Hey guys! So I was extremely fortunate and got into my top 2 schools: Brown and Harvard! I’m super ecstatic and shocked, but at the same time, I’m so split between the two colleges that I was hoping you guys could help provide some insight. I will be visiting both colleges in a week, but that only leaves 3-4 days after visiting to make my decision on May 1st.
Here are some things I’m interested/worried about:
-How is the undergraduate experience at Harvard compared to Brown?
-For those who actually go/went to either school, how inclusive is it? And to what degree can you interact with the professors there?
-Are there any issues that you faced that might be a common problem for undergraduates that go there?
Also, my fit (which is something only I can answer. I consider myself as an introvert, and I hope that either school would be a great fit)
I’m going in as biology, with hopes of doing something like MCB or immunology. I’m not sure yet. I’m hoping to do some research during my time at college.
I’d prefer honest, first-hand experience at either school, but I welcome any help I can get. Just please don’t put down either school. Thank you so much!
Students at both schools interact with professors. The biggest difference between the schools is Harvard’s General Education Requirements vs. Brown’s Open Curriculum.
Which school’s educational philosophy is more in sync with the way you think? No one but you is going to be able to answer that question.
I wrote the below on another thread, but it’s absolutely applicable to your situation.
True story: Three kids from New York City go to the same elementary school together. All three go to different middle schools, high schools, and colleges. One goes to UMich, one goes to Vanderbilt and one goes to Harvard. All three graduate last year and go to work for Bloomberg LP in the SAME department. Now, after a year of working at Bloomberg, which kid gets the promotion and the top job?
Answer: The kid from UMich got the promotion because she was more personable, friendly and clients liked dealing with her better. So, in the end, I think it matters LESS where you graduate from — especially if the choices are Harvard and Brown — and MORE about your people skills and what your life experience (as a 22 year old) brings to a job.
Bottom line, pick the school where your gut tells you to go!
I think the biggest difference between the schools isn’t academic, but residential. The House system is a huge plus for me. Living with faculty members and your dean, and a smaller community across classes, adds a lot to the intimacy of the experience.
My d just graduated from Brown, and my S is a current student at Harvard, so I’ve been able to compare them fairly closely. Both are great schools - and both kids love their schools and find them to be a good fit. Brown is smaller, “cozier,” and definitely more undergraduate focused than Harvard. It’s easier to get to know professors, and even the students seem to be more collegial. The Harvard campus is much larger and more hectic, professors are a bit harder to get to know, and everyone seems to be pulled in several different directions at once. There is a lot of “energy” at Harvard that you’re not going to find at Brown. The sheer number of opportunities at Harvard is second to none - famous scholars giving intimate talks, internships, research, etc. Brown has similar opportunities, but far fewer in number. Everyday life at both seems similar - students are very focused on academics, but spend a lot of time on other pursuits, so no one has much free time.
The difference in the residential houses at Harvard versus dorms at Brown isn’t a big issue for my kids…while the residential houses are great, the dorms at Brown are very well-located and the center of a lot of activity (no far away dorms like the quad at Harvard). Most of my son’s friends are not in his house, so it’s not really a center of social activity for him. I think that is the case for other students as well. Blocking is much the same at Brown as at Harvard, and many students stay in the same dorm after freshman year (freshman dorms are separate). Either school is great - you should visit both and make your decision.
Thanks for the insight Gourmetmom, I’ll definitely keep that in mind when I visit. I’m glad your kids love the schools they’re attending. There are definitely aspects that I like from one school over the other. Hopefully when I visit I’ll have a clearer idea of which school is a better fit for me.
Yukicha - reading your first post again, I wonder if you may find that Brown is a better fit. While both are diverse and inclusive, I think Brown has the edge there - it is less preprofessional and more collegial than Harvard, and truly an environment that welcomes everyone. For this reason, I also think it would be an easier environment to acclimate for someone who identifies as an introvert.
Full disclosure, I live near Brown and am very familiar with the campus culture and surrounding area.
@gibby Having worked in the business sector, I completely agree with you. College is NOT the most important aspect. Social skills are. You can have a 4.0 from Harvard, and without personal skills and a strong work ethic it does not matter. But what I think some members of CC, and people who regularly bash prestigious colleges (like NYtimes columnist Frank Bruni, fail to realize how important going to a great undergraduate school is. Of course, there are billionaires who dropped out of college or never went to college. Does this mean college is not important? Should we therefore encourage kids not to go to college at all? You can succeed and do anything with your life – regardless of where you go to college. But it is a flat out lie to say that going to U Mich gives you the same advantages of going to Harvard.
Secondly, Harvard and Brown are on totally different tiers of academic excellence and reputation. In the business world, Brown is looked at as “the joke ivy.” There are prominent people from Brown, as all the rich kids who lack grades buy themselves an admissions slot. In fact, Brown is the only Ivy to admit having “Development Slots” – essentially admission slots where people can buy their way in.
