<p>[Expected</a> Family Contribution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expected_Family_Contribution]Expected”>Expected family contribution - Wikipedia)</p>
<p>in fact, i think i read that at harvard, the EFC is zero (free) if the family makes less than 60K.</p>
<p>UC Berkeley has the best Chemistry program in the world. MIT, Caltech, Harvard and other top public have also an excellent Chem program.</p>
<p>You can probably score some merit scholarships…</p>
<p>I have gotten great suggestions from these responses. Since we are Missouri family, which private schools will provide the best financial package. What about public schools and OOS students?</p>
<p>Well, typically the Ivies will give good aid to anyone who gets in. Most private schools are good with aid, but the Ivies stand out in particular. </p>
<p>Public schools typically won’t give OOS students much aid. They can’t - state tax payers would be livid. The exception to this rule is found at lower tier publics, which will sometimes give scholarships to the highest quality OOS applicants (in hopes of bringing up their averages).</p>
<p>The chemistry site at Purdue say the are generally in the top 20 in the nation. How do you think they rank with the others?</p>
<p>My D and I just got back from Northwestern, UIUC, and Notre Dame.1,100 miles in three days WOW! She seems to like Northwestern and Notre Dame the best due to size and what they have to offer, of course they are both top notch schools. So, I 'm thinking she would prefer private schools with about 8 to 15 thousand students. She has Rice on her list to visit too.</p>
<p>Can someone give me a list of schools that are good for undergraduate chemistry that fir the profiles of Northwestern and Notre Dame? Keep in mind we are a Midwestern family, so a school on either coast is probably not a good choice.</p>
<p>For the schools you’re looking at, all are great.</p>
<p>If I had to rate via undergrad chemistry, I’d say:</p>
<ol>
<li>UIUC (but maybe too large for your daughter’s tastes)</li>
<li>Northwestern/ Rice (very respected programs)</li>
<li>Notre Dame</li>
</ol>
<p>Gourman Report undergrad chemistry ranking:
Caltech
UC Berkeley
Harvard
MIT
Columbia
Stanford
Illimois Urbana Champaign
U Chicago
UCLA
Wisconsin Madison
Cornell
Northwestern
Princeton
Yale
Purdue
UNC Chapel Hill
Ohio State
Texas Austin
Iowa State
Indiana Bloomington
UC San Diego
Minnesota
Notre Dame
Penn State
Brown
U Rochester
Carnegie Mellon
U Penn
Rice
Michigan Ann Arbor
U Washington
Colorado Boulder
Texas A&M
USC
U Pittsburgh
U Florida
UC Riverside
dartmouth
UC Santa Barbara
UC Irvine
Johns Hopkins
UC Davis
U Utah
U Oregon
Duke
Michigan State
RPI
UVA
Florida State
Vanderbilt
Case Western
u Iowa
Georgia Tech </p>
<p>LACs for chemistry from Rugg’s
Amherst
Barnard
Bates
Bowdoin
Bryn Mawr
Bucknell
Carleton
Centre
Colgate
Dartmouth
Davidson
Drew
Franklin and Marshall
Furman
Grinnell
Hamilton
Harvey Mudd
Haverford
Kalamazoo
Kenyon
Lafayette
Lawrence
Mount Holyoke
New College
Oberlin
Occidental
Pomona
Reed
St Olaf
Trinity (TX)
Union
Wellesley
Wesleyan
Wheaton
Whitman
Willamette
Williams</p>
<p>If your D is interested in research, these schools (a few in the midwest) have the best record of producing future PhDs in chemistry (suggesting that their undergrad preparation is good):</p>
<p>Harvey Mudd
Reed
CalTech
Wabash
Carleton
Grinnell
Wooster
Kalamazoo
Texas Lutheran
Bowdoin</p>
<p>(from [REED</a> COLLEGE PHD PRODUCTIVITY](<a href=“http://web.reed.edu/ir/phd.html]REED”>Doctoral Degree Productivity - Institutional Research - Reed College))</p>
<p>so so that gets crossed off.</p>
<p>I’d add Pomona to that list</p>
<p>dear college help,</p>
<p>Your list is fine and I have seen it before. But you evidently, did not really read my post from yesterday. Please read post #27</p>
<p>That list is outdated (more than 10 years old?) anyway.</p>
<p>Sam Lee,</p>
<p>Do you have any new suggestion that meet the criteria in post #27?</p>
<p>The U of Chicago meets your criteria.</p>
<p>In the midwest, maybe Oberlin/Carleton?</p>
<p>future chem dad,</p>
<p>I started pursuing a B.S. in Chemistry three years ago and have transfered schools numerous times in search of a place that I felt was giving me a good chemical education. If I’ve learned anything, it is that most rankings don’t mean anything. You’ve been given some good advice so far in terms of good schools, but not the greatest in terms of value or quality of life.</p>
<p>A couple of questions:
Is your daughter 100% positive that she wants to pursue a degree in Chemistry?
