<p>The teacher who awards “bladder points” is actually a wonderful classroom teacher whose students score very high on state end of course testing each year. I think she provides the easy extra credit because she is such a demanding teacher overall. There are daily graded quizzes, daily graded homework assignments, weekly challenging word problems that must be perfect to get a good grade, and very thorough chapter tests, midterms, and finals. In our state, it is all about shining through the state end of course tests every year. Therefore, if the teacher is succeeding in producing high scores, her tactics are not usually questioned very much.</p>
<p>marite: I may have misunderstood your statement: “Unless a high school is a magnet or private school, it draws from a larger pool of students of varying abilities.” </p>
<p>My daughter attended a public magnet high school, and the magnet schools in our state draw from all over a big county. It’s a large high school with a very diverse student population, and offers all the classes you mention, including: regular, remedial, honors, AP, IB. I’m curious to know what states claim magnet schools that are on a par with private schools (in terms of being able to pick and choose top students). Maybe you meant charter schools? Just curious.</p>
<p>I mean schools such as TJHSS (VA), AAST (NJ), Stuyvesant (NY) Boston Latin (MA), that is, exam schools.</p>
<p>marite: Ah…I’m familiar with Stuyvesant… Yes, I’ve never before heard those types of schools referred to as magnet schools. Magnet (in our area, at least) means something totally different. Even though the ones you mention are public schools, they are indeed run like private schools. At least Stuyvesant, the only one with which I am familiar, requires high test scores to gain acceptance? At any rate, yes, magnet means something totally different. I think it’s good to clarify that.</p>
<p>Jack:</p>
<p>In which way is your D’s school a public magnet, as opposed to an ordinary public school?</p>
<p>6.0 grade scales, 5.5 grade scales, 5.0 grade scales, 4.0 grade scales, weighted GPAs etc etc, the bottom line is grades are not comparable from district to district or school to school. In many a school they are more a measure of compliance, behavior, and malleability than of academic accomplishment. That is why we have standardized tests and admisssions departments use them.</p>
<p>The bashers of standardized tests can bash them all they want, and some of the criticism is valid, but the bottom line is they are the only tool available for objectively measuring students across districts and schools and curriculums. Doing well on the SAT or ACT is the best and maybe only shot a non-minority kid from a rural, small toen, or working class school has at getting into a highly selective private college or university.</p>
<p>have to agree with patuxent, i’m in same situation with my s. his gc told us that s has the highest SAT score since he;s been gc at poor, rural hs. yet my s doesn;t have highest gpa. he;s currently 7/125, those ahead of him are not only not taking all the most challenging courses, they are taking some of the “mickey mouse” easy A courses. i sincerely hope our school will have a complete profile for the adcoms, and thank you to all on this site for all your valuable “heads up” you’ve given me and s</p>
<p>momof3teens - 7/125 is nothing to sniff at either. If your school doesn’t have an “effective” profile sheet to submit (and doesn’t develop one in time for your S’ apps) you can try to make sure the GC describes the challenge level of his coursework vs. others with higher “rank”.</p>
<p>Or - and check with others on this board to make sure this is a good idea - perhaps your S can find a way in a short essay (not his main essay) to mention that he has chosen to take most challenging courseload despite knowing that it will cost him the val/high rank among classmates. The common app has a “catch all” section for additional info and he ought to be able to fashion a well-worded statement covering this issue, if need be.</p>
<p>thanks jmmom- s is statrting outlines for essays on commonapp and supps. thatis a good idea to get some of his coursework info to be highlighted</p>
<p>Like I say, having the GC cover it might be best. But see if you get some feedback from others re my second suggestion (that S cover it in a well-worded “additional statement”). If not, run the idea in a separate thread to make sure you get feedback from the best cc minds on the best way for your S to showcase what he has done. He deserves to make sure his choice to challenge himself comes across somehow.</p>
<p>Good luck and keep us posted.</p>
<p>I agree with patuxent. This is why I have heard of the standardized tests called the great equalizer.</p>
