Biology Transfer, 4.0 College GPA [at US online university] + Research + 323 hrs medical volunteering — Can I overcome a weak HS record? [international in process of applying for US permanent residency]

Chance Me / Match Me
, ,
1

Demographics

  • International student

  • Location: South Korea

  • Current college: Small U.S. university, primarily online

  • Other special factors: Nontraditional secondary-school background (Canadian high school + Korean GED)

Cost Constraints / Budget

  • Around $30–40k/year

  • Financial aid would be important, especially at private universities.

Intended Major(s)

  • Biology / Biological Sciences

  • Also interested in Psychology, Behavioral Science, and interdisciplinary health-related programs

  • Long-term interest in medicine and healthcare systems

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores

  • College GPA: 4.00/4.00

  • HS record: Significantly weaker than my college record

  • Class Rank: N/A

  • ACT/SAT: N/A for transfer application

List your HS coursework

My high school background is somewhat nontraditional. I attended high school in Canada before completing my secondary-school qualification through the Korean GED.

College Coursework (Transfer Applicant)

General education:

  • English Composition I & II

  • Psychology

  • Math / quantitative coursework

  • Social science coursework

Major preparation:

  • General Biology I & II

  • General Chemistry I & II + Lab

  • Physics

  • Biopsychology

  • Quantitative Methods in Psychology

Most of my college coursework has been completed online.

Awards

  • President’s Letter for maintaining a 4.0 GPA

  • Coauthor of a research paper on CBD as an anti-metastatic agent

Extracurriculars

  • Medical volunteering – 323 hours

    • Patient assistance

    • Volunteer coordination

    • Event operations

    • External relations / organizational work

    • Leadership responsibilities during medical-service events

  • Research

    • Coauthor of a paper examining molecular mechanisms related to CBD and cancer metastasis

  • Work

    • Restaurant/service job experience

  • Architecture/design

    • Previous architecture coursework and design projects

Essays/LORs/Other

My biggest application theme will probably be how medical volunteering changed my view of healthcare. I became interested not only in biology and medicine, but also in how communication, organizations, and communities affect patient care.

I think my strongest LORs will come from college professors and leadership from my medical volunteer organization.

Main strengths:

  • 4.0 college GPA

  • Strong upward academic trend

  • 323 hours of medical volunteering

  • Research/publication experience

  • Science-heavy curriculum

Main concerns:

  • Weak/nontraditional high school record

  • Korean GED

  • Primarily online college

  • Some online/simulation-based lab work

  • International transfer applicant

Schools

Still deciding how to classify these:

  • University of Michigan – Ann Arbor

  • Rice

  • Boston College

  • Boston University

  • Emory

  • UNC Chapel Hill

  • University of Florida

  • Vanderbilt

  • Northwestern

  • Duke

  • Cornell

  • UCLA

  • Stanford

Michigan and Rice are currently my two biggest targets.

I would especially appreciate opinions on:

  1. How much can a 4.0 college GPA compensate for a weaker high school/GED record?

  2. How much will attending a primarily online university hurt at selective transfer schools?

  3. How competitive are 323 hours of medical volunteering + a research publication for schools like Michigan or Rice?

  4. What schools would you consider realistic matches/safeties for this profile?

2

Would you be transferring in as a soph or junior? If as a soph, your HS record will be an important factor. What was your GPA and test score?

Have all your science classes had a lab component, or just Chem I/II?

Have you run NPCs at the schools on your list? Some will say they aren’t valid for international students, so pay attention to that. No way Michigan comes in at your price point, as they don’t give need based aid to internationals, nor would there be enough merit to get to your price. BU also doesn’t give need based aid to international students, so off the list it goes.

You are going to have to identify some schools with higher admit rates that will also meet your price point if you really want to transfer.

5 Likes
3

These are all reaches in terms of acceptance and affordability. As stated above your HS record will be important if applying as a sophomore.

You also need to carefully check the financial aid policy for international transfer students (ex. Check but I don’t think Rice gives aid to international transfer students.)

1 Like
4

Q: Do you have ACT or SAT scores? Many colleges require these scores for transfer admissions while others do not.

5

One thing that you need to keep in mind. Admissions to medical school in the US and in Canada is insanely difficult, almost impossible, for an international student. You should not expect to be able to get into medical school in North America after getting your bachelor’s degree in North America. I remember a post years ago (possibly not on this web site) from an international student who had somewhere around about a 4.0 in premed classes at the University of Toronto and was unhappy that he could not get into any medical school in North America. This is what an international student should expect.

If you are intending to go on for a PhD and go into biomedical research, that is at least possible. Admissions to PhD programs is very, very competitive, but is at least possible for an international student.

Regarding what it takes to get into medical school in South Korea, I have no idea.

Premed classes, and classes for a biology major, include quite a few lab classes. How do you handle this with online study?

Part of what is going to be difficult is to meet the budget as a transfer student. Highly ranked schools such as Stanford accept very few transfer students. The transfer students accepted to Cornell are mostly in-state. The various public universities on your list will similarly take most of their transfer students from in-state community colleges. Since you are out of state for UCLA, it will be way over budget, and most likely more than twice your budget.

I think that everything on your list is a reach if you include both acceptance and affordability.

One thing that I do not understand from your post is how many college classes you have with a 4.0 GPA. If you have one year of classes your high school GPA will also matter. If you have two years of college classes then high school will matter quite a bit less, but then I wonder whether you have gone two years without a lab class.

The schools near the top of your list might be more likely for admissions. I do not know if they will be affordable.

