Assault/Harassment thread

Parent Cafe
821

Why would she even know it was taxpayer money? Not her fault at all that he was such a bad boss that she had to quit and he owed her restitution.

I agree that the expectation of an NDA is unfortunate. I would want to be able to name someone who victimized me. It seems that we’ve gotten to a point that money = justice when it comes to civil matters like this. It saves everyone time and money to settle out of court and these NDAs become part of the bargain. I don’t think it’s usually the victims that insist on them! The guilty parties want to stay anonymous, hide any patterns of abuse from future complainants, etc. He only wants to drop the NDA now because someone leaked his name. If it was still a secret, he would sure want to keep it that way.

822

I am not attacking anybody. The conversation was that it was no longer confidential. That doesn’t surprise me when money exchanges hands. Maybe if there had been no $$ maybe it would still be confidential. Who knows. Hindsight is a strange thing.

823

RBG talks about her experiences as a college student.

http://www.bbc.com/news/video_and_audio/must_see/42783974/supreme-court-judge-ruth-bader-ginsburg-shares-metoo-story

824

I interpreted “taking money to keep quiet is a little too close to blackmail” as an attack on the woman who got recompense for her (alleged) injury, @momofthreeboys, particularly since, apparently, she wanted to keep quiet anyway. What do you think would have been her correct action? Should she not get recompense? If she is offered recompense, but only if both parties agree to silence, should she not accept that offer?

The mention that, allegedly, Meehan wrote a harassing letter makes me believe her lawyer has the letter.

825

RBG is awesome, and an inspiration to us all.

826

Interesting article that compares the Ansari story to some of those that happen on college campuses:

https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/1/23/16920878/aziz-ansari-affirmative-consent-college-campuses-title-ix-assault

827

Even on CC.

http://www.espn.com/espnw/voices/article/22172044/why-victim-blame-why-larry-nassar-shows

828

@OHMomof2

Thanks for posting the link to the ESPN article.

One thing that struck me was the part about awareness and rules and safety tips — follow the rules and you won’t be a victim. If you are a victim? You must have done something wrong.

829

So many of Nassar’s victims (all?) were children. What happened with the mandated reporters in these children’s lives?! It’s hard to imagine that many of these accusations were not documented somewhere. Won’t someone other than Nassar be held accountable?

830

From the Vox article:

This is baloney. If you are accused of stealing my laptop, and your defense is that I gave it to you, the jury isn’t just going to believe you and say that I have to prove I didn’t give it to you before they convict you.

831

I watched many of the women, and two men, offer testimony against Larry Nassar. What astonishes me is that the women all referred to his abuse of them as “treatments” because that is how he couched it, and he seemed to cast a spell over them so thoroughly that some of the women would hear complaints from other victims and immediately say, “no, that’s perfectly fine, he does the same treatments to me”. They had normalized it in their minds, which much be some sort of defense mechanism.

One of the few women who first came to him as a college student, and was not so easily fooled or persuaded, immediately complained to MSU but had her complaint dismissed. She ended up doubting herself, wondering if she had remembered things differently. But another woman complained to MSU in the 1990s. Oh, they are in trouble!

The testimony is harrowing. Much of the abuse took place at the Karolyi ranch, which was just closed.

http://www.mlive.com/news/index.ssf/2018/01/what_happened_this_week_at_the.html

MSU seeks to dismiss the suits against it.

http://www.mlive.com/news/index.ssf/2018/01/michigan_state_university_seek.html

832

I think we need to remember that most – perhaps all – of Nassar’s victims were underage girls when he first abused them. They might genuinely not understand that his actions were not “treatment.” I don’t think he had to cast much of a spell, given that his victims were genuinely ignorant of medical procedures. How many young girls realize that they should not expect to have treatments that involve their pelvic organs unless they’re at the doctor because of a complaint related to that part of their bodies?

833

Actually Larry Nassar told some of the girls that what he was doing was part of the treatment. One of the women testified that he told her it was part of “myofascial release.” Don’t forget when they were injured part of his treatment was massage.

