We have visited 13 colleges so far, and our list of colleges still to visit between now and the fall is quite long and I am hoping to shorten it. All decisions will be my high school junior’s, of course, but as the College Confidential addict in the family, I am interested in some feedback I can share with him about this portion of his list- small liberal arts colleges that would be good ‘matches.’ He has some safer schools he likes, some more competitive admissions schools he loves, and some other good matches, but he could use more matches: hence, this list. Based on your experience, which aspects of the above colleges might appeal or not appeal to a student who:
–has loved some small liberal arts colleges in remote rural areas and some in suburban areas
–is primarily interested in social studies; will most likely major in history but possibly in another social science (e.g., political science, economics, psychology, philosophy)
–is not a party person; prefers just to hang out with friends
–as a result, does not want a super-heavy frat culture; likes the idea of a school without frats but could also like a school with a more mellow, inclusive, or even nonresidential, Greek life
–loves tennis, and likes frisbee and table tennis
–finds spacious dorms and good food a plus
–wants campus with grassy quads/areas
–has liked schools where the tour/visit left a strong impression of two things:
- Students love learning for learning’s sake, are excited about classes, etc. He prefers a greater focus on learning and ideas for their own sake, compared to a focus mainly on “what’s next” in life (jobs).
- A friendly college that works to foster a strong sense of community and helps students get to know one another at the start of their college experience. He hated a school we visited where most of the kids were eating alone and wearing earbuds.
Thanks!
Sarah Lawrence is a relatively specialized school, focusing on visual and performing arts, literature, writing, psychology, and history. Offerings are rather limited in other subjects like political science, economics, and philosophy.
https://www.sarahlawrence.edu/undergraduate/disciplines/
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Centre College in Danville
Sorry! Danville, Kentucky
It’s all a matter of perspective, but Conn, Dickinson and F&M seemed to us to be schools which were more career and future focused than “learning for learning’s sake” kind of places. That is not to say that there aren’t more intellectually focused kids at each of those schools, but the vibe we got was, good kids working hard to prepare for the future. Conn never clicked for my well-rounded, athletic, artistic son, but that was perhaps driven by disconnect with coach for recruiting and the unusual athletic facility set up (training facilities are on the other side of campus across a foot bridge, but matches are played on the quad in front of dorms and academic buildings, with no real bleacher seating). Dickinson seemed to have earnest, well meaning, hard working kids. We were impressed that the school knows its strengths and builds on them.
Centre would fit that type of school as well, nice kids, engaged with their education. Denison is another possibility – the Lugar program in Poli Sci and the PPE major might be of interest to your student. Student body is a real blend of athletic, social justice, arts, sustainability types, plus greek life is non-residential and, for guys, around 25% participation with spring rush (same as Dickinson), and it has been recognized for its work in fostering economic diversity on campus.
Haverford is a great “learning for learning’s sake” kind of community, though a reach for anyone. As possible safeties, Kalamazoo and Earlham are both inclusive communities, kids are not just going through the motions academically, and neither has greek life.
Thank you all for the information. It is really helpful to hear your perspectives.
Just to clarify: I am looking for feedback on the schools named in the thread’s title. We are trying to shrink a long list, not add schools, although the new ones people described also sound great! (Haverford, which one poster named, also is on my son’s list of schools to visit.) He wants to stay within a six hour drive of home (Long Island).
He spent a lot of time researching schools he wants to visit, but now we need to prune a bit in each category, due to the time and cost involved in visiting them. And he never wants to miss a day of school or of his summer job, so there is a real limit on the number of days available to visit schools prior to November 1st. Hence, I am trying to get info that may help him determine which of the schools named in the title we definitely should visit and which maybe we won’t visit.
Thanks!
My D who attended Dickinson sounds a lot like your son. She thrived there.
Of those on your list we visited Conn College and Lafayette with my liberal arts seeking D. Skidmore, F&M, and Dickinson were on the initial big list, but my D crossed them off before the touring process began, for seemingly silly reasons, but since we needed to cut the list, that was okay.
My DH and I liked Conn Coll. We got an intellectual vibe there and a mix or arty and sciency kids. Students who presented at info session were impressive, senior admissions person was lovely. I respectfully disagree with @Midwestmomofboys who found it career vs learning focused, as we found it liberal artsy in character. Campus was pretty - the quad was enormous - almost too big, like they could have had 2 helicopter landing pads on it. The female/male relationship skewed female, which my D did not like. She did not like the ‘vibe’ but could not really articulate why, other than she said she got a ‘weird’ vibe, which I did not perceive. Food is supposedly good. I thought it was a solid, lovely school, perhaps it didn’t have as much ‘personality’ as others, but for my D, it was not her fav. Though she liked it well enough, that if she didn’t get in to her ED school, it may have stayed on the list.
