Unclear as to whether the issue, beyond family connections to Princeton, is that Brown’s track team does poorly in the Ivy League and Princeton’s is the best, or whether OP views Brown as a lesser school than Princeton.
P.S. Just checked the Ivy League recruiting times. OP’s mile time is slightly/borderline insufficient for even “walk-on” eligibility at Harvard & at Princeton.
OP’s times are fine for Brown’s track team which is the weakest among the Ivy League schools.
is there a conception that legacies who don’t apply ED aren’t serious and therefore don’t get any legacy boost?
I think at many schools, yes. At one non-Ivy but ivy-like school, a friend, who is a major donor and very involved (i.e., trustee type engagement) was told explicitly that if the school was going to give legacy preference to their kids, they would have to ED. There was a quid pro quo there, much as there is with athletes. At this school, it was ED, not SCEA, so it was binding.
I would imagine that applying early helps, but as acceptance is not binding, I don’t know if as much. I also know legacy families who have applied to Princeton in the RD round and been accepted, so it’s not a requirement.
For the OP, the benefit of SCEA at Princeton would be that they could pivot back to other options sooner than later if need be, and as an athlete chasing uncommitted roster spots in mid-December, sooner would be almost essential.
But the applicants may have been accepted regardless of legacy in that round?
I am undecided on this. I know several kids who did not apply early, but I think each of those were a great fit for Princeton… just slow to come around to the idea. However, I do think that not applying SCEA/ED to a different school when you are a Princeton double legacy can hurt your chances at those schools.
As a side note, which I have brought up before, in the last couple of cycles since the end of AA we have seen a significant number of legacy be deferred and ultimately accepted.
Also not Princeton, but I have been told that if you want a legacy boost at Stanford, you need to apply REA. I wouldn’t be surprised if the same is true for Princeton and others.
Of course. Just saying that if you are a legacy and don’t apply until RD, it isn’t assumed that you’re not truly interested and shouldn’t be admitted. And to clarify, there are very, very few legacies accepted who would not have been admitted had it not been for legacy status. They all had a good shot at being admitted regardless of legacy. That just got them to the front of the line.
Appreciate everyone’s perspective, but she’s an alum, married to an alum, is an alumni interviewer and sees the results of the applicant pool from her region. I’m curious as to what in your experience would lead you think she’s misinformed. I’m inclined to think her perspective has merit, not that it matters personally in any way.
I assume it’s the Family connection. I could be misremembering but I thought the other school in the mix was UChicago, who are UAA, but ran in the same ranges generally as Brown in the 15 and 5. Difference is that UChicago’s team was Senior heavy, where Brown’s is very young. Yet another checkmark for Brown, in my opinion, but she’s passing. As mentioned, she ain’t the only one.
Respectfully, I think the only people who really know how it all works are sitting in the admissions office.
Okay sorry I’ve been inactive on here. It’s been a lot going on. And it got “worse”.
I was ready to commit to Brown, because the chances at Princeton were just too risky, until today… Princeton coach told me that depending on how the rest of my season (off to a fast start) and his recruiting goes, that he MIGHT be able to give me a FULLY SUPPORTED spot in December. I would apply ED, and then in December, he may be able to just pull me right in (or maybe not and I’d remain a 100% academic, unsupported applicant).
So now the chances are better at Princeton, with this new potential of becoming a supported recruit!!! And now I am so, so, so, so, so, severely stuck. And this all has to be decided tomorrow.
Just to clarify- both New Balance and Nike Nationals qualifier (raced at NB). Not to be arrogant at all (because I know it will come off that way when I just want to be clear) but I also don’t think I “somehow managed” a Brown offer, I think it was more well-deserved, because I have looked at recruits’ times a lot and I am faster than many of last year’s (and years prior too; everything’s getting faster these days).
Full coach support at Brown (“guaranteed”, or like 99%).
Zero coach support at Princeton (normal, non-recruit applicant)
…UNTIL TODAY! Coach says full support for me at Princeton might be possible, he has to wait and see!
For more clarification on the legacy:
Both parents went there, HS class of 2023 brother goes there (got in ED as a non-recruit, but now he plays on the lacrosse team). My parents do donate significantly I think and they are very involved in all the reunions and special alumni events.
