SA isn’t “an issue”, it’s a crime and it should be treated that way. In my view it should never, ever be handled by the schools - it should be handled by the judicial system as it would be in any other case.
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Well, @SJ2727, @CFP, @Data10, @CGLM, @blossom, and @natty1988 only posted in this thread after the discussion about the Cornell sexual assault case started. But perhaps it’s just your general impression from earlier.
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I didn’t say it wasn’t a crime, and this case was forwarded to the judicial system and based on the evidence it wasn’t prosecuted. Now new evidence has come to light via the new lawsuit and the DA has said he will look into it again. All I said was that Cornell acted on the information it had at the time. It just seems that many want to judge Cornell’s actions 2 years ago on information that is only now available and it doesn’t work that way.
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I think the challenge is that the school had enough information to expel two students two years ago. So either there was insufficient evidence two years ago and no negative consequences should have been given to anyone, or there was sufficient evidence for more than two people to receive serious consequences.
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Bingo. This is the 2026 version of “boys will be boys” and it stinks to high heaven. There is not a single employee of a college- any college- who should be involved in any way with what is clearly a criminal manner. I know instances where the entire chain of custody of evidence was tampered with (intentionally or by accident?) by an allegedly “trained” college employee. Emptying the trash, wiping down a sink, vacuuming the hallway-- let alone retrieving a condom-- these activities have NO place anywhere near a crime scene/alleged crime scene. The prosecutors often have no choice but to toss a case where the physical evidence has not been collected and preserved in accordance with the law.
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It seems that the expulsions may have been for drugs.
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In this case, it was - two years ago and will now go to a grand jury with new evidence.
There are many cases from OJ to others where people we all know are guilty - are not found to be so.
That’s part of living in America.
We know there were no criminal charges two years ago and we don’t know that there will be this time.
But on this thread these boys have been tried and found guilty. And btw, that’s likely in homes across America from anyone who read the news yesterday.
But while frustrating, that’s what we have in America - and none of us know for certain what the end result will be.
It could very well be that no charges are brought. It could also very well be no charges should be brought - although none of us are even tangential to the situation to know if the grand jury will have made the proper decision.
Based on the statements of two years ago, and I don’t know who of the seven men named yesterday did what, but I would hope their lives wouldn’t be ruined, although for two kicked out they already have been.
If they are found guilty, then, of course, I hope they get punished to the full extent of the law - which I hope is not lenient in penalties.
But I will not find someone guilty based on the articles, but rather based upon what our jury system decides. That’s the rights we have.
“Well, @SJ2727, @CFP, @Data10, @CGLM, @blossom, and @natty1988 only posted in this thread after the discussion about the Cornell sexual assault case started. But perhaps it’s just your general impression from earlier.”
I can only answer for myself. In general, I have little interest in the “unbecoming” witch hunts which have become so fashionable. There is too much actual criminal behavior (higher ed, Congress and the Federal branch, health care, military, etc.) for me to start clutching my pearls over “unbecoming”.
But the current issue at Cornell touches on MANY more important topics than just “does Cornell’s president have an anger management problem”. He’s got a boss (the entire board of trustees) and they’ve got to figure that out.
But society as a whole has a vested interest in making sure that students who assault other students don’t get to graduate, get high paying jobs in finance, etc. without eventually having to face the consequences. If we are to be a society with ANY shred of self-respect, norms, etc. the rule of law has to function-- even belatedly, and even haphazardly as it so often does.
I remember when NY extended the statute of limitations on child SA and there was a hue and cry that it would be bringing forth “false memories”, fake accusations, taking prominent people down, vigilante justice, etc. A friend of mine who had a horrific story from summer camp decades ago finally came forward. You ask “why didn’t she report it then?” Well, you’re 9 years old and you’re about to “rat out” an authority figure, and is likely not to be believed by family, friends, and law enforcement. Would YOU step forward and ruin your own life only to see your abuser face ZERO consequences?
Good for Wells Fargo for at least taking action.
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If the evidence supports it (seems very strong but none of us have the exact details other than what’s reported in the media), they should be criminally prosecuted which of course would stop their career trajectory pretty quickly.
I dont understand how some people (not you, but in general) view “expulsion” as the ceiling for punishment. That’s absurd.
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Here’s an article you all might find of interest.
Again, this is all out of court - but if this is the type of stuff presented to a grand jury, I don’t see how the boys will be found guilty.
If this is the case is it fair that their lives are wrecked?