I thought the most heartbreaking testimony came from the young woman who said that she did tell her parents and he managed to convince them that she was lying or fantasizing. Cannot imagine being those parents today. He must have been a very convincing person.

834

Illustrating how the whole family can become victims, as that denial on the part of the parents probably created a huge breach, at least on some level. It would be very hard for me to forgive that.

835

I am thinking that these were the parents who actually did go to the police. But the investigation came up empty handed and I think it was this that caused the parents to think the young girl made it up. Part of the issue I think was that when asked if he penetrated her she said “no” but later testified that at the time she did not really understand what the word meant. But what she recounted in court during her impact statement was horrible and it did not involve penetration at all. She did not hold back with the specificity of her testimony.

Yes I agree totally that the families were victims of him as well.

836

MPR sent an email out to their supporters today about Garrison Keillor. It is long so I probably can’t excerpt it all. But here is a key paragraph:

There is a ton more in the email, but basically he refused to allow his emails, phone message, etc. to be examined as part of the investigation.

So… his comment that he just touched the woman accidentally on her back under her shirt is sounding pretty disingenuous.

837

The father in this case took his own life a few years ago. His daughter is convinced that the toxic fallout from Nassar and the rift it caused in their family was the reason why.

838

As a distraction from the horrible Nassar story, I offer you the following humorous defense, from Representative Meehan, the guy who bought off a staffer with his office funds.

Our story so far: Meehan allegedly paid romantic attentions to a young staffer. She evinced no interest. When she began a serious relationship with another man, he sent her a romantic letter. When she still was uninterested, he became hostile. She began to work from home, then quit. She accused him of sexual harassment. He bought her off with office funds (taxpayer dollars).

But now, Meehan has come out with what he apparently thinks is a defense. And he released the letter.

He says they had a close working relationship, and he felt a deep affection for her. (Remember, she was not interested. Not.) When he found out she had a serious boyfriend, he took her out for ice cream (his one defensible action. Yum, ice cream) and to confess his his love. He called her his “soul mate.” He hugged her “maybe longer that night than needed to be” (in other words, longer than zero seconds, dude?).

Then he sent her a long cringey letter, which is reproduced in full in the article I link. It starts out, apparently, as a congratulation to her for her relationship with her guy, but it diverges. Seriously. “You are and have been a complete partner to me and you have brought me much happiness.” (Would you want to get that letter from your boss? Who was 35 years older than you and who had announced that he was in love with you?) “I thank God for putting you into my life.” He signed it, “With all of my heart, Patrick.” (Your boss. Imagine this is your boss, Patrick Pervy.)

Oh, and when asked whether a subordinate might not feel comfortable getting such a letter from her employer, Meehan explained that in his office, "there is no hierarchy – we call it Team Meehan.” (Yeah. Right. They take turns casting House votes and making speeches on the floor of the House. It’s all consensus. Sure.)

I can’t decide which of these two is worse:

Number 1, when he was asked why he felt it was necessary to tell his feelings to this poor woman, he said he felt “invited” and he thought by telling his romantic thoughts to her they could figure out a way to keep things from becoming inappropriate. (And here I thought he could keep things from being inappropriate by keeping his fat trap shut.)

Number 2, he said that he acted hostile toward the woman after finding out about the boyfriend because, wait for it, the Affordable Care Act. (No, really, that’s what he said. He treated her like crap because Obamacare.)

He’s not resigning in disgrace. He’s running again. There’s still time for a challenger to primary him-- a challenger who does not creep on people old enough to be their grandchildren, for example.

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/pat-meehan-soul-mate-sexual-harassment-claim-20180123.html

839

California is trying to pass laws around payments for non-disclosures. My feeling is if it’s severance pay, call it that and document it accordingly through HR. If not they are secret payoffs and I don’t think those should be allowed from business or political funds. If $$ is the desired outcome for a victim then the civil courts are available. If it’s an individual paying another individual to keep silent…well that’s bribery and that the payoff will actually remain silent is a risk. Honestly, the best result of sexual harassment is the light of day not this backroom exchange of money.

840

That Garrison Keillor - what a sanctimonious jerk. He loved to throw stones at others in his broadcasts while he lived in a glass house.