Lafayette, - pretty, compact campus, with fabulous athletic center. Slightly preppy, but not overwhelmingly so. We had the worst info session and tour guide ever, so my D crossed it off quickly, but I think there is a lot to like about the school. Seemed like a very well balanced place. We chatted with a science professor who we ran into on the tour and he reinforced the fact that kids get a lot of personal attention there which we viewed positively. Some Greek life - did not seem overwhelming.
Is it correct that you have told him your contribution limit, and you and he have checked the net price calculators on each school to see if they are likely to be affordable? Removing the unaffordable ones seems like an easy to do screen if that has not already been done.
Also, he should go through the course catalogs and schedules of each school to check whether each school has good offerings in all of his possible majors (history, political science, economics, psychology, philosophy, whatever else). Removing schools where the academic offerings are inadequate in some of his possible majors (e.g. Sarah Lawrence) could be an easy to do screen that does not involve the cost of visiting or whatever.
Thanks to all posters for your responses about the schools.
He has played with some catalogs and some rate-my-professor stuff-- not sure if he did this for all schools or just some, but it is a good idea to use them to help eliminate schools from the visitation list as well as to study up on ones he has seen already and really likes.
We are fortunate not to have to limit his options for financial reasons. (Doesn’t mean we want to do a whole lot of extra hotel stays for trips to 30 or more schools, when he will need to rule out most of them before applying anyway! Hence, my casual mention of trip cost, although truly the greater concern is time.)
Any more opinions about these schools from students, alumni or parents?
All but SL and Skidmore got apps from DS.
Bard is really the most “intellectual” of those, I think, but also the one with the most different vibe. Visit this one - it may not be a fit or it may be the one. Known as “the dinner party school.” Imo, the most learning for learning’s sake of these. Very interesting place.
Conn seems to attract a mix of kids and has no frats. This one was popular for kids from his school, but when DS visited, the energy in the classrooms was really low so he was less enthused about it.
Lafayette has D1 sports and frats.
Dickinson and F&M seemed particularly friendly. Dickinson has a terrific collection of original documents - great for history majors You can do those 2 on the same trip for sure. Liked these two quite a bit.
@TheGreyKing -
Oh my gosh, I visited six of the schools on your list this year on the college search for my DS17, CoyoteSon. I pasted the link to my thread below - because I may have posted more detailed trip reports on at least some of the schools. My son is interested in both History and Computer Science, but “his people” are the more science/nerdy learning for learnings sake kids.
You should take our impressions with a grain of salt:
- Bard - visited when most students were away for spring break -the kids we did see were very artsy/alternative types - we did see some cigarette smokers on campus; it feels very isolated and rural. Not much beyond a gas station in walking distance, but beautiful campus with a view of the Hudson. Should be great for nearby hiking. I agree this is most different one, along with Sarah Lawrence (which we didn’t visit based on hearing about their British-style tutorials.
- Skidmore - Saratoga Springs is a great college town, and just down the main street from campus - very walkable - filled with restaurants and live music and cute shops. Modern buildings, not my favorite architecture, but we'll laid out campus with covered walkways between main academic buildings, very practical for reducing exposure to falling snow and rain. Best food of any campus (we toured 20!) - we ate a meal afterward, but the campus tour stops to let everyone get a cookie from the bakery in their dining hall. Liked it except for the triples which I gather are standard for freshmen. Very close - lots to like, but the first year dorms took it off the list (housing gers better each year, working up to seniors who get on-campus townhouses, apparently nicer than many apartments)
- Conn. College is the only one to which CoyoteSon applied - visited in summer -,loved the honor code, no frats, the lovely stone buildings set around the big grassy quad with a view toward the Bay/ocean. One main dining hall, but several smaller ones + coffee shops scattered around. Great newly renovated/new wing science building (robotics classroom was cool find in an LAC). For accepted students visit, CoyoteSon's report: students were not engaged in 3 regular classes he sat in on the day after accepted students..some side conversations and texting - he did not get an intellectual vibe - he found most kids,very style conscious and concerned about ECs, sports, visiting the beach, and less about classes. YMMV. I loved the staff/professors, the whole First year seminar/advisor system, the internship program, including grants for nonprofit work, the study abroad - everything except the students just weren't the right fit.
