A current look inside IVY athletic recruiting

<p>Getting</a> in: Athletes? road to admission - The Daily Princetonian</p>

<p>Thanks stemit. Be sure to read the comments following the article. For the sake of Princeton undergrad athletes, I hope that prof is the exception. The characterization of P athletes is also completely unflattering, and I assume not accurate. I hope some P alums and current students will shed some light.</p>

<p>The comments are very interesting.</p>

<p>The article is what I would expect. A good roadmap for those who aspire to be Ivy athletes.</p>

<p>The first few comments are outrageous, and narrow minded. For the sake of Princeton students, I hope they are not coming from a professor as suggested.</p>

<p>The athletes commenting there are doing nothing to help their case, that’s for sure. I’d agree with the prof that bad behavior such as he mentions needs to be dealt with, and handled consistently in every case–athlete or not. But I’m certain that there are non-athletes who similarly misbehave and also non-athletes who fail to apply themselves once admitted. In addition, from what D was told during OV’s, don’t most coaches keep an eye on their athletes’ academic performance–even Ivy coaches? I can’t imagine too many stars would be allowed to slack off on their studies or put themselves at risk for academic probation. Too much has been invested in them for a coach to sit idly by and allow that.</p>

<p>…“from what D was told during OV’s, don’t most coaches keep an eye on their athletes’ academic performance–even Ivy coaches?”</p>


<p>100% True. My son and all freshmen were required to meet with Ivy head coach every Friday for 15 minutes to review grades and academic standing. My son is not required to meet with head coach any more. However, head coach is available to facilitate tutoring if needed. That is a great safety net to have. College academics & athletics can be a huge adjustment even for the brightest of kids in the best of circumstances.</p>

<p>I know when I was in college that most varsity teams at Cornell (other than football and hockey) had higher GPAs than the school average … and I believe that is still true today at most IVY league schools. The articles makes good copy but is not new news and is not very insightful. For example, it talks about the academic qualifications of the athletic recruits … for most sports the recruits do not come close to filling roster so a substantial portion of the squads (like 1/2) get in through straight admissions … so the recruit issue is much smaller than all athletes. In adddion, the article talks about the majority of recruits being in the first band (essentially within a standard deviation of regular admits) … what wasn’t said is that about 33% of all admits to a school are in the range from average to one standard deviation below average … so while athletic recruits might be getting somethat of a break to get admitted they have a ton of company of regular admits with similar academic qualifications (who no one claims are unworthy of admission)</p>

<p>I like this excerpt from one of the comments, submitted by a past Princeton student-athlete. I think he’s got it right. Substitute “any Ivy” for “Princeton.”</p>

<p>“The thing that I keep returning to, though, is that anyone who truly doesn’t care about academics wouldn’t choose to come to Princeton in the first place. If you are a real star athlete and all you want to do is skate by in school, you go to a top D1 athletic powerhouse where you are put on full scholarship. People only choose to come to Princeton if they are comfortable shouldering the academic burden-- which in most cases means they are at least on some level interested in intellectual challenge.”</p>


I doubt those comments came from actual athletes; to me they seemed like weak attempts at parody.</p>

<p>I liked the article because it gave some real insight into what AI scores were needed. I was also interested but not surprised to learn the yield rate (92-94%) of LL recepients.</p>

<p>Re: post #8, there are reasons other than academics that an athlete might choose an Ivy over a Div. 1 powerhouse. One reason cited to D by current Ivy athletes was that they knew they’d have to work really hard to fight their way onto the varsity lineup at certain Div. 1 schools, whereas at the Ivy they’d pretty much be varsity automatically at their current athletic level. Also, since Ivies don’t redshirt, there’s a greater likelihood of a freshman contributing immediately as compared with a very competitive Div. 1 school. </p>

<p>Secondly, since average athletic scholarships for most sports are worth about $9,000 give or take, and not everyone even gets allotted athletic scholarship money, many students get better financial packages at the Ivies than at the Div. 1’s. Similarly, for the non-scholarship level athlete, the FA at top non-Ivy schools like Duke and Georgetown is not nearly as good as that of the Ivies. And for minor sports like D’s, the powerhouse Div. 1 schools typically don’t give freshmen money anyway regardless of talent. If and when the student starts producing for them, then they offer scholarship money. Typically the athlete would either be full pay or partial pay with FA fo the first two years, and then would receive anywhere from 50%-100% for the final two depending on ability. In our case, even assuming the best case scenario of FA for the first two years and 100% for the last 2, D still would have made out better at Yale or Princeton. (Regrettably, she didn’t choose either school.)</p>

