Chance me for Psych PhD. Programs or English/Writing Concentration Programs

Graduate School
1

Applying to Psychology(Clinical/Cognitive) or English Writing Concentration Graduate School

UC-Berkeley 2nd Best Psych Program in Nation
UCLA 3rd Best Psych Program in Nation
UCSD
UCSB
SDSU (Safety)
University of San Francisco
NYU
University of Colorado Boulder
University of Texas Austin
University of San Diego
USC
UC-Colorado Springs (Safety)

Undergraduate G.P.A. 3.62 (4.0 for the past two years)
GRE Scores: V: 164 (94th) Q: 168 (95th)=332(97th or 98th based on extrapolations) Analytical Writing: 6 (99th)
overall GRE score is probably in the 99th percentile if you include the Analytical Writing (based on converting GRE percentiles to SAT scores and then adding each section up on the 800 scale and relying on the SAT Composite Percentile data)
SAT Writing: 800 (99.5%ile) ACT English 36 (99.7%ile)
SAT Composite: 2280 (99.5%ile)
I am banking on the fact that it is extremely rare to get a perfect score on all Writing/English standardized test sections
I have stellar recommendations and I will participate in research this semester but I won’t have as much research experience as some of my peers
My writing samples are excellent
Only flaw is that my Resume is weak with no prior work experience (because I was bankrolled by my parents)

Although I was not initially impressed by my GRE scores I found comfort in the fact that
UC-Berkeley Psychology (2nd best in nation) Average GRE scores admitted students: V:161(87th) Q: 159(74th)
MIT Engineering average GRE scores of admitted students V: 160 (84th) Q: 165 (90th)
Harvard Engineering average GRE scores V: 162(92nd) Q: 164 (88th)
USC Engineering average GRE scores: V:154 (63rd) Q: 165 (90th)
Yale Engineering average GRE scores: V:158(78th) Q:165 (90th)
NYU Education average GRE scores: V: 155 (67th) Q: 154 (56th)

Based on the fact that the second best Psych program in the nation has GRE scores well below mine I assume that other schools not ranked in the top 10 would have average GRE scores in the 150s for both sections

I am well above the average GRE scores at Berkeley for admitted psychology students I am about 75th percentile for Verbal GRE and above the (25th-75th) range for Quantitative by a considerable degree
I have not taken the GRE Psychology Test yet (as required by UCLA) but on the practice test I scored in the 93rd percentile

Will these graduate schools take into consideration the rare feat of perfect scores on all English/Writing sections of the three major college admissions tests or will they only consider the GRE? Will a 168 Q help me for admission to Psych programs or will it be rendered irrelevant because math is not needed as much for psychology programs?

Although I majored in Psychology for Undergrad I am wondering if I should apply to Writing Graduate schools considering the trifecta of perfect scores on all English/Writing assessments. Would that help my chances?

I will chance you back!

2

A couple of connected thoughts. Psychology is my field.

First, to answer your question, we can’t give you “chances” for doctoral program admissions. There are a lot of factors involved - many of them have to do with who your competition is in the year you apply. Another really important factor is your research fit with the programs you’re applying to, and you didn’t provide your research interests (not that that would help - I’m familiar with some, but not all, of the departments on your list). But if you are a rising senior as I suspect, I’d say that your chances are not good for either of the programs you’re planning to apply to, but for different reasons.

For psychology, the reason is lack of research. The GRE doesn’t matter nearly as much as you think - there’s a certain threshold to pass, around the mid-150s for competitive programs. Once you pass it, the higher you score it doesn’t matter. It certainly doesn’t matter what you scored on the ACT or SAT 3-4 years ago. It’s weird that you aren’t impressed by GRE scores in the 94th+ percentile. You did very well, and your GRE scores won’t keep you out - great. But the rest of your package is far more important.

You’ve got most of the other pieces - good grades, good letters, and good writing sample - but the most important piece for psychology is research experience. If you are a rising senior and you’re just starting in the fall, you won’t have any when you’re applying to programs. And that makes you a weak candidate, especially for clinical programs, where students often take 2-3 years off after college to get more research experience. Particularly at those top programs like UCLA and Berkeley, CU-Boulder, UCSB, UCSD, UT-Austin, NYU, USC, your chances of getting admitted with no research experience are very slim. I’m also not sure why you’d think SDSU/UCSF is a safety - it’s a top 5-30 clinical psychology program. (Depends on the source - NRC ranks them in the top 5-10; US News ranks them in the top 30.)

Check this out: http://www.clinicalpsychgradschool.org/apply.php. Note that most successful applicants have some kind of supervised research experience. (The entire page is very informative about admission to clinical psych programs!)

The same is true of any cognitive psychology program too.

I also have the sneaking suspicion - although I might be wrong! - that your list is geographically based instead of based on the research interests in the department. Only three of the programs you listed are not in California, and only two (NYU and UT-Austin) aren’t on the West Coast. PhD programs in any field must be selected on the basis of your fit with the department, not where the program is located - that’s a secondary concern. Your best-fit department might be located in the Bay Area or Los Angeles, but it also might be located in Urbana-Champaign, IL or Ann Arbor, MI or State College, PA. (And it’s fine to decide that you won’t go to a rural area for a doctoral program, but know that you are limiting yourself upfront.)

