<p>Candace,</p>
<p>The interesting thing about Florida is that a lot of people are not originally from there! We have several family members that have migrated down from the NE. Most of the people they know are from different parts of the country. Even though the state is clearly in the south geographically, I think the true southern “culture” may be somewhat somewhat diluted.</p>
<p>oops - have no idea why the word somewhat is there twice. I can’t type…</p>
<p>That is true, sokkermom. There are lots of people from NE and also lots of people from Texas as well. My Texas neighbor has a very heavy sothern accent and her kids always say “yes maam”. She says she wouldn’t wear birkenstocks because her husband doesn’t think that they look feminine. LOL</p>
<p>1Sokkermom, thanks for the article…I’ll print and read it in the carline…(lifestyles of the rich and famous!)…and you’re right about Florida attracting people from all over…we do have alot of relos’ like me here, even the international crowd because of the medical center…but Northern Fla. is still called “southern Georgia” for a reason.</p>
<p>Yes, northern Florida is much more “southern”. I was in Live Oak, a very interesting town on the Sewanee and I was looked upon as an alien. And I was not fond of my catfist dinner with the head attached!</p>
<p>Aaahhh, Orlando is not the South, Tallahassee, yes, anything South of Gainesville, no.</p>
<p>That whole “Southern Belle” thing is disgusting. “On a pedestal” is another phrase for “gilded cage” and “indirect and manipulative” is a horrible way for anyone to live…or be expected to live. The whole thing leads to ugly expectations. Back when personal computers were coming in and TheMom was a mid-level manager, she did a budget spreadsheet for her department. Her boss was really impressed and then said, “Did your husband do this for your?” Ack! Ptui!!!</p>
<p>Having worked on Wall Street and Madison Ave. for years, I think its safe to say that I can carry on a decent conversation in the business world if I need to…I was at a company function with my husband and made an observation to one of his colleagues…he looked at me as if to say,“what a big word from such a little lady!”…I feel sorry for his wife and his daughter!..(I guess they know their places)</p>
<p>Hi, Candance, my sympathies! I’ve been in the South for nineteen years now - the “real” South, not Florida, and not Texas, but the traditional deep south - and I still don’t like it here. Before moving here with my southern-born husband, I’d happily lived on both coasts, and various places in the Midwest. I was watching Kathy Griffin’s new video “Allegedly” the other day and I thought, “You know, I sort of have her personality” which may be the genesis of my problems in the South, lol.<br>
Anyway, I’d say that regional differences are much, much more than superficial. [Wow, let’s start with the percentage of people in the South who view religion as having a central role in their lives and move on from there… ]
And I still must reiterate that I’ve never seen anyone who looked even vaguely presentable at the local Walmart. I would go so far as to say that a TV makeover show could do a entire year’s worth of shows with the customers at my local Walmart. In fact, it is entirely possible that they would never have to look for applicants again.</p>
<p>LOL to the idea of torpedoing your own kid as a slacker on CC . Hilarious!</p>
<p>But maybe stay anon thru April just in case :)</p>
<p>sbmom, I just edited that part out, that’s how paranoid I am. [And then saw your message, glad you thought it was funny.:-)]</p>
<p>I think there really is a difference. Back a few years ago now, my D spent part of a high school summer doing community service in the South. When she returned, she announced that all schools in the South were out of bounds for college consideration. There were many Southern college kids working at the same site and she really, really thought the guys were sexist. She also felt that as soon as they heard her accent, they disliked her. If she made a suggestion, it was greeted with a “Oh, you —'s always think you know everything.” </p>
<p>It seemed extreme, but hey, it’s her choice and I was glad to have her go somewhere closer to college. But since then three out of four young women in the neighborhood who ended up at Southern colleges have been EXTREMELY unhappy. The one who was happy was a varsity athlete with a free ride–and she says it was a lot easier for her to break into things socially because of her athlete status.</p>
<p>The latest one is home freshman year from one of the best colleges in the South. She is miserable, hates it, and is fighting about going back for her second semester. Parents are trying to convince her to hang in there and apply to transfer. The other two girls did transfer out. One gave up a lot of merit $ to go to a lower ranked school. </p>
<p>Now kids can be unhappy anywhere. But the girls all had similar complaints–girls cared too much about what you wore, got carefully made up for regular classes, etc. (I’ll never forget the thread on the Princeton Review site years ago by someone giving advice as to what to wear for sorority rush at Texas A&M.) One of the girls is really, truly stunning. She got invited to a lot of fraternity balls and wore the same dress to all of them. Didn’t think twice about it. Her freshman roommate sat her down and explained that “isn’t done” and that everyone now thought she must be very, very poor! (No, just very, very sensible.) </p>
<p>Now the reverse is true. Lots of Northerners will make a lot of assumptions when they hear a Southern accent. </p>
<p>But I think you really do have to take into account how <em>you</em> will be perceived. If you’re a young woman who wants to wear jeans and sweaters and no make-up, well some of the Southern schools just aren’t for you–at least if you care about being involved in the social life.</p>
<p>sokkermom-
That is an entertaining article-- I found it ironic that they use Julia Roberts as an example of someone who people 150 yrs from now will see as representative of these times (assuming I read that correctly). After all-- Julia is from Smyrna, Georgia, which isn’t exactly the most cosmopolitaan town , and is decidedly below the Mason-Dixon line.
