult to prove.
  • gedion9324gedion9324 Registered User Posts: 209 Junior Member
    @johnAdams What I mean is that since I am relativey well off by my country's standards, I get to meet the few people in my country who are aware of American universities. And they have all heard of Harvard and Yale-(news, shows etc). Some have also heard of Princeton but all of them don't consider it in the same league as Harvard and Yale. Among the laymen, this seems to be the case. One of the many reasons that the majority of cross-admits prefer Yale and Harvard to Princeton. Infact, before I even really seriously considered going abroad for education I held the same notions about these great universities.

    However after significant research, I came to the conclusion that Princeton's undergraduate education is unrivaled. And among the people that matter (graduate school admission officers and employers), Princeton is considered just as good as Harvard and Yale. Again the keyword is prestige not quality.
    [exerpt from long June 7, 2005 article in USA Today on the magic of the Harvard 'brand name."]

    "There isn't any doubt that brand matters and that Harvard is the prestige brand," says Stanley Katz, director of Princeton University's Center for Arts and Cultural Policy Studies. "It's the Gucci of higher education, the most selective place."

    "It used to be the case that of students who were admitted to Harvard and Princeton or Harvard and Yale, seven of 10 would choose to go to Harvard," Katz says. "It may be more now. There is a tendency for the academically best to skew even more to Harvard. We just get our socks beat off in those cases."

    http://www.usatoday.com/money/2005-0...ard-usat_x.htm

    EDIT: Sorry but I think the link doesn't work...whoops.
  • PtonAlumnusPtonAlumnus Registered User Posts: 253 Junior Member
    Minder I have great respect for Stanford. I am suggesting that you consider giving more thought and research before making comments. Your Stanford classmates and professors will hold you to a higher standard than you have experienced in high school.

    Omega, PtonGrad2000, and Baelor, have made more factual contributions to the difficult topic of diversity. Thank you minder for the link to Stanford's Common Data Set. JHS for some reason lurks on the Princeton board; he is certainly no homer for Princeton but his comments are factual and informative. When you discuss race, religion, background, sexual orientation, political viewpoint, and region of origin you might avoid superficial impressions. These topics are too sensitive for many people.

    Universities will by their geographic location be diverse in different ways. Boston's substantial Jewish population suggests that Harvard, MIT, Brandies, BC, and other Boston area universities will have a larger Jewish student body than Utah. Similarly the substantial Asian population in California may lead to a higher percentage of Asians at Berkeley, Stanford, USC, etc.

    To Omega's comment “arguing that Princeton is more diverse than its peers is a bad route. “ I have not made that statement. I find the topic of diversity too complex to try to make such a statement. If Princeton has more XYZ students than Stanford but fewer ABC students which is more diverse? I simply stated Princeton's diversity facts, the publications that have endorsed Princeton as a welcoming environment for students, and the steps Princeton has taken to make the university a welcoming environment for all students. I have not compared Princeton to any other university.

    I do not know if Pell Grants [named for Senator Claiborne Pell ’40] are a good measure for Princeton since Princeton provides all grant, no loan, scholarships to students. If you are admitted to Princeton you do not need a Pell Grant.

    NJDS, I did not intend to hijack this thread. You seem to be strongly leaning towards Stanford. Stanford is a fantastic university. When I interviewed a student for Princeton this year he told me he was also applying to Harvard and Stanford; he asked me to compare the schools to Princeton. I blurted out that Stanford and Harvard have more in common with Princeton than differences. I should have talked about Princeton undergraduate focus but what I said is true. Once a student has decided on a university I wish them well at their chosen university. I believe in a post you said you visited Princeton recently but did not talk to many students. Rather than tell you about the WWS or biology I suggest if you are truly still undecided to return to the Princeton campus. Visit the student center and talk to students. Tell admissions that you would like to talk to a WWS representative about the Program in Global Health. A posting on CC now should not be much of an influence on your decision. Ask your guidance counselor if you can take a day off from HS to visit Princeton. You have a choice between two great universities; there is no wrong decision.
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