I’m assuming the last couple programs on your list are for writing because they don’t offer PhDs in psychology.

It also doesn’t sound like you have clinical experience (like volunteering for a hospital, clinic, with a mental health professional, etc.) and that’s also key to clinical psych programs, particularly scientist-practitioner programs that emphasize preparing people who will counsel/provide services and mostly consume research. ([Clinical science programs](http://www.pcsas.org/accredited-programs.php) that focus mostly on research, like UCLA and Berkeley, will care less about that.)

For English/writing programs, the fact that you got a 6 on analytical writing will matter very little to them - the writing that achieves that score on the GRE is not anything like the writing you do in an English program. What will matter to them is that you don’t have an undergraduate foundation in the field. Graduate education builds on undergraduate education. You absolutely won’t get into any English literature programs. I also find it hard to believe that you will be competitive for any great programs in writing, unless your writing sample is truly exceptional. (Also, what are you planning to do with it? It seems weird to think about getting an MFA in writing simply because you got a 6 on the exam; that’s a professional degree that’s designed to basically be a two to three year residency to hone a craft so you can work in that field professionally. Do you want to be a professional writer?)

What are your career goals? What do you want to do with your PhD in psychology or your MFA in writing?

3

I guess I am a weaker candidate than I once thought…I really wish now I read about how everyone had so much research experience before the last semester of my undergraduate career. I said USF not UCSF…It might not be a safety as much as a target school…thanks for humbling me! I guess I will apply to more low key programs to ensure I get in somewhere

4

My career goals are to be a private practice therapist that writes books on the side (nonfiction/fiction and poetry)…based on your advice I might delay applying to graduate school until I have more research experience…I really regret now not doing enough research…but I guess I am destined for bottom-feeder schools so I might not even apply to Berkeley and UCLA…You are right it is primarily geography…I want to be a therapist in California and I think you have to graduate from a California school to get licensed…But yeah…thanks for humbling me now before it is too late

5

Yeah, I know you said USF :slight_smile: The clinical psychology program at SDSU is actually a joint PhD program with UCSD (I accidentally wrote UCSF, but I meant UCSD.) That’s what I meant when I made reference to UCSF - mistake on my part!

Don’t give up! It’s quite common for people to not decide what they want to do until their junior or senior year. Many of them delay graduate school for 2-3 years. It doesn’t mean that you are destined for lower-ranked schools; it just means you gotta take some time out to prepare. My last four lab managers at my graduate program have all gotten into great clinical programs - the first one went to UNC-Chapel Hill after 2 years in the lab; the second one to Columbia after 2 years; the third one is going to NYU after 3 years; and a research coordinator in my other lab worked there for 2 years and I believe she is going to Duke.

You don’t have to graduate from a California school to be a licensed therapist in California. It just has to be an accredited school in the U.S. or Canada, and meet certain other provisions.

However, if you want to be a therapist, there are other options. Counseling psychology PhD programs are a little less competitive than clinical psychology programs, although they will still want to see some research experience, and they will still allow you to get licensed to practice. On the master’s level, you could do a master’s in social work and get licensed as a clinical social worker (LCSW), or you can get a master’s in mental health counseling. Here are examples of mental health programs that lead to licensure: [url=<a href=“https://www.sandiego.edu/soles/academics/ma-counseling-clinical-mental-health/%5DUSD%5B/url”>https://www.sandiego.edu/soles/academics/ma-counseling-clinical-mental-health/]USD[/url] and [url=<a href=“http://counseling.sfsu.edu/rehabilitationcounseling%5DSFSU%5B/url”>http://counseling.sfsu.edu/rehabilitationcounseling]SFSU[/url]. There’s also marriage and family therapy (MFT) programs that will license you to be a therapist. [url=<a href=“http://counseling.sfsu.edu/content/master-science-marriage-family-child-counseling-mft%5DSFSU%5B/url”>http://counseling.sfsu.edu/content/master-science-marriage-family-child-counseling-mft]SFSU[/url] also has one.

Honestly, if being a therapist is your primary goal, you probably don’t want UCLA or Berkeley anyway. Both of them are clinical science programs, which means their primary goal is to train professionals who will go into research careers in psychology. Most of their graduates go onto academic or other research positions, and focus on conducting studies and writing papers to publish in scientific journals. You want to go to a program with a scientist-practitioner model - one that focuses more on turning out a therapist.

Cognitive psychology programs won’t license you to be a therapist, though, so if that’s what you want don’t do that.

If you want to write books on the side but you want therapy to be your primary job, you don’t need an MFA. You can go to writer’s workshops and take classes as a non-degree student in your spare time. But really, you just need to write.

6

I do not know about psychology specifically, but as @juillet mentioned above research fit and experience are key. GRE scores won’t get you in, but they will keep you out. Research experience is also extremely important for admission to graduate school. Research experience can help temper the sting of a sub-par GPA or GRE scores, but high GPA/GRE scores won’t compensate for lack of research.