My son also didn’t get into the fraternity that he worked all senior summer to get in to. His best friend and dorm roommate did and we had to move him out of the dorm in the second month of college when he began having panic attacks. A completely new thing as he was boys state, on student government, and very popular in high school. Even I was invited to tour that frat over the summer and the rush chair put his arm around me and said "don’t worry Mrs…we have his back, he will be a “brother”. I am so against fraternities and what they do to young people at the prime of starting their lives on their own. For all the parents who state “my son is in the top fraternity” I say someday I hope they are discriminated against for being in such a group that CAUSES depression and suicide. Whatever community service they are doing is misplaced if it isn’t to get help for those that they bring so much harm to. Since this happened to my son he is slowly getting better but still I yearn for the happy kid he used to be. I have had 2 moms call me this year who heard about my son and have their own child going through this. It is rampant and disgusting that they even exist.
Yet, you allowed your son to pledge at a fraternity.
^^@Mommission It’s understandable that you are upset; we all take our children’s disappointments to heart but I must say that your reaction is way, way over the top. I don’t know what school your son goes to but the business you participated in over the summer is very odd and unusual, IME.
I understand that this is your son’s very first disappointment in a life that seems to have been wall to wall success up until this rejection but you will never really know what happened to cause his not getting a bid at that chapter. Sometimes a kid comes across as too “try hard” when they really, really want something and it can be really off putting, particularly if he seemed over-confident about getting a bid. It’s also possible that he said or did something that offended current members.
I must say I do lose sympathy for you when you wish ill-fortune on the young men who actually are members of fraternities, who do not deserve your spitefulness. You would do well to remember that you would be singing a very different tune if your son had gotten a bid to this chapter. Maybe his mistake was that he focused on only one chapter that he chose for status reasons and he might have been a better match at another fraternity he ignored. At any rate, fraternities certainly do not cause depression and suicide. Anyone who falls into that kind of difficulty as a result of social disappointment surely has mental/emotional problems that existed prior to that rejection.
I really hope that you have gotten your son into some kind of counseling and emotional support service. His reaction was far outside the range of normal behavior.
Are you kidding? You are really going to compare fraternities with churches and country clubs? These are KIDS hurting other kids! At the most delicate of all the times of their lives. Since when did a church make you work hard to get to know them and then say go away WE DONT WANT YOU? Anyone who wants can pretty much join anything they want but not fraternities and sororities. They are brutal excuses for a “CLUB”. They are exclusionary and rude. I think they cut to the core of what society considers to be discriminating. I hope you can look inside your heart as an adult and feel the real devastation that they cause the kids whose friends get accepted and they don’t. It is unbelievable to me how they purport to do community service when really they should be raising money to give to the mental health care of the kids they directly harm who suffer depression, isolation and YES even SUICIDE at the hands of fraternities and sororities.
When he was thrown out of the basement on the last day of rush the dean of students ( I did not go to him and complain, I am on a board with him for our state public television so mentioned it to him) also said it was unusual and honestly didn’t believe me that the fraternity would do something so outside the lines of the rules, but it did happen just like that, and again, these are kids hurting other kids. It is what it is. He didn’t want to hear it and apparently neither do most people who try to maintain this culture of exclusivity. You either come out a winner or a loser. The fact that it happened the day before his first day of college is the fault of the system for the timing, or that he took it harder than most is just statistical. Until it happens to your child or the child of others that you know well, you will never understand. There are no comparisons in real life to fraternities. Bottom line, they are harmful to a segment of the population. What if you and your spouse wanted to join a club and they said “well your spouse can join, but we do not want you”. Can you imagine that anywhere except at a fraternity or sorority? His best friend was devastated this happened to him as they had been friends since 2nd grade. They still work together but do not socialize together. He was friends with 20 plus guys in that fraternity who MADE them attend party after apart over the summer before a 2 day rush.
Wow- chose to read this thread. Thank goodness our flagship has a low percentage of Greeks- who are inconsequential to the majority of students’ social lives. I see a valid comparison with churches as well as country clubs. Both are social organizations that do discriminate and are exclusionary- hard to belong unless others welcome you. btw- college students are not little kids. I can’t imagine wanting to be in a restricted social setting in college either. Too many more important things to do for fun.
Guess you guys live in a different world.
@mommission, I can hear the deep hurt in your posts and I am sorry for that.
