<p>[Boy</a>, 11, charged with killing father’s fiancee, who was 8 months pregnant - jealous of dad’s love](<a href=“http://www.nydailynews.com/news/us_world/2009/02/21/2009-02-21_boy_11_charged_with_killing_fathers_fian.html]Boy”>http://www.nydailynews.com/news/us_world/2009/02/21/2009-02-21_boy_11_charged_with_killing_fathers_fian.html)</p>
<p>another victim of the right to bear arms. WHY did the kid have access to the gun. Is the father culpable for not securing the weapon??</p>
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<p>He certainly is, IMO.</p>
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<p>did you read the article?
It was his gun, so he was exercising his constitutional right to bear arms. Would you feel better if he had stabbed the woman with a butcher’s knife? Or he could have doused the room in gasoline and burned the house down. This is a very sick story, but I don’t see it as a compelling case against guns.</p>
<p>I’m very sorry for the victims in this case. The father’s culpable two ways: First, he did a LOUSY job of teaching his boy about being a responsible citizen. And second, he didn’t secure the weapon.</p>
<p>I’m getting tired of repeating this in “Yet another senseless death” threads, but it remains true: When I was growing up EVERYONE had guns and NOONE was threatened, much less killed. There’s a lot of bad parenting going on out there these days.</p>
<p>I wonder if this boys single parent had been his mother would there be this knee jerk reaction to condemn her for a murder? </p>
<p>No. I’m not really wondering about that. We all know the answer to the question.</p>
<p>Are you saying that because it was the kid’s own gun it was okay to let him (or any of the other kids in the house) have access to it whenever they wanted to. </p>
<p>Yes, he could have killed her by stabbing or burning the house down. Alot more murders are committed by handguns vs stabbing or arson.</p>
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<p>Makes me wonder when you grew up…and whether you had access to broadcast or print media.</p>
<p>It should be a crime for an 11 year old to own a gun.</p>
<p>Wow, this is insane. How can a child be allowed to own a gun? It’s illegal for him to drink alcohol, drive, vote, join the military or drop out of school, but it’s okay for him to own and use a gun? I really don’t get it. This is a child without sufficient cognitive development and judgment to be in control of something that can kill another person.</p>
<p>Agreed - they should lock up the legislature for gross negligence and general stupidity.</p>
<p>“It was his gun, so he was exercising his constitutional right to bear arms. Would you feel better if he had stabbed the woman with a butcher’s knife? Or he could have doused the room in gasoline and burned the house down. This is a very sick story, but I don’t see it as a compelling case against guns.”</p>
<p>Realistically, of the scenarios listed, the least likely chance of the woman’s survival comes from the child wielding a handgun.</p>
<p>A shotgun is a pretty good choice when you intend to shoot someone in the head while they’re in bed. He had previously won a shooting competition with the gun.</p>
<p>Did he ‘own’ it? I know most states you can ‘own’ at 16 but can’t buy till 18. I’d be leery of the story, news stories about guns are notoriously bad. </p>
<p>Another victim of the right to bear arms. This is coming from someone in philthydelphia where you have gangbangers murdering civilians and cops? lol. Witty sue, real witty.</p>
<p>I would put the murderers of police officers to death by firing squad if it were up to me. We have buried 4 in the past year. </p>
<p>I heard on the news today that the gun was a Christmas present.</p>
<p><a href=“http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=news/local&id=6671513[/url]”>http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=news/local&id=6671513</a>
this is closer to home… </p>
<p>this was last night
<a href=“http://www.philly.com/inquirer/local/20090222_Fighting_couple_dead_in_city_fire.html[/url]”>Fighting couple dead in city fire;
<p>One account I read indicated that there is no requirement in that state for a shotgun owned by a minor to be registered. Can any CCers confirm this?</p>
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Lots of <18 y/o boys had guns in rural and semi-rural areas. It was often a .410 or 20ga shotgun or sometimes a .22 rifle. I think a lot of people who grow up in the city have no idea.</p>
<p>I agree that there’s bad parenting going on here. The father with an 11 y/o boy impregnates a woman who already has kids, presumably from another father, isn’t married to the woman even though she’s due in two weeks, and either isn’t aware of the negative effect it’s having on his son, even though other family seem to know about it, or he didn’t address the issues which should have included taking care with the gun, but really should have included being aware of what his relationship with this woman was inflicting on his son.</p>
<p>This was a disturbed kid who was the result of poor parenting and being placed in a situation kids shouldn’t have to deal with. I think the takeaway from this article shouldn’t be the focus on the gun itself but rather, the parent who placed his kid in the situation and didn’t focus on what’s best for the kid as opposed the parent’s own desires.</p>
<p>As for the quote about growing up in a time when everyone had a gun and no one was threatened or killed–
Our rural relatives all grew up with guns (rifles). All considered themselves responsible gun owners. This did not stop my uncle from accidentally blasting part of his neck off one day. He was discovered by his five year old daughter. Their family was never the same. In another case here in the suburbs two boys got hold of a (presumed) hidden pistol and unintentionally shot their babysitter. Obviously there are accidents of all kinds just waiting to happen, but having guns around children is not a chance I’d ever take.</p>
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And yet, he was “charged as an adult.” That’s the part of the story that caught my eye. In what way is an 11-year-old an adult? He’s in the fifth grade.</p>
<p>I find it fascinating how we can view the same thing through entirely different lens. It’s just a values thing, so I don’t mean to turn this into a conflict or hold any delusions that I would convince someone of my viewpoint on a web forum. Still it intrigues me. </p>
<p>In my neck of the woods, whether a family appears traditional or not is far from indicative of good or bad parenting or the quality of the child’s environment. People sometimes choose divorce, or sometimes spouses leave or die. Blended families are not particularly unusual. Of the blended families I know, they appear to be fabulous parents and they have normal, well adjusted kids as far as I can tell. I also know some single parents who I am in absolute awe of their abilities; and some who would be better off getting remarried to get the financial or parenting support they need. </p>
<p>Likewise, I know more than a few folks in longterm marriages with children that should not be, where the family environment is completely toxic for their children, with isolation, verbal abuse, affairs etc. I guess my main point is that there are great home environments and crap home environments, and the composition of the family is not necessarily an indicator. </p>
<p>On the other hand, allowing an 11 year old to have access to firearms without adult supervision seems most definitely like bad parenting to me. I honestly can’t see how it can be perceived any other way but I’m open to learning otherwise.</p>
<p>[Cops:</a> 11-year-old killed daddy’s pregnant lover - The Trentonian News: Serving Trenton and surrounding communities. (trentonian.com)](<a href=“http://www.trentonian.com/articles/2009/02/22/news/doc49a0c76384c10858924251.txt]Cops:”>http://www.trentonian.com/articles/2009/02/22/news/doc49a0c76384c10858924251.txt)</p>
<p>I happened to see this in the news box today in Princeton.</p>