3000 miles or 5000 miles

<p>Hi parents,
this may seem trivial but do you change oil @ 3000 mi or 5000 mi intervals ?</p>

<p>Specs:
the new car manual has stamp slots for 5000mi intervals, so if I chg at 3k, it will screw up the slots. On other hand will I be helping my car’s longevity if I chg @ 3k ? </p>

<p>I use 5-20W blended if it makes any difference. My daily travel is near ideal. 12 miles to work one way that included 5 mi at turnpike speed so the car is fully warmed up.</p>

<p>I decided the 0-20W synthetic is not for me. Research found too many bearing noises when car reaches mid life. It’s just too thin a oil and wont stick to crucial engine parts.</p>

<p>Perhaps the best essay I’ve read on the Oil Change:</p>

<p>The 3000 Mile Myth
The 3000 mile oil change interval has been pounded into people’s heads for decades. It had a scientific basis when engines used non-multi-weight, non-detergent oil. It no longer has any scientific basis, but it is still being promoted by certain entities, most notably the oil change industry in the United States. This myth is also sometimes known as the “Cheap Insurance Myth.”</p>

<p>The 3000 Mile Fact
There are still vehicles that need 3K oil changes, but it’s not because the oil goes bad after 3K miles. One example is the Saturn S series. These vehicles have a timing chain system that is very sensitive to clean oil because oil pressure is used as hydraulic fluid to ratchet up the timing chain tensioner. If varnish forms in the timing chain tensioner bore then this system can fail and the chain will become loose and eventually break. Dealers have gone as far as tearing out the normal service schedule (6000 miles) and leaving only the severe service schedule. If your engine is destroyed (under warranty) by a failed timing chain then the dealer will legitimately request evidence of oil changes. Unfortunately this problem usually won’t manifest itself during the warranty period.</p>

<p>Oil change intervals with synthetic oil
Synthetic oils withstand higher temperatures before breaking down, and have more base stock and less viscosity modifiers. Synthetics wear out, become acidic, and eventually become saturated with suspended soot particles, just like regular oil. Again, an oil analysis is a good investment to determine the optimum oil change interval. Never exceed the manufacturer requirements for normal service. </p>

<p>Filter Change Interval
Back in the days of 3000 mile oil changes many manufacturers recommended filter changes only half as often because the filter did not become clogged with dirt at only 3000 miles. This was good advice back then, especially because with non-detergent motor oils a lot of the sludge remained stuck to internal engine parts rather than being carried in the oil to the filter. Nowadays the filter should be changed at every oil change. There are some people who believe so much in synthetic oil that they change filters without changing the oil. There’s no harm in changing the filter without changing the oil, but there is no point in doing this.</p>

<p>Quick-Lube (and dealer) Problems to Watch Out For</p>

<ol>
<li><p>SAE30 oil. Some quick-lube places have been known to offer advertised specials that use SAE 30 oil, as opposed to 5W30 or 10W30. Pay the extra for the proper oil, or better yet avoid merchants that try to pull this kind of thing because it’s an indicator that they are less than honest.</p></li>
<li><p>Trying to use the wrong oil because it’s what they have in bulk. Insist on the oil that is specified on your filler cap and in your manual.</p></li>
<li><p>Pumping the oil out through the dipstick hole instead of removing the drain plug. I came across this gem when I asked if I needed to bring my own copper drain plug gasket. They said that they didn’t remove the drain plug to drain the old oil. This was the Oil Changer location at Kifer & Wolfe in Sunnyvale, California. Pumping the oil out through the dipstick hole is a terrible way to get the old oil out because it leaves a lot of junk in the bottom of the oil pan. This was a long time ago and maybe they’ve changed their ways since then.</p></li>
<li><p>Selling unneeded and overpriced services such as engine flushes.</p></li>
<li><p>Selling overpriced, and often low quality, parts such as wiper blades and washer fluid, PCV valves, thermostats, etc. Never let a quick-lube place do any mechanical work on your vehicle… They do no use journeyman mechanics.</p></li>
<li><p>Using poor quality filters. You really want to bring your own filter, from the dealer, with you when you go to a quick-lube place. They may take $1 or $2 off the price if you do this but don’t count on it.</p></li>
<li><p>If you have a vehicle that actually still has Zerk fittings to lubricate then be sure that they actually lubricate these fitting. Most cars no longer require lubrication but some trucks still do.</p></li>
<li><p>Do not let a quick-lube place change or add any fluids other than oil. No transmission fluid, no brake fluid, no power steering fluid, no antifreeze, no oil additives, no fuel additives. It is just too easy for them to use the wrong fluid and cause permanent damage to your vehicle.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>For some horror stories about Jiffy Lube see:
<a href=“http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/jiffy_lube.htm[/url]”>http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/jiffy_lube.htm&lt;/a&gt; .</p>

<p>I’ve always changed my own oil and will usually do it between 3K and 4K miles. I’d rather err on the side that would protect my engine more. The reason for oil changes isn’t just to replace oil that might have broken down somewhat but also to purge the system of any dirt or water that might be in the oil. I always change the filter when I change the oil as well. I don’t use synthetics because I don’t think the price is worth it for the vehicles I have and my vehicles didn’t come from the factory with it or require it. If the car came with synthetics and the manufacturer specified recommended them, then I’d use them. Not all engines are built the same so it’s good to refer to the manufacturer’s requirements. </p>

<p>My cars last a long time. My 1998 Dodge has >160K miles on it and my 1966 Mustang has at least a few hudred thousand miles on it (but has >100K miles since I rebuilt the engine just because I was restoring the car).</p>

