Car Troubles

Parent Cafe
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<p>are there any mechanics on the forum? or maybe somebody else has had this problem and can advise me. I know next to nothing about cars, but I do know when they aren’t working right and mine definitely isn’t working right. </p>

<p>I’ll try to keep this as brief as possible, however there are multiple steps to my story so I don’t know how brief I can keep it.</p>

<p>On Thursday I noticed that, when going between 20-40 my car occasionally made a vibrating noise for like two or three seconds. I had my dad drive it Thursday night and he said didn’t know exactly where it was coming from but he also said the car was shifting fine and didn’t think it was transmission related and said maybe it was just something loose with the exhaust since it only did it occasionally. </p>

<p>I didn’t notice anything on Friday, and on Saturday I went to the beach in NJ and had no problems either (except that my front headlight went out… sigh). I drove home today, my dad helped me replace my headlight (we had to take the battery out to get to it, but the battery is back in and the light works fine). I then left to drive to my boyfriends house.</p>

<p>Here’s where the story gets better. As I was driving to his house I would say about 3/4ths of the times my car went to shift from 2nd gear to 3rd gear, it hesitated. It was like I was going in 2nd, and pushing on the gas and it wasn’t shifting. The noise it made was similar to if you were pushing on the gas in neutral and revving your engine. It would do it for like three seconds or so and then shift into 3rd and everything would be okay… until it was time to downshift from 3rd to 2nd and then it made a weird noise like a klunking sound. I’m assuming this probably has something to do with the vibrating I was hearing on Thursday, as 2nd to 3rd is between that 20-40 mph range. </p>

<p>I talked to my boyfriends brother about it (he’s into cars) and he said it sounds like a transmission problem (which is what I thought too) and that I should probably get somebody who knows about transmissions to look at it because he’s not a transmission guy. </p>

<p>So then I was driving home, through the rain, and it was doing the same thing. I got about 2/3rd the way home and i was stopped at a stop sign and waiting for the other cars to pass so I could make a left and while I was waiting there my car stalled. (I didn’t even know it stalled, my car is so quiet you don’t even hear it when it’s on… so imagine my suprise when I went to pull out and nothing happened.) At that point I’m about to cry because first its a vibration then my headlight goes then my transmission is hesitating then my cars stalling… I can’t wait to see what happens next.</p>

<p>Anyway, i restarted my car and made my left turn and drove home and what do you know, my car acted perfectly fine the entire rest of the way… not one vibrating, hesitation, or klunking noise anywhere. </p>

<p>I talked to my mom when I got home and she said maybe it just needs transmission fluid, or maybe it needs a tune up and new spark plugs, or maybe something really is broken with the transmission. She’s going to have my dad look at it tomorrow and we’ll see what happens from there. In the mean time, I’m stuck either driving my moms car or my sisters car until mine is fixed.</p>

<p>Has anyone else had any problems like this or have any suggestions?</p>

<p>My car is a 2002 Mitsubishi Mirage and I just hit 60k miles on it if that makes any type of difference. Also, it’s automatic.</p>

<p>Any help would be greatly appreciated.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

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<p>Definitely sounds like transmission trouble. I’d take it in for repair before the transmission goes out entirely at some inopportune moment.</p>

3

<p>fendergirl: About 10 years ago I had a similar experience (except for the headlight). I had just had the car tuned up, so I was quite perplexed when the car stalled at a stop light and simply wouldn’t start up and stay on. The AAA tow truck driver took me to the nearest Pep Boys (it was the day before Thanksgiving). It turned out that one of the spark plug wires had come loose, so the car wasn’t “firing” on all cylinders. It was an easy fix, and cost less than $20, but it sure did have me worried.</p>

<p>I hope yours is as simple as mine turned out to be.</p>

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<p>Do you let your fuel get low?
has your PCV valve been changed?
YOu may have a clogged fuel pump.

this was for a similar sounding problem with an Eclipse</p>

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<p>I would bet on the “computer” which controls the transmission. If you have this problem again, turn off the ignition and the computer will reset. It sounds like your problem is frequent and needs repair.</p>

