<p>Catholic HS in NY (upstate)
All boys academy
There was a test to get in, and we’re the top of the bunch.
Currently a junior</p>
<p>GPA-91
PSAT Selection index is 217 (680 math, 720 writing, 770 critical reading)which will most likely be National Merit Commended
As my school is liberal arts, I am taking the most advance courses, however, I am the only one advanced 2 years in math.
honor roll all 4 years</p>
<p>My ec’s are:
3 years of math club, mathletes
2 years of volunteer corp
3 years of social studies club
2 years of string ensemble, and 7 years of playing the cello
recently elected president of catholic civil rights organization chapter of my school
vice president of math club, will be president senior year
national honor society junior and will be senior year
science olympiad junior year and will be senior year
freshmen orientation volunteer sophomore and junior year.
math extra help advisor junior year
economics club junior year
politics club junior year
member of asian coalition</p>
<p>volunteered in mexico for 3 weeks during summer (building a house and teaching english</p>
<p>freshmen science fair 1st place
sophomore science fair Best Biology Project
Morris College science honor award (small private Catholic college)</p>
<p>I would say that you have a really good shot… similar stats to mine but I’m waitlisted. I also did mission work, but to Guatemala and I have ECs that are very similar. You may well be at an advantage because of your location, as we get SO many people that apply from the Chicago-land area (one admissions counselor dedicated specifically to our area… no other counselor has less that 2 states!). But I would say that it is totally worth your effort of applying.</p>
<p>Just a few quick responses.
Remember that the most important thing by far in your admission chances to ND or any other competitive college is your Academic Index, which is essentially a combination of your grades placed in the context of your high school and standardized test scores. Always begin with your AI in thinking about college admissions. The facts you report do not suggest that you have an exceptional AI at this point. An exceptional AI would be the student who is in the top 5 or 10 students (not %) in a large competitive high school and has test report above 1480/2220 or ACT at 33 or higher. This student would have a presumption of acceptance at ND and the admissions officer would look for a reason not to admit. Since your AI at this point would not be exceptional but rather typical of many applicants, the admissions officers would begin with a presumption of doubt about your admission and look for a reason to admit. By far the best such reasons for a student with a modest AI would be if he or she were a member of an underrepresented minority (black, Latino, Native American) or a recruited athlete. If you are not in either of those categories, your chances become slimmer. The admissions officers will look for some sign that you have a passion about some activity or cause and/or that you would bring somethat else exceptional to the campus community.</p>
<p>Parentalexpert, do schools vary in how much weight they place on class rank? I’ve noticed a trend for schools to not rank, and I’m wondering what the implications are for the kids in schools that do still rank. </p>
<p>My next son to be launched is in the top 15% of his class, a 3.8 weighted gpa, not the highest stats, but he will have taken the hardest load possible at his school. We anticipate he will test between 2100-2200 on the SAT. His ECs are solid. Is his class rank the killer for him on admissions?</p>
<p>hmm docmon, your the expert, and now your asking us! i have no idea, but i was outside the top 10% for this year, and people told me that it would probably keep me out of ND, but i applied EA anyways and stlil got in. I guess it depends how good your HS is (i go to a public one in southern california, but i think it’s probably well thought of). Although you probably have to write a good essay, have good test scores, and have a good character to overcome the class rank issue (83% of kids at ND are top 10% i believe).</p>
<p>Hmmm, Andrew, you’re going to have to read a little more carefully I was actually directing my question to parentalexpert, who I believe has actually worked in a university admissions office. But sincerely, thanks for your thoughts, anyway. </p>
<p>One thing you have to remember about that 83% class rank issue is that of the remaining 17% of the class outside the top 10% you probably have recruited athletes and other recruited students for other reasons. This leaves very little room for your average applicant to sit outside the top 10%. </p>
<p>How far out of the top 10% were you? I can’t recall.</p>
<p>Grades are extremely important indicators, but need context for obvious reasons. Making mostly As in core courses at a small rural high school with only 70 people in the senior class and in which few students go on to college is presumed to be different than a student who makes mostly As in core courses in a large, competitive suburban high school with 800 people in the graduating class in in which the large majority go on to college. That’s why admissions officers like class rank coupled with class size because it helps give them a little more context – i.e., using indicators about the high school such as class size, average SAT scores for the high school, % of the high school seniors who go to college and so forth. Being in the top 5% of the class in the latter example above is more meaningful than being in the top 10% in the former example. A really bright student in the rural high school could be expected to be #1 in his or her class and to have high SAT/ACT scores – i.e., to have maxed out the environment. A really bright student in the big high school could get by with only being in the top 5 or 10% if if were clear that he or she was operating in a very competitive environment with lots of other smart students. Without an explicit class rank, admissions officers try to simulate one using all the data they have about the high school – including the guidance counselor forms which usually ask for the applicant to be placed in some type of context against his or her fellow students (i.e., guidance counselors are in essence asked to simulate class rank). </p>
<p>Two points: 1) students sometimes lose sight of the fact that there is absolutely no subsitute for dogged hard work at grades and learning; many people involved in college admissions would probably agree that there is too much emphasis on building up some artificial EC portrait and not enough focus on effort and learning and strong academic performance. You hear a lot about applicants with 1600 SAT scores who are rejected at top schools, but even the most competitive schools are going to think twice before they reject a student who is an extremely strong student at or near the top of a large class at a strong high school, and with strong SAT/ACT scores, 2) the truth usually wins out. Admissions officers are pretty good at figuring out just about how strong a student is academically. </p>
<p>Very high grades and high class standing reflect not only that the student is smart, but also that the student is motivated, a hard worker, someone who knows how to work a system (in a positive way), and one who is likely to take advantage of the environment at a competitive college. Grades are an extremely powerful indicator, and high school students interested in competitive colleges shouldn’t lose sight of that fact. </p>
<p>It’s also good to recognize that college grades become even more important when the student applies to law school, medical school, graduate school out of college. Making high grades is simply fundamentally important.</p>
I was actually directing my question to parentalexpert, who I believe has actually worked in a university admissions office. But sincerely, thanks for your thoughts, anyway. </p>