There was a girl at my private prep school who applied ED last year with similar double parent donating legacy (not sure how relatively impactful but I think similar?) who didn’t get in ED. Don’t know if deferred or rejected but didn’t end up there. Worries me.
Quite the tough decision! The fact that the P coach wants to wait until December to possibly offer you a supported spot leads me to believe that he wants to see if you do qualify and run well in one of the national XC meets. He will have his other recruits locked in by the November 1 application date. So if you’re willing to bet on yourself, it may work out for you at Princeton. It would be well after the REA(no ED at Princeton fyi) deadline so you might technically be in the RD pool, but he might still have pull to get you an acceptance and possibly even a likely letter. Obviously, it’s still somewhat risky as you have no guarantees at this point.
I wish you luck on your decision. Get a restful night of sleep and see what you think in the morning.
I am basically going crazy. I cannot believe I have to decide on this TOMORROW. I was ready to commit to Brown until this whole potential Princeton support later down the road developed (as opposed to the previous “get in on your own, then you can be on the team”).
He has all the spots he can offer taken except for one, which is still waiting for a response from whomever he offered it to. Even if this girl says yes, there is potential for him to gain an extra spot depending on how the other track event groups’ (sprints, jumps, throws) recruiting unfolds. If I run fast, he can sell me and advocate for that last spot to go to the distance side.
Tough decision.
What did the coach think were the chances of all that following into place?
My thinking is that the odds are low if his last slot ends up taken (I’m not clear if he said he’d offer it to you if the current recruit turns it down). Other event groups would need to be unable to use their slots. If that happens, others besides distance might have candidates in mind. Ultimately it’s the head coach’s decision and she’s the throws coach. Still, I’ve seen this sort of thing happen. It’s rare though and I’m not sure the chances of everything working out are any better than your legacy preference and an unsupported app.
But I’m not the coach so I think you have to judge a bit based on the conversation and see if it changes your thinking.
Were you feeling pretty happy about the Brown decision before this wrinkle? That might tell you something.
No need to answer these questions, just food for thought.
As far as running faster, I don’t doubt you could. But so could others. And as you know the sport can be brutal with injuries, poorly timed illness, etc. Chances are that you’ll have a good season but you’ll want to consider whether these risks and the prospect of having this hanging over your head for the rest of the season should affect your decision.
Not to be mean but I wonder if you heard what you wanted to hear. You noted your times are not competitive for Princeton.
So seems to me, from a coaching POV if he finds a slot, he’d find someone with more competitive times.
Just saying.
Kids surely get into Princeton but not Brown. So I don’t think it’s a step down but I get the family thing.
If you do take Brown, you could rest easy this app season.
What does your family think ?
One thought is you could ED Princeton but also contact Dartmouth, because Dartmouth offers full support for some slots RD. So if you don’t get into Princeton ED you could set yourself up with a good backup. MIT is another possibility, since they do EA with coach’s support. Great coaches at both places, imho.
Accuracy isn’t arrogant. It’s just the facts and I’m glad you stood by them. If you ran the mile at NBNO you were very lucky cause that was a hell of a race and you (hopefully) got to watch it on the track.
I don’t envy this year’s recruiting class. There seems to be a flurry of these last minute outreaches of late. A friend’s daughter who was guided against submitting a pre-read a couple of months ago by the coach of her dream school got called this week asking if she was still interested. Of course she’s committed somewhere else now. And there are others. Not sure if it’s the new NCAA ruling’s cascade effect or if this happens all the time, but…
Again, word on the street is Brown is having a very tough time locking down their distance recruits, so a call to the coach saying you love the program but you’re a double legacy and sibling at Princeton and you’re compelled to apply ED there, but will circle back to them right away once you know how that panned out will keep you on their radar. Or tell them your family has tied you to a chair.
Go for Princeton ED. There is no risk. Your track will be a strong EC at Brown, Dartmouth or wherever if it falls through (which now seems less likely). And by the looks of it, you’re a strong candidate in any case. Deferral at Princeton would throw the whole thing for a loop, so fingers crossed that is avoided.
Last question: are the times they’re looking for XC times or early indoor? I’m assuming and hoping the former, as the latter would put a lot of pressure on December meets.