Acceptance Letters

College Majors Musical Theater Majors
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<p>checkbook, I think that those who do not consider transfers do release that information up front. There actually are very few that do not take transfers at all. Transfer admission, in general, is more difficult and selective than freshman admission, and I think that most schools will, indeed, tell you this. Some programs will only accept a number that is in line with the attrition rate so that they do not end up increasing the size of their class by too great a number. Others will accept a few into an already existing class if they feel that they have the room for the class to grow. Some will accept internal transfers, like Tisch does. I think the numbers are always going to be fairly small, though, regardless of each school’s policy. As I said, in my D’s class, I believe there was only one transfer student, and that has been NMR’s D’s experience in her freshman class at Tisch as well. I don’t think those circumstances are unique. Was your D in the CAP21 summer program or the one through Tisch? I guess if your D is a transfer then she was likely in the CAP21 program, is it possible that the individual who spoke to your D about transfers was referring to transferring into CAP21’s own program and not Tisch? </p>

<p>I agree with you that transfers, in general, can be of great benefit to their new school and I’m sure that many have gone on to great things upon graduation. Even those who do extensive research in this process still sometimes end up at a school that isn’t right for them. There is nothing wrong with then exploring a transfer. </p>

<p>Keeping fingers crossed for a good outcome for your D.</p>

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<p>I agree with everything AlwaysAMom posted in #261. </p>

<p>AlwaysAMom, I think checkbook was saying that her D did the summer program at CAP21 that is the professional one for students over 18, and her D was a college student. Pretty sure…not the pre-college programs.</p>

<p>Most colleges do take transfers and for those that don’t, they will tell you so (Emerson’s BFA programs are an example of the latter).</p>

<p>However, there are way less slots open for transfers than for freshmen applicants. Some get in, obviously! But it is harder to get in that way.</p>

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<p>Ive been reading for a few weeks now. Yesterday my daughter got her 3rd rejection letter. She was rejected from UARTS, Syracuse, and NYU Tisch (CAP21). She has a 4.0 GPA, 1st in class of 435 ranking, 1860 SAT, great resume of performances and theatre experience, positive feedback in auditions. What else do they want??? Can anyone who DID make it into CAP 21 tell me what their stats were so she will know what she’s up against if she tries to apply again as a transfer student. She did get into and will probably go to CSU Fullerton (CA) but is lamenting to be on the East Coast!! Any Feedback? Do most of those accepted come from Performing Arts HS’s and attend some kind of summer programs prior? She attends the local public HS and we didn’t know about these summer programs for high schoolers until too late.</p>

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<p>lulu8mom - my D is a freshman at NYU/Tisch/CAP21 and although I don’t really like to post her actual stats on this forum, I will say that they are much lower than your D’s. On the other hand, she did attend a rigorous (non performing arts) prep school, and took 3 AP classes, had leadership and community service experiences, aside from a fairly extensive theatrical resume, that also included some training at summer programs.</p>

<p>Anyone will tell you that an admission by audition school is competitive, and it is really hard to say what they are looking for at any given time. Some will say that smaller programs accept a diverse group of kids with future casting for shows in mind. Other larger programs may be looking more for well rounded kids that seem like the right fit for the school. </p>

<p>When we went through this process last year my D applied to 12 schools (including 1 non audition), because she was afraid her less than stellar test scores might affect the outcome, and she also was not sure how many “petite blonde sopranos with a belt mix” schools would be accepting. </p>

<p>I don’t know if your D is still waiting to hear back from more schools, please know however, that in the end things have a weird way of “working out”. You can PM me if you have more questions.</p>

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<p>lulu8mom,
I understand how disappointing these rejections are. I do not know your D’s entire college list. Did she only apply to THREE BFA programs? The odds are very slim at the three that you mentioned: NYU/Tisch, UArts, Syracuse…even if you are highly talented and qualified. I know kids who got into Tisch but not UArts and Tisch but not Syracuse. So, for starters, and I do not know your D’s talent or many other things about her, but it would be imperative to have a longer list of programs that is well balanced to yield results. For example, if she is truly a viable candidate for a BFA in MT Program, she could have conceivably not gotten into NYU, UArts, or Syracuse but have gotten into one or two others if she had a list of a variety of ten BFA programs. </p>

