I am interested submitting a pre-read for a school like brown or dartmouth, and was wondering what stats are needed to pass the preread. Are they as demanding as admissions like. 1550+ and 4.2+. I wanted to see my chances. Also do they really consider EC’s, because that is my strong suit.
The coach, if interested in you, requests a pre-read, it’s not something you can simply choose.
It depends on the sport but I have heard 1470-1490 reported as what recruits were told they needed.
Pre-reads are fairly objective. It’s about your test scores, grades and coursework. Rigor matters. The only EC they care about is your athletic one.
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Yes, the coach told me he would like to submit a pre read late june early july. I have a 4.0 W 3.8 UW, but my school doesnt have any APs for History or English, and does not weight honors classes. My course rigor is good, I take all the hardest classes that I possibly could (excpet AB instead of BC) do you think I have a solid chance. I am not the best player, but I would make a significant impact on the team.
You are fine. Pre-reads are still done in the context of your high school. Having said that, a pre read doesn’t guarantee you an offer.
I am a little confused about this statement. Regardless, coaches sometimes look for ok athletes with strong academics to average the SAT scores of top athletes with lower scores. I’d ask what kind of score he is looking for. I have met kids who were told they’d get an offer if the got a 1520+ to help the coach get the player they really wanted.
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The coach should know with 99% certainty whether the pre-read will be a problem based on your stats.
ECs don’t really matter much for the pre-read because once you’re over the threshold for stats and rigor it’s sufficient for admission (with coach support).
I’d talk to the coach about what to expect from the process, especially the timeline.
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Do you have test scores? A coach may take a weaker athlete to offset an impact player with lower scores. You mentioned that you aren’t the strongest player but you can make an impact, do you have a sense of where you rank relative to other incoming recruits in your sport?
Right now I have a 1480. I am wating for the June results though. Im not sure if that is up to par. I think I am middle of the pack. There are people that have gotten coaches support that I am better than, so that gives me some confidence, but my recruiting class is a bit stronger. Do you think 1480 is fine or should I look to take August if June doesnt turn out good?
I think that 1480 with a 3.8GPA would yield an average Academic Index score which should be fine for a middle recruit for most sports at most of the ivies. Do you mind mentioning your sport?
Just going backwards - if you’re to submit your information to coach(es) for a preread, they should be giving you a specific list of what they want to see and a deadline. That list is likely your transcript, some information about your school, and your test scores to date: it may include some other things. You shouldn’t be guessing about what you need, and since schools will shut down for the summer, you’ll want to know what you need from them.
I think you’re likely to get guidance from the coach, either before or after the pre-read, as to whether you’ll need a higher score. The range of outcomes generally goes from “you’re good” to “you would be good if you do X” (where one X might be “get a 1500 on your SAT”) to “sorry, the admissions office said no” (which does seem relatively unlikely, but we don’t have all the info here). FWIW, I’ve not heard of the schools you mentioned ever requiring a 1550+.
And you probably know this, but just in case, in most cases, coaches will submit more athletes for pre-reads than they have spots. Some of that is in case athletes don’t make it through, but it’s also so they have more choices - so you may pass a pre-read and still not get an offer. So it’s good to have options.
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Just adding for OPs benefit that coaches have a good pulse on who will or will not pass the pre read. IME kids that run into pre read problems at these schools are usually stellar athletes that the coach hopes will somehow get the ok. For the vast majority, I don’t think they waste everyone’s time with someone who might not cut it.
Even then, the coach knows what’s likely to pass muster…and on a sliding scale of the talent level of the athlete. I agree they are unlikely to waste their time, the athlete’s and admissions’ by submitting pre-reads that won’t be approved, but some might require ‘negotiation’ between coach and admissions.
OTOH, as I’ve said before, some people would be shocked at the HS academic stats of some Ivy athletes. AFAIK, the minimum Ivy AI is still 171, people can use any of the online AI to model various permutations of stats to see what gpa and test score combos are needed to get there. Obviously one would have to be a top athletic recruit if they have a bottom decile AI.
And also be a noticeably better athlete than other top athletic recruits that they are being compared or recruited against.
This varies by the sport, team/program and school of course and I would imagine it could vary a bit from year to year as some years there may be more stronger recruits than other years.
This entire thing was very muddied during the TO era. Base on the conversations we had (within our sport) I think there was a lot more “hoping for the best” that went on with some fair amount of success. My understanding is that it wasn’t until last spring that scores were required again for pre reads. In the fall before that we got a lot of “don’t worry about it to much.” Did OP ever share the sport?
Agreed things were different during TO, but still some situations are obvious…an ACT 20 is not getting submitted to admissions for example. (Yes, there are Ivy athletes who had ACT 20 or thereabouts)
Some coaches were always requiring test scores during TO, it just depends on school and sport. Hard to make any blanket recommendations without a sizable sample size…even then, things are quite dynamic from year to year.
I don’t think OP has shared the sport, which could be helpful.
Yes, I know of a 24 ACT in a high AI sport. I don’t think that would pass muster today at the some school.
Great advice. While there has always been some flexibility offer lists are flexible and adjustments do get made. The AI is back in play. Just this past cycle I know of a strong Brown T&F recruit who was asked to retake the SAT because they were going to have to withdraw offers further down unless they could get the group score up. This issue prevented likely letters from going out until close to the RD deadline.
A volleyball kid at Yale (high impact player) didn’t get a likely letter and had her offer withdrawn. She was quickly picked up by a Big10 school which means she was likely a freshman starter in the Ivy League.
Another volleyballer was offered a spot at Brown if she could get a 1400 on her fall SAT. She didn’t and they didn’t offer in the end.
The pre read isn’t as big a deal as it is made out to be. As others have mentioned, coaches have a good feel about what it takes to pass, and don’t put forward an athlete for a pre read that is unlikely to pass. A pass on a pre read means the student athete would probably be accepted–if the coach gives the student athlete full support (often called a slot). Results of a pre read are meaningless without coach support. Coaches have more pre reads done than they have slots. You will know if you don’t pass the pre read, but passing just means the coach can continue recruiting you.
The ultimate process involves the number of slots and the academic index (AI). Each Ivy League school is allowed a number of admission slots and has a required average AI for student athletes they use the slots on. There is also a league minimum for AI. The athletic director then decides how their school will divide the available slots up between their teams, and sets an average AI for each team so the school meets its required average across all teams.
The result is that one coach might be given 5 slots and be told that their average must be 200 (completely made up numbers here). The coach then tries to use their 5 slots to get the best class they can that has at least a 200 average and everyone above the league minimum AI with a positive pre read. Sometimes this means taking a student athlete who is a solid athlete but has a very high AI to offset an outstanding student athlete with a below average AI.
What this means to you is that combination of SAT/ACT and unweighted GPA that is needed will depend on the school, the team and the athlete. Only the coach will know what you need. The good news is that coaches are usually very up front about the academics they are looking for. Keep in mind that meeting these requirements doesn’t mean that you get one of the limited number of admission slots. There is a lot of competition for Ivy League slots, and coaches dont usually have to go too far down their depth chart to find a recruit with a stellar AI.
Keep talking to the coaches. Good luck.
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Ask your high school to provide you with your school profile. This contains information about your school and can shed some light on how you stack up and the rigor that you are taking compared to your peers!