Chance Me/Match Me: Rising senior in the Mid-Atlantic, 4.0 GPA/1580 SAT but lacks focus/spike [PA resident, also 36 ACT]

Thank you for the detailed info! I’ll think about all of the above for sure. And yeah I’ve heard a lot about how Schreyers is a bit of a black box when it comes to admits. Just conjecture on my part, but I’m speculating they won’t take many from my school during my cycle because nearly everyone who got admitted denied their Schreyers offer from the last cycle (it was a lot, at least 5 kids). And I think they admitted that many because nearly everyone who got in the cycle before that accepted. But who knows, really.

Why Temple rather than Pitt?

Good question haha. Probably because I forgot about Pitt :sweat_smile: Thanks for the reminder!
And I will definitely be considering WPI and Northeastern (now Olin too), I’ve heard good things about both.

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Don’t worry, that’s not how it works. They need 15-30 scholars per college but extend offers to many more - they have a rough idea of how many will turn them down because many applicants admitted to Schreyer were aiming for Ivy+ universities and either didn’t get in or couldn’t afford to go, but obviously SOME get in and definite numbers are expected to go elsewhere (yield management). Professors read the essays and wonder, do I want that student among the 20-24 kids in my seminar next year? If everyone concurs (and grades/rigor are decent obviously), you’re in. Then they mix things a bit but whether 5 students accepted or didn’t accept last year wouldn’t impact your own acceptance.

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Good to know, thank you!

It’s just really hard to meet their expectations for the essays :wink: but do your best: each student’s style, intellectual curiosity, knowledge, etc, can shine through and has a shot.

Even without NMF, you can get a presidential elite scholarship at Alabama which full tuition, one year of housing, and $6k in stipends

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So to me, it feels like you are the sort of student who would benefit from a college where exploration and the ability to combine diverse interests is actually one of their real strengths. Having engineering as an option might be a good idea, but it would also be good if you could easily pivot into other areas as you see how it goes, and still be happy with your college choice. Finally, your family can afford to be full pay, but you would not mind if merit was available.

If that sounds right, I do have some suggestions for you to consider.

I would not actually recommend indiscriminately applying to all the Ivies or such. I do think Brown is a particularly good choice, though, given the description above, thanks to their open curriculum. The big downside is no merit.

Another good Reach choice would be WashU, which I did not see on your list. WashU has a lovely, well-defined campus in a great location in a fun, affordable city, and they do have a little merit although it is extremely competitive. But the main reason I am recommending it is they have a very flexible curriculum structure which makes it easy to explore, and lots of kids end up with second majors, minors, and so on.

OK, then a less Reachy option like this with a much more robust merit program would be Rochester. Rochester actually has perhaps my favorite curriculum structure anywhere (although WashU is pretty close, just a little more complicated than I think necessary). I won’t try to explain all the details here, but it combines being very flexible with encouraging exploration with some thematic depth, and that again often turns into minors or second majors. Rochester is an interesting city and the nearby outdoor recreation areas are very nice, and the University of Rochester’s main campus is compact and contained on three sides by a river, and on the fourth mostly by a large cemetery, but there is a robust shuttle system to take you around (including to their performing arts campus downtown). In my circles, kids who like Brown and/or WashU very often also apply to Rochester as one of their Target schools.

Then many kids who consider Rochester also consider Case Western. A little more traditional in terms of curriculum structure, but still easy to explore different majors before deciding, and it has a great location in another fun, affordable city (Cleveland in this case). Case does have a reputation for wanting some serious demonstrated interest, but that is worth doing if it looks promising! And then they have a pretty robust merit program, such that kids with good numbers who do the work to demonstrate interest often get at least solid offers.

Then this was already raised, but I do think Pitt would be a strong contender for a Likely for you, and indeed you could apply rolling and get an early answer. It is getting harder to get merit in-state, but you might get some, and possibly Honors as well, and of course being in-state already makes it much less expensive than full pay private or many OOS full pay. Anyway, Pitt is smaller than Penn State, and arguably is maybe a bit better for exploratory kids. It has a great location right in the middle of Pittsburgh, which is a very fun city for students. My only hesitation is its campus blends into the surrounding urban fabric somewhat, but if possible you could visit and see what you think.

