<p>I live in a white suburban town with a heavy jewish population (I’m jewish)… my town is very “preppy” and lots of drinking at my high school.</p>
<p>I’m starting to worry about my choice of Wharton over Columbia.</p>
<p>I want to do business, but I’m worried that Penn is a place where intellectualism goes to die. I just got a negative impression from my visit that Penn is a white preppy jewish school full of kids who were either drunks in high school or totally oversheltered and now are going crazy. I went out to some bars and I’m worried if that’s all there is to the social life… do kids at Penn ever stay up all night pondering the universe?</p>
<p>I have no problems with drinking, but I worry about what Penn really is. I don’t know if I’ll be HAPPY there and that’s what’s important to me.</p>
<p>At Columbia, I don’t feel like taking the whole ridiclous core, but the people there seem more down to earth, less pretentious, and less concerned with just getting drunk to interact with people.</p>
<p>Umm…help! Am I freaking out or is there truth in what I feel? Will I be miserable at Penn?</p>
<p>I’ve visited Penn a number of times and stayed overnight as well. Yes, there is a large population of jewish students and although many seem to lean a lot towards drinking, there ARE students who do not drink and still have a really good time. When my host students took me out to dinner, some of them made it sound like you HAD to drink in order to have fun. However, on the cab ride back to the Quad, I talked to two of the girls about this issue and they told me that they had never drank at Penn and they definitely had a great time as well. This goes for a number of the guys as well. I’ve heard that on Penn’s facebook, there’s a group called “Shamelessly Sober” where you will find many many other students who don’t drink and have a social life. Personally, I’m rather quiet and keep to myself sometimes…but when I feel it is appropriate, I can be crazy and wild with friends. And I would stay up late pondering about things of interest to me…I do that all the time already and I’m going to Penn. I plan to have a fun social life too. And I plan to be sober. It’s all up to your choice…from what I’ve heard from my friends who already go there, Penn students don’t really care if you drink or not. I don’t know if any of this made sense, but I hope this helped somewhat…
btw, I’m going to be at Wharton too…</p>
<p>2006/2010… who said anything about staying sober? I believe in balance… I have no problems with drinking every now and then, but I don’t like drinking as a means to socialize… I see alcohol as something that can make good times with your friends a little more interesting… too many people use alcohol as a social crutch I feel.</p>
<p>For me, I’m more miserable learning things I hate than I am being around drinkers (I’m surrounded by them in my school, and those at Penn should be able to separate their party life from their academic life anyway). </p>
<p>But haven’t you heard of the saying “Pick your friends; don’t let them pick you”? It’s true in high school and 100x more true in college! At Penn, you will DEFINITELY find a huge group of people who agree with you (like me!) that drinking has become a bit of a “social crutch”. You will find tons of students who are concentrated on academics, so all in all, it is YOU who must FIND your intellectual environment…it is there. If you can’t find it, you’re just not looking. </p>
<p>A good first step would be to choose a college house outside of the Quad, actually - perhaps Kings Court or one of the High Rises?</p>
<p>And don’t even worry about drinking being the only social option. You’ll be in Philly, for goodness sake. </p>
<p>In short, don’t let a campus visit completely determine your perception of a school.</p>
<p>Plus, I just noticed that you posted a thread asking for the easiest classes at Penn. No offense, but are you sure you want an intellectual environment? Will you really be able to handle Columbia or even Penn, for that matter?</p>
<p>LOL. Not only do I want intellectualism, but I know for a fact I can handle it… I asked for easiest classes becuase I’m filling out my Wharton worksheet and I wanted to see if any of the easier classes could fit into my loaded schedule to help balance my GPA out.</p>
<p>I find it hard to believe that a university where 94% of kids were in the top 10% of their high schools, and where the average SAT is in the 1400s does not have some shred of intellectualism to be found. Just think of that, and the fact that 10,000-odd undergrads wander the campus. I’m sure you’ll find plenty of what you’re looking for at Penn–I’ve never heard any negative comments about the place. I’m definitely looking forward to it.</p>
<p>“I went out to some bars and I’m worried if that’s all there is to the social life… do kids at Penn ever stay up all night pondering the universe?”</p>
<p>Yeah there is a lot of drinking, but there are also a significantly large portion of kids who choose to have fun in other ways. There are so many kids here and so naturally there is a lot of diversity. Think of any niche of friends and that niche will probably exist somewhere.</p>
<p>As for the universe thing, sure, the people here are smart but what I like is that we know when to shut up. Intellectual discussions are fun but I think there is a time and place for that sort of thing. Sometimes you have to give that stuff the time it deserves and then go have fun partying and hanging out. What I like about Penn is how many students are able to balance hard studying and hard partying, whereas other schools tend to have a reputation of being too heavy in one direction or the other.</p>
<p>You’ll hear that in Wharton people don’t really want to discuss things that aren’t on the midterm because it won’t help them in the immediate future. I’ve only taken a few Wharton classes as a freshman but I haven’t found that this is true. </p>
<p>People frequently ask questions related yet not explicitly covered by the material. I’ve had more than a fair share of nights going to bed at 4 or 5 just discussing topics of interest with friends.</p>
<p>Penn is the “party Ivy,” but it’s also an Ivy. When you think of “party Ivy,” just keep in mind who is it competing against. Harvard, anyone?</p>
<p>Wharton’s THE king of business, although some people will disagree with me. But if you don’t want your spot, we could always trade places. I’d rather be at Wharton than at Columbia. :)</p>
<p>Why is there this presumed polarization between drunkeness and “thinking about the universe?”</p>
<p>I consider myself both intellectual and a shameless drunkard. There is a time and a place for both. Sometimes I love to ponder the universe…but at the same time, such fancying of oneself as an important tormented soul who must ponder the universe (as if you could ever claim to know it all at age 19…) is an exercise in intellectual narcissism. A true scholar of humanity should embrace it in its entirety, anyway. </p>
<p>Should I want both at the same time, I can go to Philo, among other things…</p>
<p>OK, thanks for all the posts guys. I think I calmed down about the whole Penn thing, and I’m going back to my original way of thinking that I’ll be happy anywhere.</p>
<p>JohnnyK, I disagree with what you said.</p>
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<p>No one is talking of “fancying of oneself as an important tormented soul who must ponder the universe.” The whole point of my questioning Penn was about the social structure that exists. I was overly worried that the social structure completely relies on drinking as a means for people to be comfortable with each other and be able to interact. Sounds simple to me. It’s basically a question of “Do Penn kids find the need to drink to have “fun” ?”</p>
<p>the mentality in my town is “I’m bored… let’s go drink” or “I don’t know how to carry on a conversation or talk to people… let’s get drunk”</p>
<p>Would you say Penn is more like “I think drinking is cool and my parents didn’t let me do it in high school… let’s go drink”?</p>