This kind of Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt is just one more reason for parents to stop fretting over whether an activity “looks good” to colleges and just do what they believe is best for their child as a person (as opposed to their child as a future Harvard student). If you have the money lying around and you don’t want your kid lying around for the summer, then sending them to an expensive camp that they will love is perfectly fine. Other parents, whether for financial or philosophical reasons will insist that their kid gets a job for the summer.
“My kid did a very expensive sport (now his career) that was not recruitable,”
This is sort of the double standard adcoms have, they’re ok with expensive year-round sports that could cost say 10K a year (club fees, travel etc.) that a family spends for 5 or 6 years as these tend to start in middle school, but get turned off by a 5K-7K summer program for three summers? 60K vs 15K, the irony is not lost.
“that if the summer endeavor cost anything significant, it may be a turn-off to AO’s and at the least it wasn’t going to count for much (even if it fit the student’s interests ; and if it were free, only then it would be an impressive amazing activity).”
I have also heard this, but there’s a difference between turned off and not going to count for much or provide no admissions boost as a poster said was on the MIT website. There’s a big difference between being neutral to the summer activity vs. being negative to it.
This is a fascinating topic with a lot of nuance.
I think some colleges care more than others about obvious signs of privilege. And I think colleges are very much in the know about those summer programs that pretty much any kid with the $$ can do and those that are more selective and provide need-based financial aid. My guess is that the colleges that care weigh them differently.
My kid did two summer programs in the latter category, and we included them on her app. Kid #2 will apply to an engineering camp next summer that also falls in that category.
I agree, however, it is a bit myopic for admissions offices to penalize high pay summer academic or experiential programs when in fact so many top athletes – chess champions – dance standouts – you name it – pay a lot of $$ to get to high level status that attracts admissions attention or, in case of athletes, recruitment. I paid for two years of club volleyball when D was in late middle / early HS – ouch!!
Speaking of sports, I know a kid whose parents have spent in excess of $40k on private coaching fees and travel expenses just this year alone. Smart kid, highly rated in the sport (nationally ranked top 50 or so). Believe me, “privilege” is not going to be an impediment at the Ivies for this kid.
Recruited athletes are not evaluated holistically by adcoms. Their ECs outside of sport are mostly irrelevant.
Meanwhile, it’s the privileged kids who pay full tuition. Go figure.
Just another parent perspective – I think there is a difference between programs which (1) cost money which are part of a student’s overall commitments/interests/trajectory and (2) cost money and are more like “add-ons,” generic enrichment etc. A dedicated dancer, fencer, etc. will have invested years of time and money in reaching their level of expertise, and will likely have spent time in summer intensives, competitive camps/programs. It is reasonable to include that on the application as it shows the depth of a student’s commitment etc. That is different from the kid who does a $7000 summer program at an Ivy League school AND puts it on their Common App list of activities. To me, that summer course could be well worth it, from the family’s perspective, in terms of helping the student develop autonomy, become more comfortable with living with new people etc. If the family can afford it, and wants the student to have the experience --great. But it would not be worth taking up a spot on the Common App for it as an activity as it does not really demonstrate “who” the kid is. Of course, it could be more nuanced, maybe a kid is intellectually engaged with international affairs, speaks multiple languages, and does a summer high school program introducing them to foreign affairs in D.C. – that could be part of the kid’s story, even though it is “pay to play.”
At the end of the day, consider what a particular activity communicates to the college about the applicant – is it part of a coherent story or a random add-on.
“Speaking of sports, I know a kid whose parents have spent in excess of $40k on private coaching fees and travel expenses just this year alone. Smart kid, highly rated in the sport (nationally ranked top 50 or so). Believe me, “privilege” is not going to be an impediment at the Ivies for this kid.”
Yeah - sports are evaluated a lot differently ,and more positively, than summer programs, especially if it helps them become a recruited athlete. Again the hypocrisy should be noted but not really something that should surprise anyone. Parents spending $10K on an athletic summer camp, (one of my colleagues sent his kid to a speed camp e.g.) is fine but spend that $10K on sending a kid to South America or Africa - not fine.
But what is the added value of sending a child to South America over, say, a volunteer program in SD? People were paying the $10k for voluntourism and expecting it to have more pull in getting into college than it does. Do the activities your child enjoys the most without expecting that activity to get you to the head of the line when it comes time for admissions.