We, of course, don’t know the case - but on my facebook feed, there must have been 20 people who have already found them guilty.
From the linked article:
She also wrote, “non(e) of the sexual stuff was illegal.” She said she liked being with him and another man. Later, she suggested they smoke together again, “but like leave out the extra 5 billion men and ketamine.”
I saw what the boys wrote on the billboard and what they said, and yes it’s disgusting. But that sentence from her is pretty damning, if true.
We shall see. But it’s such a shame.
All these kids now are working their asses off to get into great college situations. And any one of them an be victim or perpetrator in a year or two. How does that happen?
Exclusive text messages reveal new details in alleged gang rape at Cornell University - CBS New York
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It seems that while NY state law doesn’t count being intoxicated if “willingly” so, as mentioned above, the Cornell code of conduct is stricter and states that an intoxicated person is incapable of giving consent. Part of an article published by a Cornell prof yesterday (paywall so I can’t link). I assume this will come up as part of the way the college handled the case. I am guessing at some point there will be more clarity on exactly what was and wasn’t done by the college. I also saw something that said the statements to “police” were to college police and not the Ithaca police department, and that no one from the latter followed up. Apparently none of the men were interviewed even. I expect the court case will make things a lot clearer, one way or the other.
Reputational damage is a thing of course, and I think that’s there regardless of the criminal outcome. I can fully see why a bank (especially) or other company would not want an employee who took advantage of an intoxicated girl and advertised it on a group chat, just like I can fully understand why companies fire people who say racist things on social media which is not a criminal act either. Would you want one of those guys at your company Christmas party around the interns, for example?
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From the Greek life thread: it appears the transcript of the interview differentiates between the earlier and later incidents, and that the full transcript was not provided to the DA.
Wow, that’s why none of us know - none of us have all the info and we are hearing bits and pieces.
That’s pretty damning vs. previous releases which didn’t appear to be daming.
In the end, I hope if people are guilty, they are found guilty and heavily penalized.
Does that mean it’s all seven or some of the seven?
Hopefully all materials will come out so a proper response is made by a jury. That’s the most important thing.
A random chat board is not the court system.
So this NYT article (gift link) says it was the Cornell police who “condensed” the statement they gave the DA and left out the rape claim:
The woman spoke for hours with an officer, telling him how what began as a consensual sexual encounter with a man she liked spiraled into a prolonged drug-fueled attack by several men inside the Chi Phi fraternity house.
“I don’t remember the very end of the event where I was raped,” she told them. “I can say with 100 percent confidence I was raped.”
The officer then condensed the interview into a six-page “voluntary statement” written from her perspective, according to documents obtained by The New York Times. The student, after leaving about 20 handwritten corrections on a draft, signed a final version the next day.
While the shorter statement explained that she felt some of that night’s events were a crime, it omitted some of the more forceful and definitive language she used. And it was missing her unequivocal statement that she had been raped. The omission, which for a time seemed to end the case, instead now appears to have only delayed a case that has roiled the campus and renewed the national debate how colleges handle claims of sexual assault.
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Probably better to say that it should not be handled only by the schools – a school (or employer, etc.) may take action in addition to (and not interfering with) any action that is (or should be) taken by the police and courts.
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Also interesting that the student newspaper (one reporter in particular) had been following this case ever since there was a campus wide alert of the sexual assault in 2024. I had somehow gotten the impression that they had just found out about the lawsuit and that was why they published last week, but they had been following the case all the time inbetween.
These student journalists at Cornell University were pressing through a dizzying two weeks following the story of a student’s allegation that she was raped on campus in 2024.
The case had long had their attention; now it had burst into the national spotlight, and their high-risk decision to publish the names of the accused was being discussed not only in Cornell’s libraries and walkways but in the national media.
Back in November 2024, students at Cornell were shaken by an alert they received over email: “Crime ALERT: Sexual Assault," the email read, referring to the case of a woman who told the Cornell police she had been assaulted at a fraternity house.
Gift link: Students at Cornell Daily Sun Pursued Sexual Assault Case for Two Years - The New York Times
Also interesting to me that when the alert email went out to the student body in Nov 24, its subject line was “CRIME ALERT: SEXUAL ASSAULT”.
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New statement. A good start.
Transcript. I put a few line breaks:
Hello, Cornellians, students, alumni, faculty, staff, and parents. I’ve been at Cornell and part of this community for more than 26 years. In almost every speech I make, I talk about that precious community and the unique bonds between us. This has been one of the most difficult weeks in our history. and I know many of you are angry, saddened, and struggling, and that those bonds are under extraordinary stress.