Is your daughter interested in a particular field of Chemistry?
Does your daughter have a desire to participate in real research?
Has your daughter had previous research experience?
Does your daughter have any AP credits?
Does your daughter want to pursue a PhD?</p>
<p>If you daughter has any sort of interest in research, do not look at Liberal Arts Colleges without a graduate program or with a limited one. At schools without a graduate program, research is usually not so great or non-existent. While the quality of education at y first school was absolutely fantastic, I left because there were no opportunities for undergraduate research. Unfortunately, a big state school (where I am now) can also have this problem depending on what field you are interested in. It’s not a lack of research or positions, but simply that graduate students are so abundant that there is literally no space in some labs.You still have much better chances of rewarding research opportunities at a big state school than at a LAC without a graduate program.</p>
<p>If I were looking for schools again, I would narrow my focus to schools of ~3000-1000 undergraduates and a few big state schools. Here’s my general advice about selecting a college:</p>
<p>Look for schools with serious graduate programs, but that have a well established and good undergraduate research program. Look at syllabi for first year and second year courses and look at the depth in which material is covered and the experiments in the lab–schools that integrate analytical techniques such as NMR, FT-IR, GC/MS, HPLC early on tend to be good, but this is not a hard set rule. Look for schools with professors whose research is exciting/interesting. Look for a school where you will be happy; don’t choose pedigree over quality of life.</p>
<p>Try to get as much research experience as possible as early as possible. There are several programs for high school specifically. I cannot stress how important the experience is and the relationships forged with professors as a result is for opening up future possibilities of research, graduate school, or a job. As a freshman or sophomore without prior research experience, it will be difficult to find a professor who will be willing to let you work in their group. If you have prior research experience, your chances shoot way up. Research experience also opens up a lot of co-ops/internships with pharmaceutical companies and many opportunities for paid international travel/research.</p>
<p>Not sure when you are eligible to apply–I think you have to be in college already–but please look into scholarships. For exceptional students, there are many opportunities such as the Goldwater scholarship, Beckman scholars program, and usually tons of departmental scholarships.</p>
<p>If you have any other questions, I’d be happy to answer them.</p>
<p>P.S.
I know a couple of chemistry students who have had very positive experiences at Rice.</p>
<p>“Quote”“If you daughter has any sort of interest in research, do not look at Liberal Arts Colleges without a graduate program or with a limited one. At schools without a graduate program, research is usually not so great or non-existent.”“Quote”</p>
<p>I attend a top LAC and 4 of the freshman in my hall alone are doing research! It depends on the school for sure, but Pomona, Swarthmore, Amherst, Williams, Carleton, Harvey Mudd and other top LACs for science are certainly not going to be hard to do research at.</p>
<p>
I see a bit of a contradiction here, considering how many of these schools (the top ten in the country for percentage of graduates who later earn a PhD in chemistry) are LACs:</p>
<p>Harvey Mudd
Reed
CalTech
Wabash
Carleton
Grinnell
Wooster
Kalamazoo
Texas Lutheran
Bowdoin</p>
<p>At LACs, undergrads do all of the research (but it may be mostly restricted to seniors), which is widely considered the reason some LACs have such high future PhD percentages.</p>
<p>Except for this issue, I agree with noct’s “general advice about selecting a college.”</p>