<p>marite: Our schools are county-wide, and one can choose to attend his or her ‘neighborhood school,’ whether elementary, middle, or high school. The neighborhood schools are large and public, usually within walking distance, and mostly in leafy and lovely surburban neighborhoods. Magnet schools, also public, were initially created to draw kids away from their suburban neighborhood schools (like a magnet) into inner city schools for integration–basically voluntary integration. These schools receive money for special programs and also offer superior academics and excellent well-qualified teachers, across the board. Often, each magnet school has a theme (some focus on art or technology; others are known for rigorous academics), but they are all standouts in every program they offer. And the schools are culturally diverse. Every family has a base school (the neighborhood school), but you have to apply to a magnet school. Every child can get into a magnet, but he may be not always get his first choice magnet school. That often depends on your district. But that is the extent of the selectivity. There is no entrance exam or testing, as in the schools you mentioned in your earlier post. Consequently, there is a wide range of type of student and student ability, but they all have access to the same great programs and outstanding teaching.</p>
<p>One would think that every student would want to attend a magnet, and every parent would want all that the magnets have to offer, but the neighborhood schools are also full. Many people don’t want to go into the inner city neighborhoods, nor do they desire a diverse student population–so that’s their choice. My daughter’s middle magnet school, for instance, was just an amazing school that prepared her very well for the rigorous academics she faced at her magnet high school. The down-side, of course, is often a school that is very run down, in need of serious renovation, and sometimes across the street from project housing–as was her middle school. The neighborhoods where magnets are located are perceived as dangerous, and quite often, they are. </p>
<p>My daughter attended a fine private school in Manhattan, where we lived for several years. When we moved to our present location, we put her in a large public magnet school and never looked back. I thought each magnet she attended was terrific and certainly far superior to any private school she ever attended–without a doubt.</p>
<p>Thanks for the explanation, Jack. We have similar schools in our district, except they’re not called magnets, and they’re intended strictly for children in the district. We have limited school choice. Some families prefer neighborhood schools; others choose schools on the basis of their curriculum and pedagogy and have their children bused to the school.
Now I think of it, I should have used “exam school” instead of “magnet school.”</p>
<p>60% of kids at our local public high school have “straight A averages.” Parents LOVE this about the school! On the other hand, the median SAT there last year was 950. :)</p>
<p>Just want to add my two cents on the importance of an accurate school profile… and the distribution of GPA’s is really just the tip of the iceberg. If your kid is applying to engineering schools with Calc AB and Honors Physics and your profile lists that your school offers BC Calc and AP Physics, you may have a problem. Our local HS hasn’t had AP Physics in several years… teacher retired, can’t be replaced, but the profile never changes. </p>
<p>Similarly, the demographic info about your school-- % subsidized lunch, % of homes where English isn’t spoken, etc. is very important if your school is unknown… there’s a reason why a kid with high stats from Chappaqua or Great Neck won’t have a snowballs chance of getting in to some colleges, whereas the same stats from an unknown HS in the Bronx might make the kid an admissions officer’s dream.</p>
<p>Read your profile! If it is not accurate, and your school is relatively unknown to the colleges your kid is applying to, it will hurt you. Our HS was always proud of the stupid, PC names it gave some classes… but Adcoms like to see “American Literature” or “European History” since they know those are serious, academic classes. “women’s perspectives on work and leisure” sounds like Chick Lit lite, especially when it’s competing with band, photography, year book, and “community service” as full credit classes. Made us sound like a summer camp, courtesy of the taxpayers.</p>
<p>carolyn, I find that so strange.</p>
<p>blossom, I’m expecting exactly that. Our school lists as available BC Calc and AP Chem. AP Chem hasn’t been there this century, and BC Calc? Let’s just say D will be quite familiar with a computer monitor taking it on-line from EPGY at Stanford because she and her cohort in crime are the first kids to take it. Ever.</p>