That said, life is full of highly competitive and often emotionally draining competition that can be hurtful. The very college your son is at probably rejected many students who devoted months of their time “getting to know” and applying to it. Did your son ever play a competitive team sport that cut other kids who tried just as hard but lacked the talent? Was your son ever chosen to play in a band or orchestra that broke some other kids’ hearts? Did your son ever apply for a job that went to somebody else?
It sounds like the rush process at this college was not to your liking, and the rejection possibly could have been handled better. But that does not make fraternities disgusting or bad.
Yes, my son did play competitive sports and having had 4 children all of them have had disappointments and been able to make some teams and not some others. Fraternities are different. They infiltrate your life as a college student. Their letters are blazoned everywhere and they take over with automatic assignees as opposed to the general population who must apply for most clubs and organizations. NOT like a church or a country club. The adult supervision is minimal and the rules are not followed. We did seek counseling for our son and he is now happy to say he is glad he was, as his friend says “escorted out of the basement” (2 other guys were out there in the yard they put him in who this had just happened to and one of them who my son didn’t know was highly upset) which by the way is still totally against the rules as they are supposed to notify the guys by email of a bid received or not received. He was offered a bid to 5 other fraternities by email later that night. He did not know anyone in the other fraternities and had not been rushing them all summer and was so upset over the rejection he refused to join any of them even though I was encouraging him in my naiveté to do so.
In hindsight he is relieved he was not accepted into such a group of people who freely hurt others with no consequence. In his words he could never “be the guy in the basement”. Fraternities and Sororities are a terrible thing in modern day society and someday will be abolished. They were started as academic clubs and have become social pariahs. Our family will remain completely against them. The other families who have found me through friends who knew what my son went through are just as devastated as we were, so far 100% have sought counseling for their kids, and are also too afraid to voice an opinion in defiance of these organizations that ruin college life for so many others who are not “allowed” to join.
This is the first time in the 18 months since it happened that I have spoken out and only did so anonymously and look what the response is from this forum. Mostly denial of any wrong doing by the Greek system, or calling sour grapes on the rejected, and lash back that it was somehow his fault, or my fault as a parent that didn’t teach my child to handle rejection. I really had no idea how awful they were until this happened to us and feel for the thousands of kids living so very closely among these groups that are allowed to practice organized bullying. And for the record, I still think a freshman in college while they can be termed an adult are still kids!
@Mommission - I, too, can hear the pain in your posts. Thanks for sharing your experience.
My only thought is that maybe it happened for a reason that will reveal itself as time goes on? Maybe your son/family was meant to illuminate the potential underbelly of the greek system? It’s not always all sweetness and light and forever friends. Maybe someday he will use the feelings that you all experienced to reach out in love and acceptance to others?
I’m not anti-greek (many people get alot out of it), but I also don’t think it’s always all great either. It’s something that you have to go into with your eyes open.
My kids were rejected from social situations all the time. Not invited to be on the DI team, not invited to birthday parties, not selected to be in the play or on the team or in the orchestra. To claim that others shouldn’t get to have birthday parties or a DI team or a play because mine were reject is ridiculous. To claim all fraternities are evil because ONE rejected your son is ridiculous. Don’t you think your son’s rejection of the other bids was saying to all those houses ‘you’re not good enough for me’?
He didn’t get what he wanted so now all fraternities are evil, the members are horrible, the students who rejected him are old enough to know better (19-22) but your son who is 18 was ‘just a kid’? I think you should be thankful he isn’t a member. If he was so crushed not to be invited, do you think he would have made good choices if he was asked to do something stupid like climb to the top of a water tower or swim across a river? You need a maturity to say no in a group situation.
Thank you for your reply SouthFloridaMom9 and yes, I agree that many people get a lot out of it. While my son will probably never be outspoken against what happened to him, he will walk in the world with the experience. As a mom I am more concerned about the future kids getting hurt over this and the PC ramifications of speaking out against it. The Governor of our state is a close personal friend of mine and knows what happened to my child. Her hands are tied as all of her children and even her nephew is in the fraternity that threw him out. In my research I find comfort in knowing I am not alone and that others are starting to be more vocal about this type of abuse and not just the rapes, drug use, alcohol poisoning, and falling out of windows and off roofs deaths. Just because it has been a college tradition for years doesn’t make it right. I will never breathe a word of what college he is at, nor will I speak out against his treatment or the effects of being devastated socially on the first day of your college life directly to anyone in our town. I realize the backlash this would have on my son. I do not even speak of it in front of him and although I can still tell his college life is not what he thought it would be, he does come home often and we have replaced friends with family and work and of course studying! I consider him a survivor! He said to me in the early days…Mom, I could never be the guy that threw freshman out of the basement, that’s why I couldn’t join any other fraternities. I greatly admire him and find him to be the bravest boy I know!