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<p>Your Mitsu Mirage has a timing belt that controls the relationship between the movement of the pistons and the opening and closing of the exhaust valves. Typically the timing belts are changed out at around 60,000 miles. Check your owner’s manual. You’re probably due for this service. Do not put this off. You have an “interference” motor which means that if the belt breaks or slips, you basically ruin your motor (the timing is off which allows the pistons to hit the exhaust valves…which is a very bad thing). </p>

<p>It sounds like your timing belt is slipping which alters the engine timing. This can cause the vibration and the stalling that you experienced. Depending on the position of the timing belt when you stall or restart your car, the hesitation will continue or else it will run perfectly fine. There’s no real way of knowing until it stops and will no longer start…</p>

<p>I think you should have the timing belt changed right away before something happens to your motor. Usually mechanics will advise you to change out your water pump at the same time. Removing the timing belt gives you access to your water pump which is cheap insurance all the way around.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

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<p>any idea how much something like that would cost? (i’m assuming it’s less than the cost of a transmission, which was what i was thinking it would need… so if it’s just a timing belt that sounds great… haha) that sounds exactly like what its doing. I also think i’m going to have all of the spark plugs changed as well, that’s also listed as a 60k service. And I think i need new breaks soon. I’m trying to decide if I want to have this all done now or hold off on the breaks until inspection in october. </p>

<p>this is the first time something has ever gone wrong with my car. it’s so dissapointing. hopefully i can get it fixed and working like normal for another 60k miles or more.</p>

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<p>call in to “Car Talk”. They will solve your problem!! And they seem to enjoy talking to female listeners. Just be ready to make the sounds your car is making. They love to do that.</p>

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<p>The timing belt runs around $20-30 (for the 1.8 L engine) plus the labor to install it. I would budget around $200 depending on the degree of difficulty to get at the timing belt cover which is mounted to the front of your motor. If you look at the front of your (transverse mounted) engine, you’ll see a plastic or metal shroud that covers and protects the timing belt. The water pump should run $30-50. I mention the water pump because the blades are usually made of plastic and fatigue starts to set in after five years. Mechanics will usually recommend you replace the timing belt and water pump at the same time. </p>

<p>While I can’t state specifically that this will solve your problem, I do know that you have an “interference” engine and that the timing belt needs to be changed now (based upon what is stated in your owner’s manual, of course). Some timing belt change schedules can go out to 100,000 miles. Rely on what your manual states.</p>

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<p>I’m going to check when I get home from work. I know my dad changed his at 100,000 miles. My uncle is a mechanic so I may ask him if he can take a look at it for me, otherwise i’ll probably just drop it off at the garage and let them take a look at it. My mom said I might as well get my inspection done at the same time (and my breaks)… that way it will eliminate trips to the garage and swapping of cars later.</p>

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<p>Fendergirl, have you tried Car Talk? <a href=“http://www.cartalk.com/menus/info.html[/url]”>http://www.cartalk.com/menus/info.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>I cannot even begin to guess at how to solve your problem, but, I end up listening to this show on NPR every Saturday morning when running errands - it’s hilarious, and, the two guys seem to know just about everything about every kind of car there is…</p>

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<p>My 2 cents:</p>

<p>I wouldn’t suspect the timing belt. The advice to change it at the specified interval is good but if it slipped the symptoms would be consistent. These are usually fairly expensive to have changed since the mechanic needs to get into the front of the engine (removing many components to get there). I also wouldn’t suspect the computer. This is a big ticket item that rarely goes bad - it’s changed far more frequently than it goes bad (i.e. faulty diagnosis).</p>