<p>I remember reading an essay by James Fallows (former USNWR editor) in The Atlantic in which he asserts that, despite all the criticism, the SAT is actually increasing in importance as an admissions tool, because of the vagaries of high school gpas and profiles, and the seemingly ever-increasing numbers of applications to be processed. To me this makes sense. So I agree with patuxent and others here. There’s no problem with the profile supplied by well-known schools, but the vast majority may not be readily accepted. So the SAT remains, for the great majority, the best way for brilliant kids from little-known places to stand out.</p>
<p>carolyn, I find that so strange.</p>
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<p>As do I. However, it is true at this particular school – The 60% number was actually quoted to us by a school Guidance Counselor as a reason why we should switch our son there from his private school, because she noted the two B+'s on his transcript. When I asked about the SAT medians, meanwhile, she sidestepped the issue until I really pressed before admitting the median was only 950. To be fair the school has only had two graduating classes so far so test scores may rise.</p>
<p>On the other hand, I have talked to enough kids, parents, and teachers in our community to get a sense of what is required to get an A: all of the math classes are “computer based” which means students sit in a room with 30-40 computers and work at their own pace on math software. Math teachers lecture once a week, otherwise it is all computer learning. Tests are done on the computer when you reach the end of the software section. One student told me that it is pretty easy to guess what the test questions will be. English/Social studies is a combined class which also uses computers extensively for reading “tests” of assigned books. My daughter’s best friend, who is in “honors” English was shocked to find out that my daughter had actually read ALL of Romeo and Juliet in 10th grade because her class had just read excerpts on the computer. There are lots of “projects” involving power point presentations but very few actual written papers assigned. The school is also on a block system which means you have math/science for one four month term a year and then switch to English/social sciences for the rest of the year. Effectively, this means that some kids actually do not do much writing or reading for half of the school year. </p>
<p>As I said, many parents are thrilled to see their kids getting straight A’s without having to do much homework but reality hits when it comes time to apply to colleges and those same straight A kids can’t crack 1000 on the SATs or get above 500 on the SAT II’s. In California, that is the kiss of death because the UC’s rely so heavily on test scores in their admissions formula, so the majority of kids from the two graduating classes have ended up at our local community college. I know many of these kids from elementary school and they certainly were not below average then (our elementary school district is separate from the high school district and consistently has very good test scores.) The really sad part is that several of the smartest kids my daughter was in elementary school with have actually dropped out of high school and are pursuing alternate educations (i.e., home schooling and alternative high schools) because they were incredibly bored at the local public.</p>
<p>Needless to say, I was relieved when, after spending a day at the school, my son decided to stick with his current school, even though it means a long commute.</p>
<p>Carolyn, what a strange, sad school. I felt like I was reading something out of Orwell or Farenheit 451 or some other sci-fi classic dealing with a future where being intelligent, exceptional and/or intellectually curious is seen as a negative.</p>
<p>It’s particularly frustrating to me: I was involved with a school bond campaign so that our small town could build our own high school and thus be a K-12 district. The bond passed, one of the few to pass in the past decade in the state of California. We had enough money to build the school and a family in our town offered to DONATE 100 acres of land for the high school site. All looked good. </p>
<p>Then the high school district held a meeting and pointed out that as a SMALL high school, our athletic teams would play in the small school league, but if our town gave the money from the bond to the high school district, they would build a BIGGER high school that would play in the larger school league. </p>
<p>I still remember that meeting: there was this sudden surge of parents saying “Well, of course we don’t want OUR Johnny to play in the minor league! We want them to play in the BIG league!” The upshot was the money earmarked for the high school was thrown to the high school district, and we lost whatever control we might have had over the school. </p>
<p>It was one of the biggest disappointments in my life, and also the day I decided that I’d be shelling out bucks to send my kids to a school where academics matter more than athletics. :(</p>