There are probably very good universities in Canada where admissions and affordability are more likely. You might want to look for example at Dalhousie (in Nova Scotia), and Concordia (in Montreal). If you want a smaller school then Mount Allison (in New Brunswick), Acadia (Nova Scotia), and St. Francis Xavier (also Nova Scotia) might be worth considering. There are lots of other schools that are also worth considering but that I am not as familiar with. I wonder about U. of Victoria, U. Calgary, Memorial University of Newfoundland, as possibilities. The last time that I looked universities in Ontario seemed to be a bit more expensive for international students so I have not mentioned any schools there, but there are many very good universities in Ontario so you might want to check the cost of attendance for some of these. When checking the cost of attendance keep the exchange rate in mind. The Canadian dollar is weaker compared to the US dollar.

This depends upon the university. This also depends upon how many classes you have in college with a 4.0 GPA, and may depend upon how your senior year of high school went.

Universities in Canada will mostly care about your most recent two years of school. If you have a 4.0 for your most recent two years then your chances are excellent and you are mostly going to need to think about affordability (and US$40,000 should be sufficient at some universities in Canada, although maybe not all).

Some state schools in the US and large schools in the US may be similar, although affordability may be questionable (and is probably hopeless at UCLA or any other of the Universities of California).

One small nit: Regarding your high school in Canada, I am assuming that you are not a Canadian citizen and do not have permanent residence in Canada. If you do have either Canadian citizenship or permanent residency, then universities in Canada will all become affordable with a US$40,000/year budget and this could make a big difference.

By the way, I have had a couple of trips to South Korea, and liked it a great deal. It was a great pleasure and honor to have the opportunity to visit your beautiful country. Best wishes.

6

Thank you so much for taking the time to write such a detailed response. This was very helpful, especially because you pointed out several things that I probably did not explain clearly in my original post.

I am aware that medical school admission in the U.S. is extremely difficult for international students, so I am not assuming that completing my bachelor’s degree in the U.S. would automatically lead to U.S. medical school. Medicine is still one of my long-term interests, but I am also interested in biomedical research and healthcare systems, and I am keeping multiple paths open.

One additional factor I probably should have mentioned is that my U.S. permanent residency application is currently in process, and I am waiting for an interview date. I am still treating myself as an international applicant for now, since I do not know when the process will be completed, but I would also be interested to know how much this could change my situation if I receive permanent residency before transferring or before applying to medical school.

Regarding the online coursework, I have taken science courses with lab components rather than going without labs. However, some of those labs are online/simulation-based, which is actually one of my biggest concerns when transferring. I have taken coursework in biology, chemistry, and physics, and I am continuing with Biology II and Chemistry II with lab coursework as well.

For my college record, I have maintained a 4.0 while taking a full course load, and by the time I transfer I will have roughly two academic years of college coursework. My college coursework includes biology, chemistry, physics, English composition, psychology, mathematics/quantitative coursework, and other general education courses. My high school record is definitely much weaker, so I am hoping the larger body of college work will help show that I am a very different student academically now.

The $30–40k figure was probably misleading in my original post. That would be the preferred budget, but it is not necessarily a hard ceiling. If I were fortunate enough to be admitted to a school like Michigan, which is by far my first choice, my family and I would try to find a way to make the finances work. I am mainly trying to understand my admission chances separately from affordability.

I also appreciate the Canadian university suggestions. I attended high school in Canada, so I am familiar with the system, although I would still be considered an international student there.

Thank you again for the advice, and also for your kind words about South Korea. I really appreciate you taking my situation seriously and explaining the reasoning behind your recommendations.

1 Like
7

I do not know how receiving your permanent residency would impact the in-state versus out-of-state tuition costs if you are already enrolled at a public “state” university at the time that you get your permanent resident status. If this happens I would ask whatever school you are attending or are about to attend.

Otherwise, for the purposes discussed here (education), the day that you get your permanent resident status you are essentially equivalent to being a US citizen. This would make you a domestic applicant and could help quite a bit. It would in particular help quite a bit with admissions to medical school. Of course admissions to medical school is still tough for anyone, but being a permanent resident would make a huge difference.

If you have an application for permanent resident status in the works, at least as far as I know you need to stay in the USA until this is resolved, so the schools in Canada likely would not work from this perspective.

This will help a great deal.

I think that this makes Michigan at least a possibility. In your situation I would most likely also put in an application to Michigan State University.

If you ever get to medical school, then you will find that the various students there come from a huge range of undergraduate schools. In medical school you might very well find students who got their bachelor’s degree at Harvard, U of Michigan, Michigan State, Western Michigan University, and a very, very wide range of other universities studying alongside each other and no one will care where anyone got their bachelor’s degree – they will all be way too busy keeping up with the medical school coursework. Similarly PhD students at very good biomedical PhD programs come from a huge range of undergraduate schools. Doing very well when getting your bachelor’s degree matters. Getting good medical shadowing and/or research experience matters. Your letters of reference will matter. For graduate admissions including medical school admissions where you got your undergraduate degree does not matter as much.

And of course by the time that you apply to medical school, or to a PhD program, no one will ask and no one will care how you did in high school.

Best wishes. I do hope that your green card comes through soon and wish you the best. To me it sounds like you are doing very well.

8
  • Around $30–40k/year

What is the true budget.

All these are $60K + except UF and I imagine the privates will be unlikely unless you don’t qualify for need. Then they might open up.

There are lots of schools in the US you can stay within or close to budget (LACs, regional publics and more) but they won’t have the name.

Most your schools are need aware for international.

If you are able to pay $100K and cost them no aid, then you may have better odds.

This is why a budget is important - not - well it could go up. Up to what?

You also may need a test score (maybe not SAT/ACT), depending on the school, to show a mastery of English.

Good luck.