What happened to Jane Doe in 2024 is deeply disturbing and will weigh heavily on our community for years to come. My heart aches when I think of what she experienced. It raises heartbreaking and troubling issues about sexual assault, dehumanization, and aspects of party culture, alcohol, and drug use. It also raises questions around the investigations conducted after the allegations were reported.
I want to acknowledge something that can be difficult for an institution to say. We don’t have all the answers, but we are committed to investigating and finding the answers our community deserves. I believe we as an administration and we as a community must do better. We must do everything we can to prevent what happened to Jane Doe and everyone before her and anyone after her from ever happening again.
As a community, we must foster a culture in which sexual assault is inexcusable and ensure our community is empowered and understands informed consent, body autonomy, and prevention. We all have a role to play in keeping each other safe. And understanding that sexual violence exists within our society and our community as leaders, we must create an environment in which people who experience sexual assault feel safe coming forward and are treated with compassion and dignity.
We must have systems that are trauma-informed and provide survivors the services they need. We must also investigate allegations rigorously and fairly, including providing due process. In conjunction with our Board of Trustees, I welcome the independent review by an outside law firm into all aspects of Cornell’s handling of the 2024 matter, which the Board will announce next week.
We also support the Governor’s decision to turn the criminal investigation over to the New York Attorney General. But we will not wait for the investigation or the review review to be completed before we act. Where we see opportunities to strengthen prevention and education, student support, mental health and substance use resources, investigative processes or coordination among our university offices, we will act.
The review should inform additional changes, not delay improvements already underway or ones we know we can make today. I believe the change starts with us, the Cornell community. In early 2025, in the wake of what happened to Jane Doe, we established the Presidential Task Force on Sexual Assault to make recommendations focused on prevention and improving the social context in which sexual assaults occur. We fully endorsed the Task Force recommendations, which have already led to substantial changes in education, prevention, and support, with more work to come.
We must also take this moment to re-engage our community and for the Task Force to come together and have hard conversations about our campus culture and its future, and to find new ways to do more. I also hear the frustration that Cornell has not communicated enough about what the university did after the assault was reported, which has led to distrust. There are real legal and privacy limits on what we can say, but we will make a greater effort to explain what we can, to provide context about the actions Cornell has taken, and to be more transparent. This message is the beginning of what we hope will be an ongoing, constructive, and dynamic conversation with our community.
In the coming weeks, we will create additional opportunities for members of our community to ask questions and hear directly from university leadership. That will include opportunities for Cornell leadership to listen to our community, including including parents of our current students, and, as we look ahead to the Volunteer Summit, additional forums for our extended Cornell community to engage with university and board leadership about what we have done, what we are doing now, and what more needs to be done. We also need to be the author of our own future as an institution. At the appropriate time, we will speak in greater detail about how Cornell will use this moment, this conversation, this anger, to help lead the broader effort to combat sexual assault, not only on our campus, but beyond it.
Cornell has extraordinary resources and expertise. We will bring them to bear, building respect for each other as human beings, understanding the factors that lead to this behavior, and the interventions that mitigate it, improving support for those who experience sexual violence and advancing research that can deepen our understanding of sexual assault, trauma, intoxication, and consent, and help shape better practices and policies elsewhere. That broader work should include a serious look at the role of fraternities and sororities in campus life. At their best, these organizations can provide students with friendship, belonging, mentorship, and a powerful sense of community. But being part of a group can never diminish individual responsibility for our own actions, for how we treat others, or for speaking up when someone may be at risk. We will re-engage students, alumni, and other members of our community to examine how we preserve what is valuable about Greek life, while strengthening individual accountability, transparency, and a culture in which every member understands their responsibility to protect the safety and well-being of others. We will also lend our full support to legislative efforts to change New York’s sexual assault laws. you have my commitment that this will not be a moment that passes. We will continue taking every step necessary to make Cornell an institution that leads not just in what we say about these issues but in the work that we do to address them. We are listening we are learning we are committed to communicating more openly and where we can do better we will that is our responsibility responsibility, and is one I take personally. This is a defining moment in Cornell’s history. We must lead the way. We owe it to Jane Doe and to survivors of assault to get this right. And we must keep each other safe.
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Good start if sincere.
Companies/orgs create committees and task forces, often for show, but the needle rarely moves.
Time will tell if it’s a good start….