I don’t agree with the ‘former AO’s advice’ given in the OP. I really doubt Harvard or Duke get many applications that don’t contain some type of ‘pay to play’, whether it be years of private piano lessons or sport or robotics teams that travel to the national championships. Are there many kids who haven’t been on a class trip to Washington DC that cost $2000 (my own middle class kids didn’t go because it cost $2000) or band or orchestra camp? There are ways to do the adventures much cheaper, but are you going to list 'Traveled to Wash DC with family, Summer ‘18’ on your app?
The app is supposed to show the kid. If this is a kid who went to Space Camp and traveled to the Amazon, that’s who the kid is. I don’t think there is an AO at any school who would rather see nothing listed on the application.
My kids’ DC trip cost maybe $200. They took the train, volunteered, stayed in a hostel. (And this was a private hs.) Same with service trips. One $135, the other close, both through a local church, real work.
This brings up the mention that those kids going on expensive international trips often have nothing, nada, zip in their communities or even the US , where they work with local needs. (Some random hour here or there or donating a coat aren’t the same.)
How many enrichment programs does a kid truly need before these become an avocation in themselves?
Well, that’s nice that you can take the train to DC, but kids from the west fly and it costs a lot. My daughter didn’t go in 8th grade because it cost $2000. It did cause a social issue for her as most of her friends did go, and then they had a lifetime of ‘inside’ jokes and stories. I think they learned very little about Washington DC.
My sister took her kids on their DC trip and while it was a little cheaper (maybe $1000), the small private school did fundraising for a year, but it was mostly parents buying Christmas trees and wrapping paper so the cost was still on them, just in other ways. It’s not on the application who paid for the trip, but I’d guess most AO just assume the parents paid.
2k is nuts, I agree.
Stick with the super selective STEM summer programs. Most of them are harder to get into than T20 colleges.
“But what is the added value of sending a child to South America over, say, a volunteer program in SD?”
Is SD South Dakota, it’s be find or course, I mentioned SA and Africa because those can be very tough experiences, esp if you have to know the language (many of these you don’t run into native English speakers), threat of malaria, hot, adjust to food, while you do volunteer work, help a village or try to help places in Africa with clean water. I do see the point when others say you could do a lot of that a home, locally and get the impact. My thing is that adcoms think these kids are staying a 5 star hotel, with beach views and gourmet food, and it’s really the opposite.
“2k is nuts, I agree.”
I double agree, given that everything you do in DC is free, now of course staying in DC is not cheap, but I think these programs get hotels in VA or maybe MD or a youth hostel as suggested by lookingforward.
It is SO often not the case that high school kids are roughing it on the land in Africa. Not that age. And not a lot of college kids rough it, either. They speak English with their coordinators, guides. hotel staff. These kids aren’t UN volunteers. That’s why people doubt the true nature of these trips. Yes, some work for clean water or solar initiatives. That’s rare.
A friends’ daughter recently went on a two week church trip to Africa. They’ve fundraised for a while for this trip, but I couldn’t help thinking the money they paid for tickets could have been better spent paying for a few African kids’ education, or helping a small business.
It’s great to expose kids to service and it’s great for kids to travel, so opportunities to combine them are attractive. But the overall notion that they, in 3 weeks, are jetting in to be saviors, is not one that’s particularly helpful to anyone. These trips really are tourism. One of the activities is planting a garden or painting a school. Another may be hiking, rafting, or visiting a market. Can they change a kid’s perspective on the world? Absolutely, but does it make a kid a stronger college applicant?
But I think we may be straying from the OP’s question.
I think more often than not the majority of parents cant afford 5-7k for a summer experience for a few weeks. While sports at school generally cost money its not anywhere near that much and keeps kids busy for an entire semester. The parents spending huge sums of money for sports travel camps in my opinion is no different than the expensive summer college programs. I am personally in the camp if you want to volunteer and that is your passion, there is so much need in our backyards there is no need to travel overseas to do that, hence why it may not impress them. Each adcom is going to have their own thoughts on the matter based on the school in which they represent and their own personal biases. My personal thought is to spend your summer being a kid - working a summer job, hanging out at the pool with some friends and relax.
You can’t realiy hide your SES from to colleges. There are many tip offs besides summer programs. Things they want to know are how well did the student take advantage of the opportunities they had, are they interested and interesting people, do they seem spoiled and unconsciously privileged? Students can do pay to play and still pass these tests with admissions officers.