A last possible suggestion to check out would be Lafayette. which is one of the relatively rare smaller colleges to have a robust engineering program without being as tech-focused as, say, Harvey Mudd. They have some merit as well. I’d again suggest visiting if you can, as LACs are all basically fit schools (meaning some kids will love them, others maybe think it is not for them). But depending on where you are in PA, it may not be very hard to visit, and then if you liked the concept we could recommend more along those lines to consider (although not a lot more, since again it is not a very common form of school).

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Since you have a variety of interests, I would suggest you do a couple of things:

  1. Look for colleges with a string core course requirement. This will expose you to things across multiple disciplines. You might just find something that piques your interest!
  2. Look for colleges where you don’t need to declare your major until start of sophomore year…even for engineering, these do exist.

And remember, many many many college students switch majors multiple times in college…and that’s OK.

I would agree that if engineering is a strong interest that you take the same course sequence as freshman engineering majors even IF you aren’t a declared major. And make sure that you can declare engineering after you apply for admissions.

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The issue is that if you want to explore many subjects, Engineering isn’t conducive to that. That’s why I’m trying to map out a pathway that allows you to switch INTO Engineering (something you can do at PSU, especially from DUS).

From a PSU standpoint, in order to maximize odds of switching to Engineering from a broader major, you should take AP Macro OR AP Micro Economics.

If during your first year you only take Engineering Design 101 and Honors 137-138 (or English 30H-CAS100) plus Math230, then add classes matching your eclectic personal interests, assuming you got a 5 on Calc BC Micro or Macro, and Physics C M+E&M, then decide you don’t want to major in Applied Math/Computational Math/Data Science with Engineering Design certificate, you would have 2 courses suggested for Spring Sophomore year but would be missing Comp Sci 121 or 131 (and Econ 102 or 104 if you didn’t get 4-5 on AP Micro or Macro). Switching at the end of a non engineering Fall sophomore year would be more difficult.

If Engineering is not under consideration and you’d stick to applied math, CS, DS.., then open curriculum colleges such as Grinnell and Amherst would work and let you explore freely.

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Why suggest an Applied Math major for someone who doesn’t love math? There are plenty of majors that allows folks to “build things” that are not Applied Math!

You might not want to major in math, statistics, physics, or pre-PhD economics if you do not like math that much. Engineering and CS are also math heavy, with some types of engineering and subareas of CS more than others.

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You can add UCONN as a definite! You’ll absolutely get in. I know students admitted to UCONN but waitlisted at UMass-Amherst. I think you’ll get into many places—I’d apply to at least 15-20 schools for your best chance at getting in somewhere both competitive and affordable. Maybe add Tufts, Northeastern, University of Michigan, Syracuse, and Carnegie Mellon.

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Because OP has indicated interest in many fields where they will use math.
They’re interested in many fields so I tried to find the first year program at PSU that is the most flexible, allowing them to try all of it, without closing off Electrical Engineering. It’s a kind of place holder till they figure it out. DUS (aka “pivot to anything” major *) would make the most sense for this student but it’s useful to cross reference all the majors of interest.
If not DUS, it’d be one of the applied math or data science programs in Eberly (science) or IST with the engineering design certificate (which is for people who want to “build things” but not necessarily have an Engineering degree or work as an Engineer, which seems to fit OP). Eberly Pre Applied Math would be the most flexible.

*. For the sake of thoroughness: anything except Turf science, Golf Management, Nursing, and starting Fall 2026 with restrictions to Smeal college of business - none of which seems to fall under OP’s interests.

I’m guessing OP isn’t going to end up at Penn State. That’s not to say they shouldn’t as it’s an outstanding university, regardless of Honors.

Georgia Tech might be a nice fit for this student given the ability to change major freely before 60 credits.

This student’s list and parental willingness to pay screams “rank”.

I do think OP will be better off starting in STEM - even if it seems they don’t like - because even his other poissibilities (Econ, DS, Cyber) will be to that bent.