<p>Also, you bring up her academics and ask if that doesn’t get you in, what will? But as great as your D’s academics are, that alone doesn’t get you in. At many schools, the audition counts for a lot more percentage of the admissions decision than the academics, even though the academics must be in range for that particular college (for example, your D certainly had the academics for UArts or Syracuse). So, even with the academics, the talent counted a huge part and they take anywhere from 2-10% at most of the BFA in MT Programs and so the artistic odds are very low for all candidates, even if their academics meet the selection criteria. </p>

<p>Then, for NYU…academics counts 50% of the admissions decision and artistic talent counts 50%. Even if your D’s academics passed muster, the talent was a big part of the decision and they take very few of all who audition. On the academic front, you only shared some of your D’s profile but clearly her GPA and rank were top notch. I don’t know the rigor of her courseload. I don’t know the breakdown of her SAT scores (total score is not everything…I’d have to know her Critical Reading score and her Math score separately to even evaluate her test score appropriately). But just looking at the total score…kids do get accepted with that SAT score to NYU but not all do. The odds are lower for those below the mid 50% test score range (1310-1440 on the CR and M sections only) for NYU…kids get in with scores below that mid range for NYU, but at a lower rate of acceptance. Your D’s total SAT score (1860 which if one divides by three sections would give her 1220 on CR/M combined and this is only a guess…she could have lower on those two sections or higher) is a bit below the mid 50% SAT range for NYU but would not necessarily keep her out since kids can be accepted in that range, even if less are accepted in that range. And there is much more to it…recs, essays, and so on. They don’t accept based on some numbers…it is holistic admissions. </p>

<p>My own daughter who goes to Tisch went to a rural public high school that had no theater or dance program. They did put on productions. We have no youth theater in our area, nor acting classes. My D did not attend any pre-college programs but she did go to a summer theater camp for years. We do not have performing arts high schools in our state </p>

<p>You do not have to have attended a performing arts high school or summer theater program to get into a BFA in MT program. It helps, however, to have training in voice, acting, and dance, and to have production experience. But then these things are not important as far as a resume but more in terms of that the background helps prepare you to be able to have the skills and then to be able to audition well to show those skills. </p>

<p>I do not think knowing the stats of others who got into Tisch is going to help you (NYU publishes the stats of admitted students already). I have no clue your D’s talent or artistic training background or level of achievement in casting or other benchmarks. But please remember that there are lots and lots of talented MT kids in the country. Even if you took the leads from every HS musical in the country and they all applied to BFA in MT programs, many would be turned away. Then, add in kids who have won state or national awards in MT and so on and so forth. It is a very competitive process with very low rates of admission. Your D (whose talent I have no clue about)…who IF she is an appropriate candidate and contender for a BFA program, would need way more than three programs (including such highly regarded ones) on her college list to give her more chances. </p>

<p>Your D can get more training and coaching and audition as a transfer or even stay at CS Fullerton where she can audition into their BFA program eventually.</p>

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<p>My D similar stats to yours, got into Cap 21. It is all about the audition and what they are looking for that year. Applied to 12 MT BFA schools, traveled on 10 trips to audition. Spent a lot of $, but got decent results. D has been in MT since age 5, private voice, went to summer programs, took advantage of theatre opps outside school as well as in school. It is hard to get in to any of the programs, and especially hard for girls, more apply for less spots than boys.</p>

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<p>wondering…did you get in?</p>

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<p>Lulu Mom: I understand your frustration. I really don’t know what to say about NYU this year. They turned down a young man who got into CCM MT and CMU MT. They turned down another young man who got into NCSA. They turned down my D who got into Cal Arts (9% acceptance rate), UCLA (9% acceptance rate), CCM Acting (31% acceptance rate), and Emerson Acting BFA (not sure the acceptance rate, but she was accepted early action.) My D has a 4.09 GPA, an 1840 SAT, and is an AP Scholar with Honors. She is in a performing arts public school with a theatre conservatory and has a great resume. After her audition with NYU they said “We will definitely be in touch,” whatever that meant. Guess it wasn’t what we thought it would mean. I also know they accepted kids this year who did not get into any other of their audition schools (but got into nonaudition schools.)</p>