<p>I change the oil myself rather than take the car to an oil change place because I don’t really trust that the oil change places will be as diligent as me, buying the oil and filters is inexpensive, and it takes me less time to change the oil myself than taking it somewhere to have it done. I use Chevron Supreme 10W-30 from Costco which is pretty inexpensive. I take the used oil and filters to the auto parts store for recycling. There was one time in my life I ever had someone else change the oil - I had the dealer change the oil in my D’s car because it was new and a free oil change. Fortunately when the car returned home I popped the hood to check the oil due to my concerns about others not being as diligent. It turns out they neglected to put the oil filler cap back on and it was nowhere to be found. it’s a good thing I noticed it before a lot of dirt and moisture had a chance to get in and ruin the engine. If the engine had been ruined I imagine the dealer would have accused me of misplacing the cap. As it was they were very apologetic and gave us a new cap.</p>

<p>My last two cars have had recommended change intervals of 5000 for severe conditions and 10000 for regular use. Lots of short trips especially in cold weather qualify as severe use. One car gets changed at the 5k interval because of this; the other qualifies for “normal” use.</p>

<p>Clearly the oil change shops and service garages want to have you change at 3k. This is really obsolete for almost any modern car. There are a few exceptions including some late model Toyotas that were prone to sludge problems due to poor engine design. My last “commuter” vehicle was a Izuzu Trooper. This was a heavy vehicle with a small over-worked engine. The engine was going strong at 280k miles when I decided to replace it due to transmission problems and body rust. I never changed oil under 5k and probably averaged closer to 10k intervals.</p>

<p>In my opinion those of you who think that frequent oil changes are needed, or are cheap insurance, are just wasting time and money. Follow the manufacturer’s recommendations - which are even grossly conservative.</p>

<p>We do it between 3 and 5K. All our cars have an engine oil life setting which shows a percentage. When it gets to about 85 I schedule to take them in.</p>

<p>I like to target 5-6K or every ~5 months. I think that if I change the oil too often, I become the source of engine contamination. The Camry the filter gets easily changed. The Civic gets changed with difficulty. The Prius, we bought the lifetime oil change package (3k change schedule).</p>

<p>I change mine regularly at 3k miles. One time I screwed up and lost track of the miles and did it around 5 and the oil was absolutely filthy. My car is really really easy to change the oil on. </p>

<p>Agree with longprime about Civics… my younger sisters is a pain in the butt to change the oil on.</p>

<p>My mechanic wants all 4 of our cars in at 3,000. My 10 year old Navigator and I have decided to go between 3,000-5,000. I will say all our car are in good condition, so maybe he is right to have us in at 3,000. I have been using the same mechanic for 21 years and our older cars are 10 and 12 years old; I guess we are doing something right!</p>

<p>Husband uses synthetic oil so that he does not have to change oil as often, ie the oil is cleaner. So he changes every 8000 miles eventhough he technically does not have to change every 15,000 miles. Our cars are in good condition and we keep them more than 10 years in good condition.</p>

<p>UCLA Im like you. I used to changed by own oil. In fact I went so far as pour as much of the new oil into new filter as possible before fitting it. That way when you first crank the engine, it needed less time to course through the filter. How many people do that :)</p>

<p>Can we hear from others how often they change their oil ? It would help if you also tell us how old is your car if you dont find it intrusive.</p>

<p>ucsd
Once again, I’m impressed with your knowledge. I never thought to check under hood for lids. I will from now on.</p>

<p>By the way, Justamom thanks for the detail report. </p>

<p>Which model/year of Toyota has engine sludge problem? I just bought an 09 Camry 4 cyl.</p>

<p>We have 3 cars–a 2000 Toyota Sienna Van, a 1998 Volvo sedan and a 1992 BMW. All of them run great and we change the oil about 5000 miles. Before getting the 1998 Volvo, we had a 1983 Volvo & other than significant rust on the body (HI salt air is tough on metal) it ran great too.</p>

<p>Calif_dad: sorry I don’t know the exact years or engines. I believe at least one with a problem was the Rav4 about 2003. I am pretty sure this issue was fixed several years ago. I have always had great luck with my Toyotas. I guess I am a little lax with my 1993 Corolla. I seem to change the oil about once or twice a year hopefully under 10k miles intervals, but maybe not.</p>

<p>ucsd-etc dad, where do you take the oil ? In our area it’s pretty hard to find someone who will accept it, which is why we went to having it done at the SortaFastLube places. At least they are forced to handle it in an environtmentally correct way. </p>

<p>Totallly unrelated; back in the 70’s I totally checked a guy off the “serious potential” list because he took his car to the shop to get the oil changed. If he couldn’t do it himself on his '71 Pinto, I just wasn’t interested!</p>

<p>I take the oil to an auto parts store - usually Autozone or Kragen (big chains). They all seem to accept recycled oil around here. They have a big metal bin in the back designed to take the oil. One of them even gave out plastic free oil receptacles that can hold a number of changes before needing to take it in and dump it. I assume they actually make some money from this used oil but I’m not sure but it gets you in the store and encourages people to buy oil, filters, and other things there so it makes sense for them to accept the used oil. If you’re ever looking for a place to bring the oil, call some of the big auto parts chains to see if they accept it.</p>

<p>come to think of it what DO they do with used motor oil ? Its got to full of carbon deposits and tiny metals.</p>

<p>Calif_dad, I think some early 2000’s 6-cylinder Camrys (and Lexus vehicles with the same type of engines) had engine sludge problems, but I could be off.</p>

<p>In our state, I think they encourage folks to put in in kitty litter or similar & throw it in the trash for incineration with the H-Power plant. Have not heard of anywhere oil can be taken in HI but I’ll ask my mechanic tomorrow when I see him.</p>

<p>You cannot put it in your trash in CA.</p>