4., 5., 6. I visited when I had 2 days off but CoyoteSon was in school. No class visits.
Lafayette - loved that it had the E-school majors even though an LAC. Great campus layout - I liked that Easton is walkable, though dowe a,steep hill (Easton is less “cute” but at least there are restaurants and shops in walking distance. However, they are Division 1 sports and freshmen are not allowed to rush, so I think the tour guide said about 50% of eligible men are in the frats - way too frat/party focused for CoyoteSon. Also very stylish kids (CoyoteSon is looking for T-shirt/shorts/jeans as the predominant culture - had to go to Midwest to find it.
F&M was a very brief morning visit - kids seemed serious about classes, didn’t strike me as friendly-but I was there very early AM. Left by 9 or 9:30 am.
Dickinson was best possible of these 3: a mix of stylish kids and PHF/alt kids/sporty kids. Friendly vibe, good food at student center and a college run sandwich/deli in another building. Very cute and walkable downtown even closer, if not quite as extensive as Saratoga Springs. Per info session, very focused on languages and IR. Gorgeous new science center and new gym. Fit didn’t seem quite right, but close, and closer than ConnCollege turned out to be.
Just one family’s impressions, though. You may get more of a sense of CoyoteSon’s perspective from this thread I started last year:
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1915129-are-there-lacs-i-should-add-to-sons-list-p1.html
Re Skidmore housing…yes, for the past few years nearly all freshman have been tripled. That was disappointing for my D but it lasted just one semester. She asked for a room change and was given a single second semester. Her sophomore year she shared a double with her choice of roommate. What we really liked about the housing on our tour were the “pods”. Each pod consisted of a double (actually a triple) and two singles primarily for sophomores, so 4 or 5 to a bathroom and very large storage closet. Most of the rooms have a 10’ window seat, some looking over to the mountains, some to the quad outside the dining hall. Next year my rising junior will have an apartment, four girls each with their own 9x12 bedroom (full bed), full kitchen, living area and bathroom. We toured dozens of schools and the housing and food at Skidmore rated right at the top.
Any chance you can tell us which schools so far have made the cut? That might help people identify “more like this” schools.
I have visited exactly zero of these schools, but they were all schools we considered visiting at one point or another. Our kid sounds similar to yours in terms of the social vibe he was looking for, but is more STEM-focused so his list tilted in a different direction.
Operating strictly seat-of-the-pants based on everything I’ve learned from friends and here on CC, here’s my very loose sequencing of the schools from most intellectual to most fratty/sporty. I’m sure others will disagree … think of it as a conversation starter. This is just about vibe. I can’t speak to dorms or quads or tennis or food or any of the other specifics.
Bard / Sarah Lawrence
Skidmore
Dickinson / Connecticut College
Lafayette / F&M
In your shoes, I’d have my kid read up on Sarah Lawrence and Bard and see if they sing to him or make him run the other way. If they sing to him you should visit, but if the descriptions put him off, knock them off the list.
I’d do the same with Lafayette & F&M. I think they are the other end of the spectrum and I think the descriptions will either be appealling or off-putting.
Arrange the rest of your list accordingly. Personally, I’d vote for the middle range (Skidmore/Dickenson/Connecticut) but your kid’s reaction to the ones on either end of the spectrum will inform that choice. (We also looked at stuff like ethnic/geographic diversity … there may be a tipping point there as well for some kids.)
^ I think that you’ll find intellectuals at all of these schools. I’m biased since I went to F&M and my son, who considered and applied to several of these schools, will be attending Lafayette next year. I can see the above list working on a scale of least to most pre-professional. I think if your son is broadly arty he will find a place at any of these schools. If he is more focused in his interests then there might be a school or schools that will be a better fit. His academic interests would be a great fit for F&M.
@Temperantia - I think that’s a fair assessment. I didn’t mean to imply that he wouldn’t find intellectuals on one end of the spectrum … just a different vibe. Pre-professional sounds like the right word. Not a bad thing, just different.
Yes, thank you. All schools will have a range of students and experiences. Looking for an overall vibe that values learning for its own sake, informal conversations in dorms and dining halls about topics of intellectual interest, etc. Learning and thinking as necessary for fulfillment, not just steps that will get you to a high-paying job.