@mommission, I don’t know what happened to your son, but it sounds like it was way outside the norm. I don’t think it’s fair to paint all fraternities with the same brush, or even most fraternities. As you point out, five frats were kind enough to extend bids to your son even though he spent little or no time with them at all. One bad apple among these six frats is a small minority.
There are bad apples and bullies everywhere. This is not unique to workplaces, schoolyards, dorms, neighborhoods - or fraternities. It is definitely unpleasant to see your child at the wrong end of bullying, but this is not a frat-only issue (nor are rape, drug abuse, roof deaths, etc unique to frats).
Also, and I’m sure you aren’t doing this in front of your son (I’m sure your rant has remained private and confined to this anonymous site), I would be careful about overly reacting to this setback. The last thing you want is for your son to develop a “poor me” victim outlook on life. He was rejected-badly-possibly egregiously- but now he needs to move on and shrug this off. The bigger deal you make of it, the harder it will be for him to move on. But, it sounds like you know this and that this is exactly what you are doing.
No I do not think that his rejecting the other bids were saying you are not good enough for me. He rejected those bids because the Greek organization had just dealt him a blow of devastation. Nor do I think you could compare this to a birthday party, play or orchestra. His friends all LIVE there now and they are sophomores, this a group for LIFE chosen in one swift moment at the hands of a group of kids, and you are missing the point. On the first day of his college life he was taken to a basement and thrown out into a side yard after being paraded around for 120 minutes where he was made to meet and shake the hand of everyone in the fraternity. He had few to actually meet as he knew many many members very well, had been transitioning from high school to college at their parties all summer and his other best friends and college roommate were still in the house and were not thrown out. Has that happened to your child at a birthday party? Would there not be outrage even over that one event? At many colleges they have changed “rush” to happen second semester rather than first for this very reason! it is simply too much for a young person to handle to move away from home with high hopes and be crushed and isolated and alone instantly all while navigating their first days of college life. His roommate went to party after party for the first month of school. We moved him out of the dorm after the second month and his whole dorm floor was filled with the letters of which frat you joined blazoned on the doors. His roommates letters were on their door. My son has not been to one social event at this school ever. I have encouraged him to join this or that, try to find new friends, everything you would do to make it better for your own child, but his confidence was gone for a while and the panic attacks were clinically concerning for the first 6 months. They are gone now and this event is behind him. I am not happy that this same thing happened to another friend of his and they moved off campus together but it was and still is comforting to know they have each other. I can promise you if you ask his parents you will get much the same reaction that our family has to these organizations. I do not expect you to understand this as abuse because it has never happened to your child. Ignorance is bliss as I was also ignorant to let him even plan to be with these groups or go to a college with such a large amount of Greek influence.
I understand that our culture is so pro Greek that these ugly truths are overlooked or again seen as sour grapes for the losers. That is simply not the case. I have met countless other parents whose children have been devastated by these organizations. And for the record I think they are ALL KIDS… hurting kids with no age limit as long as these “houses” are left to do as they please to other kids without any parental supervision, as in my original post. I was responding to a reply that claimed they are all adults when the enter college. I do not agree.
@mommission, ugh. That sounds like a really bad experience. I do feel for your son, and for you. Terrible way to treat a human being.
I stand by my opinion, however, that most frats would not reject a pledge in this fashion. Your son stumbled into a group of creeps.
Yes, my children were not invited to party after party in 2nd grade, and they had to go to school, every day, and listen to their friends talk about the party last weekend and the one coming up this weekend. I had to ask the teacher to enforce the rule that the invitations not be handed out in front of the other kids. I couldnt make the parties not happen, but i could enforce the rules that invitations not be passed out at school. They were 6 and 7 years old. Many of these kids’ parents were friends from their time at this same school (many were related) and we were the newcomers and they just didnt include us. Sucked to be us. Several times my daughter invited kids to her own birthday party and they didn’t come because her birthday was the same weekend as 4 other kids in her class. We just invited other friends, not from school, and went on with our lives. I didn’t talk to the governor about it, or even the principal or priest. If invited to a party, my kids happily accepted even if it wasnt the most popular child or ‘best’ event. Those ‘second choice’ parties were just like the other fraternities your son turned down, still lots of fun but you have to accept to be part of it. We joined other clubs and tried out for other plays and musical groups.