<p>I guess what I learned from all this process is that it is a bit of a crap shoot. You cannot know what the admissions counselors are thinking. Maybe your kid didn’t look like what they wanted. Maybe your kid said something that just didn’t strike the auditioner well. At NYU, 75% of the kids were rejected. That’s alot of kids. Some criteria, however unfair or weird that criteria may seem to you or I, was used to eliminate a lot of kids in a way we will never understand or hope to understand.</p>

<p>To prepare ourselves for this possibility, we have to make sure our kids have A LOT of schools to audition for. My D did that and she has four choices. Your daughter also has a great choice. FULLERTON IS FANTASTIC. You should not be concerned, for many, many successful artists have come from Fullerton and the facilities are SECOND TO NONE! I, too, am dealing with a child who is lamenting the loss of the East Coast. But I have told her that she has been given the chance to make her LA connections now. Then, when she is done, she can go and start working in NY. She will have the unique advantage of having both LA connections AND NY connections. This is a good thing. NYC is not going anywhere. It will be there for both of them when they get out of school.</p>

<p>However, should your D feel really tossed about all this, she can always do this again. I have read some great blogs about kids who went for it again their freshman year in college and got into all the schools that did not accept them the first time, INCLUDING CMU! So, that is always an option. And the kids do it again with the wisdom of now knowing it is a crap shoot and there are no guarantees… which I think helps so much in dealing with the process. </p>

<p>Anyway, my heart goes out to you. I thought it may make your kid feel better to know another fellow Californian with great stats and talent was denied. It happens. We move on. Best of luck to you.</p>

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<p>I think it is a mistake for parents (or anyone, for that matter) to think that just because a kid is admitted to one top school, he or she will necessarily get into another top school. It just doesn’t always work that way. People for some reason like to think that if a kid gets into CMU, he or she will necessarily get into other schools such as Ithaca, NYU, Syracuse and so forth. Just doesn’t work that way!!! As soozievt has posted repeatedly, each year we all hear on this board of kids who get into Michigan and not UArts and CMU and not Otterbein or NYU. What we have to remember is that the auditors at each program are not just assessing each student’s talent and potential to succeed in the program; they are also putting together a class. They need a variety of types, talents, looks and voice types, etc. Also, each school and each auditor has its/his/her own taste and so forth. That all plays into a decisionmaking process that we are not privy to, unfortunately! :)</p>

<p>This may sound blunt, but I honestly think that the right attitude to take going into BFA auditions is that if you have the right list, you should get into one, maybe two, programs. (After all, a kid can only go to one program!!) If a kid gets into more, well, that’s fantastic because the kid and family then have choices. :)</p>

<p>Knowing how tough the odds are (and realizing that many of the other hundreds and hundreds of kids auditioning were the “stars” of their high schools, too!) will help somewhat mitigate the hurt feelings of rejection that come when, inevitably, even the most talented kids are not accepted by every program. </p>

<p>And most of all, I would caution kids and parents not to think of any particular school as a “sure shot.” NO BFA program is a “sure shot.”</p>

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<p>Thanks for all the feedback. My daughter only applied to the 3 schools on the east coast and 3 here in CA. We have learned a lot thru this process…just wish it hadn’t come with such a price. I guess she should have had more on her list but looking back, I’m not sure we could have physically, emotionally, and financially handled any more applications and travel! I cannot imagine how nuts I would be now if she had applied for 12 schools and made 10 audition trips!!! Choosing only 3 sounds like her downfall but she “went for broke”. Probably will choose Fullerton and thanks for the positive feedback for that. We have read wildly different opinions. I have communicated with one of the Professors there and was impressed. My only concern is the dorm situation. Is it true that they only have on campus housing for 800 students and all the rest must find their own apartments?! Even their on- campus housing is apartment style…no meal plans. Im not sure I’m ok with that. If she does choose to try to transfer later, she knows now the have more on her list. Also I am wondering if anyone knows of any summer programs for recent HS grads. If she ends up choosing to stay at our hometown University, a summer program somewhere fun may soften the blow. Again, congrats to all who were accepted to one of their top choices!!</p>