<p>The University specifically bars classes from being held between 4:30 and 7:30 p.m. in order to accommodate sports and other extracurricular activities. In theory, this means student-athletes can complete their daily practice in a timely manner and have ample time in the evening to finish their schoolwork.
[Day</a> in the life: A rough playing field - The Daily Princetonian](<a href=“http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2010/11/30/27039/]Day”>http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2010/11/30/27039/)</p>

<p>That other jock school, MIT, also bars classes between 5-7 pm to accommodate their athletes.</p>


AND other ECs … I think have a planned time for ECs is a very reasonable plan if a school likes their students to participate in ECs.</p>

<p>As a high school coach, I have mixed feelings about this issue, both as it relates to admissions preferences at Ivy League schools and athletic scholarships at other Division I programs. While I have enormous respect for the value of athletic competition, it seems to me that college and universities should be spending their time and treasure trying to recruit the next Nobel or Pulitzer Prize winner rather than the next Heisman Trophy winner.</p>

<p>Additionally, the proposition that Ivy League recruited athletes genrally (or uniformly) possess athletic “elite” athletic talent (particularly in revenue generating sports) is wildly overstated. For example most football players successfully recruited by Harvard, Yale or Princeton do not rank in the top 1,000 players in their graduating year. I suspect that an applicant demonstrating that he was the 1,235 best ______ (submit any activity you wish, other than linebacker) in the country should not expect a thick envelope. </p>

<p>Inter-collegiate sports are certainly important; as is a healthy perspective.</p>

all of those comments from the “faculty”, outraged whomevers, “parents” , etc are just appalling…
I cannot believe “faculty” really wrote it–and in such a cowardly way…
and the parents’ responses are equally rude…as are the student responses… </p>

<p>Does anyone know what percentage of freshmen each year are recruited athletes,
or Questbridge
or diversity/urm s etc etc</p>

<p>artciles like this are not new news–and miss the point of the “diverse population” of the university…The whole argument in the comments about worthy/underserving vs unworth/undeserving etc is really really ugly…</p>

<p>Princeton, ( like HYD etc) is not a jock school—</p>

<p>It’s not a D1 powerhouse,
P is NOT paying athletes to play…the kids play for the love of the sport not money…and they have worked on that sport on top of great grades, scores etc.</p>

<p>FWIW Our student submitted above 700 on all sections of the SAT/corresponding ACT etc, plus above 700 on each 3 SAT2s plus high rigor and high GPA, AP exams etc etc on top of sport and leadership etc…
And there is No sports money…</p>

<p>as far as athletes scores–I dont think there are 500s like one commentor suggests…
Having scores in the 500s would not be 1 SD beneath the AI --those are “urban myth and legend” and frankly I think athletes sometimes say stuff to yank someone else’s chain…kind of like perpetuating the myth of getting athletic money to play for an ivy.</p>


You have no clue–this is wrong on so many levels…
and MIt does not recruit athletes any more than oboe players–
check out the posts by MIT Chris and the stats for jocks, vs arts, vs val. etc etc in admittance rates</p>

<p>Fogfog, I agree with your post except for the last part. He merely said that in jest to the idea that MIT is as much of a jock school as Princeton is, which it clearly is not.</p>

OK my bad–then I mis-read it.
Just can’t imagine anyone thinks that about MIT–Its bad enough the ivies get dumped on…</p>

<p>We’d be happy if our ivy bound scholar athlete got money like a big D1 recruit…our kiddo will play for the sake of the sport and is certainly no academic lightweight</p>




<p>As a physician, my professional opinion is that you have either had too much coffee or missed your valium this morning.</p>

<p>As my daughter would put it: “Mom, are you being facetious or sarcastic?” And for the record, my previous comment in post #12 was facetious and my comment above is sarcastic.</p>

<p>And actually, contrary to your assertion, I do have a clue. My son was a recruited athlete at MIT who, despite having stats in the top 50% of MIT applicant pool, was deferred EA then rejected. So, please, don’t tell me I don’t know the ins and outs of MIT recruiting. And contrary to their public stance, I do still believe that MIT plays athletic recruiting under the table more than they will admit. In my son’s case, I think the coach found someone he liked better at the last minute and went that way instead.</p>


<p>Right as I said–I mis-read it.
Our student was recruited to MIT too–and has the stats as does nearly everyone applying to MIT
Passed and chose and ivy instead</p>

<p>glad your student found a good place too</p>

<p>Have a martini
Its five oclock somewhere</p>

<p>“The University specifically bars classes from being held between 4:30 and 7:30 p.m. in order to accommodate sports and other extracurricular activities. In theory, this means student-athletes can complete their daily practice in a timely manner and have ample time in the evening to finish their schoolwork.”</p>

<p>Well, there are at least 60 classes listed in the course offerings for next spring that are held between 4:30 and 7:30 pm. Moreover, every single one of the review sessions offered last year before finals were held during practice times.</p>