But he also loves humanities and if he decides to be an English or literature major, etc. he can do that easily later.

But the parents might also be pushing the career thing in regards to ability to pay - so those non STEM majors might not be allowed. I don’t know - something for OP to think about.

Ideally - a Brown/Rochster type open curriculum should maybe be on the list…even if it takes longer than 4 years - so OP has more flexibility up front. Or perhaps a Lafayette or even a Wake Forest - that can provide a bit more flexibility curriculum wise.

Just thinking out loud…

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You’re a strong applicant. If you took AP Calc BC as a sophomore, you’ll be fine in engineering. You don’t have to love math, you just have to be good at it - it’s a tool. I never “loved” math or found it fascinated. It was just easy and straightforward, and I had zero issue in engineering. I also disagree that you can’t explore other interests. I have a minor in economics with an engineering degree, and it was far from unusual.

You might check if any of the big FRC scholarship schools are of interest - especially as a Dean’s list semifinalist. University of Rochester had a very generous FRC scholarship 4-5 years ago, not sure if they still offer it. It also has a lot of the flexibility you seem to be looking for - so I’d definitely recommend looking into it. Our FRC kids have had great luck at Georgia Tech - not sure if that’s universal or they just like our team, but we’ve had extremely good results there. CMU is another that takes more than their low percentage acceptance rate would indicate - but definitely check if it’s a good fit. We’ve had mixed feedback from students with the lack of a collaborative environment being the biggest negative.

I do think narrowing down what you’re really looking for will be helpful - your list is a bit of a dartboard right now.

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Exactly - my son has a minor but was one class from a second and could have done a double, which is GF did in English - plus a 5th year Engineering Masters.

And this was at a big state school.

Yes, I think OP will land at one of their preferred choices. But if push comes to shove, Penn State Schreyer is an excellent place to be for an ambitious STEM-ish student from PA :grinning_face:. The only difficulty would be negociating how to get a taste of all the subjects without blocking any path (hence the info I provided after cross referencing the different majors in the 25-26 bulletin).

Without Schreyer, Pitt+Fredericks (Honors) is another excellent safety. Fredericks is more SAT sensitive so a guarantee for OP.

They can add one more safety then every other acceptance will be cherry on the :birthday_cake: :blush:
I agree open curriculum (fully or nearly) colleges like Brown, Lafayette, U Rochester…would all be perfect and OP is likely to have choices at the end of the year.

PSU Engineering has very very few open slots - one gen Ed per semester, most of them prescribed (ie., your social science has to be Macro or Micro Econ, your lnterdomain science/social science is likely to deal with Climate change or Health, English has 2 prescribed courses…)

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Thank you for the detailed advice (and I apologize for taking so long to reply). Your picture of me is spot on, and I will for sure take into account your suggestions!

I have actually heard a good amount about Case, except mostly about how good their pre-med program is, so I will have to look into their other programs. In terms of Pitt as a likely/safety for me- one important thing I forgot to add is that my tuition to Penn State would be massively discounted because of parent employment, so all other safeties will be low priority for me in applications. I will certainly send some in but I figure it’s best for me to put significant effort in Schreyers essays first before Pitt honors essays.

Given my info on LACs so far, I probably won’t look too much further into options besides the ones already suggested. They seem like great schools, but also are places too far for me to visit (and seem like they require visits to really ascertain if it suits me). Thank you though!!

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Good point :sweat_smile: I’ll keep that in mind when applying to programs (probably won’t go for pure math or physics… the latter was kind of brutal my junior year). But I did really enjoy stat, so I will try to feel it out!

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I do think narrowing down what you’re really looking for will be helpful - your list is a bit of a dartboard right now.

For sure–that was actually my main goal coming here (and everyone has been really helpful so thank you all again!!) And thanks for the tip about CMU because a bad atmosphere for collaboration is definitely something I’d consider.

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Statistics as a major likely means a lot of heavily mathematical statistics with theory and proofs.

But many colleges are adding data science majors which are kind of like applied statistics with some computing and an area of application, although some courses in calculus based probability and statistics will be included.