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<p>lulu, just chiming in here that I have heard great things about CSUF and its program. Re: no meal plan. My D didn’t get a meal plan this semester and is eating way better than she did when she was eating dining hall food, good as that happens to be at NYU! She is also eating less expensively, believe it or not! Instead of paying for the meal plan, we gave her the $$$ the meal plan would have cost and told her her job was to survive on that for the semester. So far, she has only gone through about half of it and the semester will be over in a few weeks.</p>

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<p>notmamarose…I’ve heard that. At NYU that sounds like a good idea but am worried that without a car down there, how would the grocery shopping be? Transportation, etc is different than in NY. One mom said that was a problem. She does have a car but we are reluctant to let her take it the first year. I guess we will find out when we visit. SHe really likes the idea of the apt style housing though.</p>

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<p>lulu8mom, yikes, good point. One wonderful thing about NYU is that everything is accessible by subway. Let us know what you find out.</p>

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<p>I agree that you can’t tell what is going to happen with adjudicators and who will pick whom, which is why you have to have lots of choices. The unifieds are great in that this is why you don’t have to travel to all those different schools. With so many coming to LA, you can kill a lot of birds with one stone, and even audition last minute to ones you didn’t even think of.</p>

<p>There are lots of threads about summer programs to look at here…just do a search. Unfortunately many of them had their auditions already (like La Jolla Playhouse Conservatory for example.) I didn’t know about the housing situation in Fullerton, but I’m sure that just like Cal Arts that also has bad housing, the housing office probably facilitates roommate searches. I just know lots of very successful people went to Fullerton and that when they opened that new theatre it was one of the biggest deals in So Cal…Hang in there! </p>

<p>Also an idea! A lot of kids on this blog are considering Santa Monica Community College. It is very good and then they will transfer… check it out!</p>

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<p>TheCheckBook…am I understanding you correctly when you say your daughter went to thecap21 summer program for college students? We have been looking into that but am unsure of a few things. I know it would be an awesome alternative to not getting to go to her top schools this fall but apparantly they have to evaluate whether or not you are “eligible”. I guess you need not audition or apply, but merely register. Then there’s the question of whether there are still spots open. Then, would she be eligible if she applied to nyu tisch but was not offered admission. What was the circumstance with your daughter. Does it in any way help your chances of getting admitted as a transfer student if they remember you from a summer program? Oh how I wish I would have found this forum a year or two ago. Won’t make the same mistakes with my 2nd daughter. She’s a freshman in HS this year and looking to very specific schools for volleyball teams and hopefully scholarships. We know about summer camps for that. This summer she will attend a summer camp at Stanford. Now we know to check out camps at all her top choices too.</p>

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<p>The CAP21 summer program is, I thought, an audition based program.</p>

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<p>The CAP 21 program for college students or students graduated from high school is non-audition/application. You register for the program, and then on the first couple of days there are placement auditions. Housing is separate, although I am pretty sure you can register for it through the program.</p>

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<p>Lulu8mom - I don’t know where you live, however Musical Theater West in Long Beach does a summer show for teens. Last year a very talented CSF freshman (now a sophomore) had the lead. I obviously don’t know if CSF students are auditioning this year, however it they are it would be fun for her to meet some fellow CSF students. Many CSF students also work at Disney so that could be fun plus money.</p>

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<p>Sorry: I was mixing up the precollege program with the non precollege one!</p>

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<p>lulu8mom
My d loved the college cap21 program. She auditioned by dvd and a resume. She completed one year as a vocal performance major in collegeby then. My d wanted to learn more about a career in MT. Cap21 helped her to see what MT as a career and a business was really like. She saw first hand what living in NYC is like and what going to NYU involves. She loved everything about it! It’s nice to know all that up front. Before you and your student have invested a lot of money, heart, hope and time in setting her up as a college student in NYC. She will transfer into MT this year, I’m not sure where yet. Maybe not NYU but that’s ok, I’d still recommend CAP21</p>