And TheDad-- clarification please-- Were you living where you currently live when your wife got that sexist comment?? If so, are we considering Southern California the South ? 
Oh- one last thing-- the yes-sir and yes-ma’m is definitely military, north or south. If someone outranks you, you call them sir or mam. If not, you’re going to hear about it. My husband is a military brat-- born and raised on Okinawa. He then attended college at UW- Madison, and spent a few years in the military himself. Yes-sir is still clearly in his vernacular-- I’ve heard him call the supermarket bagboy “sir”, and I don’t think the bagboy outranked him 
It just became habit.</p>
<p>Knock, knock…suburban Atlantan here. Actually, Smyrna is a very funny name
for a little town very attached to metro Atlanta. Some of the area’s nicest
neighborhoods are in the vicinity. Smyrna sounds quite rural—let me assure you,
it is not.</p>
<p>Knock knock-- I live in metro Atlanta and lived in Smyrna for several years. I can assure you that although it is improving–it has a long way to go. The “nicer” houses are very new, slowly replacing the country and crackerbox houses. And until a few years ago, the center of town was , shall we say… rustic?? I assure you, when Julia Roberts was growing up here, this was no thriving metropolis. When I first moved here, I asked for directions to some place that is located on U.S. 41 (in Smyrna). The guy giving me directions referred to it as “the four-lane”. I rest my case.</p>
<p>I’m surprised: Having lived in the south all of my life (as a student), do girls from other rarely wear make-up? Here, everyone does …</p>
<p>Caroline, EVERYONE here wears make-up, and I live in MI. If one leaves the house without being somewhat presentable, it’s definitely frowned on. But that’s more of a community thing, not a state thing. (I posted more in detail about this on the first page; I don’t want to repeat too much and be redundant.)</p>
<p>Cangel –</p>
<p>I’m sure I’ve run into your daughter; I float on the Dartmouth board from time to time. Did you mention that she was accepted ED on a different thread? (I seem to vaguely remember this, but it could just as easily be someone else’s D.) If so, congratulations to her! </p>
<p>
It’s not so much that I’m resistant to it - although I, too, could probably go bare if I wanted to. I like feeling feminine, but I just don’t like constantly being EXPECTED to - even though I admittedly have bought into the culture. At times, it seems stifling and feels a bit unfair. </p>
<p>But I have a feeling that when I get to college, little will change for me in terms of habits, because I’ll enjoy (depending where I end up) standing out somewhat in terms of mannerisms, appearance, etc. I don’t stand out here - even the male contingent is fairly well-dressed, sporting khakis, polos, ties, oxfords, and the occasional cable knit sweater to a public school. I suppose the best anecdote I can give to describe the community atmosphere is “Formal Fridays” - self-imposed dress-up days by the upperclassmen males who wear suits and ties, navy blazers at the least, on the final day of each week. Sheesh!! Aren’t teenage boys supposed to like wearing ripped jeans and rumpled shirts?! ;)</p>
<p>P.S.: Although, what you describe as the “occasional pair of pants” sounds quite nice. :)</p>
<p>I don’t know what to say, except looking nice is again, a form of empowerment - they call it “warpaint” for a reason. Yes, we wore make-up to class in college, and make-up to band practice, but we wore jeans and T-shirts. Now football games, everyone wore skirts, boys wore shirt and tie - that’s just the way you do it.</p>
<p>I can certainly understand how a Yankee girl could be a little confused by rush etiquette at say Vandy or SMU - you are talking about kids from some of the wealthiest suburbs in the South, whose Mamas have been setting them up for Tri Delt since they were in diapers. What she failed to understand was that for many girls, the whole family closet is ransacked for those dances + the “Nearly New” shop (that’s what its for). ALso they’ve been collecting formals since they finished growing (we actually have HIGH SCHOOL sororities and frats here), so they might have 2-4 to bring with them, plus one nice new one bought for winter formals and a whole new wardrobe for rush. Remember, we said early on in this thread - Southerners like parties and like any excuse to dress-up!
I don’t really know what sorors are like in the North, but if my daughter was headed to Vandy to rush, I would be calling all the other Moms I know to find out roughly how many outfits - casual, dressy casual, and formal (we even have something called “river casual”) she would need, including shoes, etc - that’s what it’s like, I would never expect her to wear the same outfit twice at rush, and to have at least 2 formals, probably 3. Some folks would go to New York to buy all this stuff, others would be like me and do a combo of new and gently used - I can’t believe sororities at Penn or Dartmouth or Michigan are much different.</p>
<p>Boy, we sure do live in different universes. I cannot in my wildest dreams imagine having any patience whatsoever for anything like that. I guess that’s why it takes all kinds to make our world, eh? :-)</p>
<p>if for some oddball reason i chose to join a sorority - i’d definately wear the same dress twice. or three times. or four. or however many times I had to wear it. clothing is expensive, and it’s pointless to spend money on a dress you’ll only wear once (other than for weddings)… i don’t wear makeup (like, ever), and i don’t care if its frowned upon to leave the house without looking presentable - I don’t care what other people think about how I look. I go to class in my pajamas all the time. :)</p>