@yukicha As a science major, Brown is a totally wrong fit for you. It is a very artsy school, and attracts a hipster crowd. If you want to engage in scientific research, what matter place than Boston – the medical, technological and innovative hub of the world?
In demeaning and stereotyping another university, @jong945, unfortunately, reinforces an ugly, outdated Harvard stereotype. I hope that doesn’t dissuade the OP from considering either school.
@arwarw Demeaning and stereotyping? Thats just the impression that I get from Brown, and what the vast majority of the business world believes. Look, if you want to go to Yale, Princeton, Stanford, Duke, U Chicago, Amherst over Harvard… I understand. These are schools in similar tiers. Brown, simply put, is not.
People love to say rankings aren’t everything, and they most certainty are not. But one each and every ranking of academic quality and reputation puts Harvard ahead of Brown, that says something.
One positive aspect of Brown is their use of the pass fail system. One can pick up a a hard major, say engineering, applied maths etc. and pass fail any course that troubles you.
One issue with labeling another college as a “joke school” is that a good number of Harvard professors and administrators earned their undergraduate degrees elsewhere, including some at Brown University. And many don’t take kindly to calling their alma mater a joke. For example, it’s well known that these illustrious Harvard faulty are the products of some “lesser” universities:
Drew Faust, Harvard College President, graduated from Bryn Mawr (not even an ivy!)
Rakesh Khurana, Harvard College Dean, graduated from Cornell (gasp!)
Michael Sandel, Harvard Professor, graduated from Brandeis (cough . . . wow, another non-ivy!)
Henry Louis Gates, Jr., Harvard Professor, graduated from Yale (horrors!)
It serves no purpose on College Confidential to demean another university or another person’s choice. Student’s who have been admitted to Harvard and another college should attend the invited weekends to get a feel for each school and pick the one that seems to be the best fit.
I think of Brown as the college equivalent of a Montessori school. Freedom to design your own curriculum and not be burdened by a GPA. Using “joke” to describe it is kind of harsh, it actually sounds like a fun way to spend 4 years.
Born and raised on the west coast. I think silicon valley might edge Boston out on innovation, but not medicine/scientific research. I also agree with a lot of what Brown does. I like the laid back, open curriculum idea where people can explore what they want. I never expressed that I think Brown is a “joke ivy,” but I said the outside world does. Google “safety schools in the ivy league”, “joke schools” in the ivy league, and there are multiple threads on this very website alluding to Brown not being considered prestigious.
Now, there are more things to life than prestige. I absolutely agree with that. But, sitting here and pretending that Brown is as good as Harvard is lying to yourself and lying to this perspective student.
@gibby Highly misleading. You cannot just say X, Y and Z went to a school and thus the school is good. There are tons of multi-millionaires who are more successful than everyone on this page combined, does that mean we should encourage kids to drop out?
Also, I don’t know all the people on your list, but Drew Faust has two other degrees from U Penn and Sandel went to Oxford as a Rhodes Scholar.
“Just please don’t put down either school.” – I wrote this in the first post, and I wished people wouldn’t resort to attacking Brown as a school. I’ve had enough of that with my peers putting down Brown simply because it is not as well-known as Harvard. As for those who DO know Brown, they (usually teachers) do realize that I seem well-matched for Brown personality-wise.
As for Brown being in an artsy environment, I consider myself sort of an artist. I even applied to the Brown-RISD program (although, I didn’t get in. However, I felt uncomfortable about the fact that ppl in that program take all art classes their first year as part of the Freshman foundation)
(As for art, it was also my optional supplement for Harvard :v)
The Harvard stereotype that @arwarw is referencing is one of the hardest things I have to overcome in order to feel comfortable about being at Harvard. Even in the admit Facebook page for Harvard, I see others sort of putting down Yale… which I don’t get. We all know both are great schools and it’s no use trying to say your school is better.
There are definitely qualities that Brown has that Harvard should take note of, such as its dedication to teaching undergraduates and its more laid back & inclusive student body (no offense). Still, that being said, I am finding myself leaning to Harvard because of other reasons. Still, I wish that I can console the stereotypes & these 2 reasons since they’re issues for me. I fly out Monday night, so maybe I’ll get a better picture of both schools.
^^ There’s an old stereotype that comes to mind when reading several posts on this thread: You can always tell a Harvard man, but you can’t tell him much! Unfortunately, there’s a bit of truth in that expression.
Enjoy your invited weekends, and pick the school where your gut tells you to go!
All I know about Brown and STEM is that one of my kids’ friends recently graduated from Brown and is now in Harvard’s neuroscience PhD program. Apparently Harvard doesn’t consider a Brown undergrad degree to be a “joke”.