<ul>
<li><p>Check your transmission fluid level according to the owners manual. This is usually with the engine at normal temperature and idling in park (don’t forget to use your emergency brake). If the fluid’s low it can slip and hesitate on shifts although it’ll usually show up while on a hill or when first going into drive or reverse.</p></li>
<li><p>Check the ignition wires and plugs. A bad plug, loose plug wire, or a wire whose insulation isn’t holding up (and you can’t always see this visually) can cause roughness at particular RPMs as well as stalling when it’s wet (raining). If it’s been a while since a tune-up or if it’s never been done, just go ahead and replace the plugs and wires remembering to correctly gap the plugs. You can probably do this easily yourself if you want to save money (you, your BF, your Dad, etc.) or have it done somewhere. Plugs and a wire kit are pretty inexpensive if you buy them at your local auto parts store (as opposed to a dealer where you’d get the same thing but for more money). Remember to change the wires as well as the plugs.</p></li>
</ul>

<p>Try the above two first. They’re inexpensive and need to be done anyway.</p>

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<p>USCD: My brother had an old Escort that had a loose plug wire. The car had a rough idle but did run after a fashion. When I pushed down the loose wire, it ran much smoother. Fendergirl’s car has periods when it ran well. A loose wire or bad spark plug would be a problem all the time. And it would be very noticeable. </p>

<p>The same would be true if the transmission is low on fluid. The automatic would shift harshly all the time. </p>

<p>Re: timing belt</p>

<p>Over time, the belt may stretch and slip to either advance or ■■■■■■ the engine’s timing or, if it has lost one or more of its ridges, the timing may become erratic. Still, it should still be changed out.</p>

<p>Something to consider: newer cars no longer have a distributor to govern timing. They now use crank and cam sensors to regulate timing. A flaky sensor can cause stalling and hard starting. </p>

<p>Fendergirl should take the car to a mechanic or to an auto parts store to see if the computer has thrown a trouble code. This will give a mechanic some idea of what may be wrong with the car.</p>

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<p>I called my uncle tonight (whom is a mechanic) and explained to him what exactly was happening. He said he would have to drive it to hear exactly what it’s doing and that he can come see it on Wednesday. I felt really bad calling him because everyone always calls him when they have a problem with something however this was my first ever car related phone call to him after 8 years of driving. It was funny when I called too because I didn’t even mention that and my aunt was like 'its your niece who has never called you for a car problem before, so you better be nice to her" haha.</p>

<p>So I guess we’ll see what he has to say about it on Wednesday.</p>

<p>He did say that I should have my timing belt replaced at 60k as well as my plugs and such. My dad said he can help me with the plugs but not the belt. I know my uncle just replaced my dads timing belt in his Subaru at 100k so maybe he would be willing to help me change that, but we’ll have to see what he says about these problems. It will be nice not to pay labor costs however I would probably get him a gift certificate to go out to eat or something like that as a thank you gift. That’s what my mom and dad and sister usually do.</p>

<p>My dad has some kind of thing that you plug into the car when your check engine light is on and it gives you some kind of code and then you look up that code and it tells you what kind of error it is, however my check engine light isn’t on so that isn’t of any assistance… I’m assuming that’s what you mean by a trouble code.</p>

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<p>michuncle:</p>

<p>

Unfortunately this isn’t true. It depends on the exact failure. If it’s a plug or wire issue the symptoms can easily be affected by environmentals such as humidity (with rain having a pronounced effect), adjacency of the wire to a metal surface (which can vary with the vibrations of an engine), adjacency to other plug wires (cross-induction), heat, etc. It’s also affected by the RPM of the engine since this affects the current flow through the wires and the plugs.</p>

<p>I’ve seen plug wires cause problems only at high RPM, only at low RPM, only when it rains or is foggy, etc.</p>

<p>I was trying to give fendergirl the low cost and more likely problems first. The timing belt is a possibility but it’s less likely and it’s costly to have changed. Of course, it can be even more costly to not change it at the recommended intervals since a slipped or broken timing belt can cause the car to no longer run, or worse, for some vehicles it can cause the piston to hit the valves which results in a very expensive engine repair.</p>

<p>fendergirl: Be sure to give us feedback when the problem gets fixed. A batch of chocolate chip cookies for your uncle will go a long way and make you feel less guilty.</p>

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<p>Just a comment re timing belt costs:
I don’t know about Mitsubishis but I just had a timing belt replaced on a Toyota. This is typically WAY more than $200, primarily because of the labor involved. The Toyota was due for that service at 90k miles. We have a Honda that needs one at 105k miles. Seems like 60k miles is really early in the life of the car to require that maintenance…</p>