My nephew joined a fraternity and several of his high school friends weren’t asked, even after they rushed twice. His dorm roommate wasn’t asked. Nephew is still friends of these kids and even my nephew doesn’t know why they weren’t invited to join. After two times being rejected, they joined other houses. Greeks are only 10% of this school’s student body so they didn’t have to join anywhere to have a social life, but wanted to. They all still hang out, are roommates (off campus). Your son rejected offers, and that may have been right for him but you can’t claim all at the frats are mean and rejected him. One group did. He can let them control his life or he can choose to join another house or do other activites.
I have read every post on this thread and have waited to weigh in . It is very clear that posters have strong opinions on both sides of the Greek issue. What most seem to agree on is that what the OP son has had to deal with was hurtful and unfortunate and no one would want his child to experience that sort of situation.
That being said, it is very clear that the OP continues to be hurt and angered by the situation and because of that she has very negative opinions regarding fraternities. That is certainly her right to have those opinions and feelings. Just as people who have had wonderful experiences with Fraternities are entitled to their feelings and opinions. This is a forum where everyone is entitiled to be able to respectfully discuss their opinions . To say to other posters that they are " missing the point" because they don’t share your point of view is not respectful IMO. I am neither pro Greek or anti Greek. On a public forum with people with all kinds of experiences from all over , to expect them to all agree is unrealistic . To expect respect for differing opinions should not be.
This is a sad situation but I am having trouble with a mom condemning all fraternities/sororities for one unfortunate rejection of her son – taking it to the president of the college, the governor, so many other parents who have reached out who have heard “her” story, etc… It is tough to tell, but there are kids who do not get ANY bid after rushing - but this young man did receive bids (many) — he showed qualities that other organizations of men valued and wanted—just not to his #1 dream house (a well connected one with supposedly dozens of friends and old classmates).
It sounds like it was not handled well on the fraternity’s end but maybe not - as we are only hearing one side of the story - perhaps he was not picking up the cues that a bid was not forthcoming for him, perhaps he burned some bridges at those meetings, perhaps he trash talked those other “lesser” frats or made it clear he would ONLY fit in at “A list” fraternity, perhaps he was being swept along with his friends who they DID want, perhaps they were turned off by his talk of connections that his mom had - to the governor, the president of the U, all of the current brothers, etc…and quite frankly – perhaps he did NOTHING wrong and was the model rushee but just wasn’t a good fit for that house. Should they have been forced to take invite your son in to their organization if he didn’t fit?
Perhaps they did not see you son as fitting in with their group or bringing a unique perspective to their group - why would he WANT to be around people who did not see his value and appreciate his gifts? If his desire to be accepted was so strong, he was unwise to only rush one fraternity - only mentally accept one fraternity. It is tough - it is hurtful - he will learn from this experience and move in. If not, he will need to get the professional help he needs.
I’m sorry that this is the first rejection that you popular, athletic, smart child has ever had – the timing is horrible and I DO worry about my daughter finding rejection when she rushes a sorority as an incoming freshman. I am now happier that my children HAVE been left out of birthday parties, cut from teams/dramas, and been rejected by the friend groups - all while in the protective bubble of our home so they can learn rejection, pain, exclusion, and then resilience, grit, and acceptance. The learn to pick themselves up, dust themselves off, (maybe eat some ice cream and cry), and then move on. This will be repeated in relationships, jobs, peer groups, all through adult life.