<p>I go to a neighborhood mechanic recommended by many (including Car Talk!)
and know their prices are fair, and they also recommended replacing the water pump at the same time, just as michuncle said.</p>

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<p>well I also have a tiny little 92 HP engine so that may have something to do with the timing belt at 60k. I always get picked on for my cars lack of power, but I absolutely love it. :slight_smile: Either that or they want to make sure you keep good care of your car to help avoid problems later down the road. I always do my own maintence so this will be the first time ‘outsourcing it’ to sometone else. I’ll probably have my uncle help me with the timing belt if he has a chance… that will be better than taking it somewhere… And my dad said he will help me with the wires and plugs… so hopefully those things help my problems. I also think i saw somewhere in the maintence manual about the fuel filter, so this may be a good time to replace that as well. I just recently replaced my air filter. My car is really easy to work in and everything is very easily accessible so hopefully these things won’t be too much trouble.</p>

<p>If it’s something that has to go into the garage for I’ll take it to my local area mechanic where I have always gone for my past inspections and such. He is nice, fair, and charges a lot less than the bigger places around here (such as the place that my uncle works at). If it has to go in I’ll have him replace my breaks and inspect it at the same time.</p>

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<p>

This hasn’t been my experience (as recently as yesterday). It’ll usually cause a problem initially shifting into gear from neutral and will likely be affected by whether the car is level or not. Once pump pressure has been built then the problem may go away until next start. This can be intermittent and affected by ambient temperature. The symptoms may depend on the particular transmission however. Most of my experience in this area has been on older American cars.</p>

<p>I agree with checking the trouble codes as this might point to a problem with a particular cylinder including ignition problems. Many auto parts stores will do the check for free. I purchased my own reader for around $60 but I do a lot of work myself.</p>

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<p>is the trouble codes reader the thing that my dad has? it gives you some kind of code and then that helps you pinpoint the problem. I think he said his only works when the check engine light is on?</p>

<p>My thing is that it shifts out of neutral and into first and into second with no problem. It just lags at going into third. It then goes into fourth fine as well. And the same way when you are shifting down as well.</p>

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<p>All and all there has been some pretty good advice here, and any one of these may or not be indicative or causative. </p>

<p>A plug in diagnostic test would get you a reading and eliminate poor ignition, loose wires, bad spark plugs. The problems associated with these issues are not normally indicative of high rpm or revving before shifting. </p>

<p>It could be as simple as low tranny fluid. Definately worth checking first. If it is low, it is leaking somewhere. Depending on the leak and how much fluid is lost, it may be worth fixing the problem or reliably checking and topping off fluid periodically.</p>

<p>It could be a bad (computer) sensor, causing the delay (revving) before the tranny shifts.</p>

<p>It could be an internal transmission problem beginning to develop. Expensive, figure $1800-2000 to rebuild. </p>

<p>It could be as simple as a loose or broken motor mount.</p>

<p>The timing belt change is manufacturer specific and while there is a fudge factor built into the recommended mileage, it is important to stay within manufacturer’s specs particularly with an interference type engine. Belt failure will result in varying degrees of internal engine damage and destruction depending upon speed and rpm at the time of belt failure. </p>

<p>Timing belts as opposed to earlier timing chains normally do not give apparent signs of wear without visual inspection, and at that point a portion of the labor necessary has already been done to allow the inspection… go ahead and change it if you go that route. </p>

<p>On a timing chain, a good mechanic can often diagnose wear and “slop” with a trained ear and a mechanic’s stethascope.</p>

<p>If you’ve got a reliable trained mechanic in a relative, I’d go that route unless you know a good diagnostician that you’ve used and trusted previously.</p>

<p>Advances in engine and electronic technologies and proper equipment for diagnostics put most of us former shade tree mechanics out of the picture. Problems get solved by pure luck based on older knowledge base, or a sequential replacement of suspect components.</p>

<p>Shifting poorly into one particular gear is normally a sign of an internal transmission issue.</p>