There are many parallels to college acceptances – maybe we should all write to the governor of of our states, talk at parties and charity events, meet with college presidents to abolish ALL college rejections – the policy should be ALL IN to the “best” and “well connected” colleges and universities who have been wooing all of our high achieving kids for months. My child has been receiving communications, meeting with professors, invited into dorms and classrooms for months - and so there is no way they should be able to REJECT her after all of that! Rejections to colleges are NOT FAIR and it is even more painful when their friends ALL get in and are part of the “best” universities — I think that all Universities are harmful, hateful places that crush the spirits of children with their horrible rejection emails and letters that come into their homes. Then she has to see her friends in their elite t-shirts and their hateful parents with their bumper stickers and facebook posts in our faces. It is embarrassing - especially since everyone knows that we should have been “in” because of all of those open houses, meetings, and great pedigree. Never mind that she will get into 5 other great choices where she was WANTED – she should not have to settle for anything less then the best well connected choice- one where all the best kids from our town go. Since she has seen the horrible way these colleges reject people and she didn’t get into the best one like her friends - I should now fight to make sure no one else ever has to experience this level of hurt. All colleges damage children and should be shut down.
Thank you and yes, in our family “poor me” doesn’t get you very far. I want him to look at the world as a place where he can explore and broaden his horizon. For me that is the silver lining this experience has created. He spent last summer in the California mountains at astronomy field camp and will be traveling this summer for the break between his summer school classes. He is a very sweet and kind kid and now that the physical symptoms are under control he is starting to be able to handle his life independently again.
Unfortunately, I am amazed at how many kids this does happen to. It is the unspoken reality of kids being in charge of these all so important life changing choices for other kids. I own a large production company and this frat rents DJ’s, stages and equipment from me for their fundraisers, concerts, date parties. Right after this happened one of the officers in this frat text my partner asking "do you think she will will still rent to us after what WE did to…(insert my son’s name). The answer is of course, I would never act like them, or lower myself to the standards of these sloppy kids. Every dime I have made off of them has gone in to a savings account with my son’s name on it. The reality is they know they did it! Their hurtful action continues and now I know of at least 3 different other frats that have been the offenders of the “rules” as to rush according to other parents whose kids have been terribly hurt that have contacted me. The good news is one of these fraternities is gone from our campus having had their chapter revoked here last year. What they were revoked for was (I want to qualify that this is ONLY to me) a much less hurtful offense than what happened to my child. Others would dispute that, as it was a social issue that offended millions of Americans that resulted in the revoking of the chapter. Is being “offended with words” worse than being physically thrown out and abused (he hid behind a bush that day and waited for while to see if any of his friends from high school would also be thrown out but no one was so he walked home alone back to the dorm he had lived at for 2 days)? Did anyone of those millions of Americans have to endure counseling and life changing decisions because of the words used? I completely agree that the frat using the words should have been terminated. It was disgusting and horrible what they did and I am glad they do not exist.
I venture to guess there are FAR more kids who wish fraternities and sororities did NOT exist than who are glad they do. If you look at polling numbers on reviews on popular sights for our college, sorry some of you may have figured out which it is but I still will not say for the protection of my son, you will see the numbers are awful for the greek system. Most every rating is very low and then the summary written about it makes it sound like they got a 5! To me they do more harm than good and I am not likely to decide that tossing out the feelings of the group that is harmed by them will ever make me see the benefit for the minority that use them to gain brothers, sisters, and community position. It is so easy to see the kids who don’t “get in” as being complainers that the very nature of the Greek system and the popularity (and lobbyist, financial backing) they claim keeps the losers quite and embarrassed. They are the silent minority that I now see as the silent majority and there are more of them out there than you think. Someday the oppressed will find their voice and the light will be shed on this culture no longer being conducive to a modern society. In fact there are too many similarities between the greek system and gangs. Already there are groups which encourage only voting for people who are not fraternity or sorority members as they are the huge majority of state and now federal candidates. Hopefully I will get to live long enough to see them abolished and all large state college campuses focusing on the entire student body as whole rather than giving so much attention, dollars and privilege to the divisive Greek communities.
IMO, @Mommission You give these organizations way too much control over life decisions. How much they affect your life is entirely up to you.
I’m so sorry this happened to your son and to you. I can completely understand your pain given the terrible way he was treated. I absolutely loved my sorority experience but can also see the many negative aspects to the rush process. I had a very different view of the Greek system and rush when my daughter was going through than when I did myself. Even though my daughter got in her first choice house, it was impossible for me as a mom not to feel terrible for the girls and guys who did not. Even my daughter was taken aback by the tears and loss of confidence from some of her dorm hall mates and other friends who struggled a bit through rush. Rush comes at a particularly vulnerable time for many kids and I agree that it can sometimes start off their whole college experience in a negative way. I don’t have any answers but I do understand the issues and have tremendous compassion for those who had a bad experience.