Cher's daughter, Chastity Bono, is changing gender

<p>I think I am more surprised that Warren Beatty has stayed married to one woman for this long than the tone of the article. ;)</p>

<p>Is this news in any other type of publication? National Enquirer does make everything so sensational. We have been chatting about it on one of the other threads - they seem to know when people are cheating on their spouses, but beyond that I haven’t given it much credence.</p>

<p>I wish Kathlyn the best during this difficult time. Whether she is pursuing gender reassignment or if this is National Enquirer just being a yellow news rag, it is a personal matter. If she wants to tell the world about her personal decisions, then I hope that it happens on her own timeline.</p>

<p>Why did they focus on Kathlyn being the daughter of Warren Beatty when , IMO, Annette Bening is just as well known for her acting skills. Best of luck to Kathlyn, Warren and Annette.</p>

<p>I’ve seen some fairly recent photos, which lead me to believe that the story is almost certainly true. So, absent any contrary indication, I would prefer to call him Stephen, and use male pronouns. And I, too wish all of them the best, and hope that his parents are not truly “beside themselves,” that they learn to accept their child for who he is (if they don’t already), and that he can lead his life in relative privacy. I can’t imagine how difficult it would be to transition under media scrutiny. It’s hard enough without it. I had exactly one newspaper article written about me, and was talked about in a small part of one book, and honestly wish I had avoided even that.</p>

<p>Duly noted, Donna. Stephen, it is. :cool:</p>

<p>Maybe it is the surgery, rather than the sex change, that the Beattys are so distraught about. The parental experience of having a child go through major surgery is about as close as it gets to the experience of losing them.</p>

<p>18 is awfully young to make this medical decision. I would try to influence my kid to hold off on the surgery until their mid twenties. As a parent, I hope I would accept their new gender identity without a hitch.</p>

<p>crosspost with BAY</p>

<p>Maybe it’s the age they are concerned about. 18 is very, very young to be making any kind of permanent change in my opinion. I know it’s the age of legal adulthood, etc. but I just think 18 is young. One of my kids was diagnosed with a serious, chronic illness at 19 and it took both of us to navigate all that comes with making complex medical decisions, etc. even though she was a very competent 19 year old. The idea of an 18 year old making serious decisions about surgery, choosing doctors, taking hormones, etc. concerns me because I don’t think most kids that age are experienced enough to navigate the medical system and to make complex decisions regarding health care. Donna, when you have shared your story, you have mentioned how long you lived as a woman before having surgery. I just wonder about rushing into surgery at such a young age. Why not live for a bit as an adult male and get some bearings as an adult before making such a major decision?</p>

<p>I don’t disagree, and should have mentioned that I automatically discounted the reference to impending surgery, and assume that it’s wildly inaccurate. It’s extremely unlikely that any surgery would be planned at such an early stage, whether the person is 18 or 28. Generally speaking, one has to have transitioned on a full time basis for at least one year before surgery (I waited four years, for all sorts of reasons I’ve explained in the past), and no surgeon in this country (or Canada) would contemplate performing any kind of gender reassignment surgery before that. Especially on someone so young, and especially on the child of rich celebrities who undoubtedly have lawyers aplenty! Not to mention that any such surgery is quite expensive and rarely covered by insurance; even children of celebrities don’t generally have control over quite that much money at the age of 18. (Especially since both of the main options for genital surgery for trans guys are probably twice as expensive as genital surgery for trans women, and can cost something close to $50,000, as well as considerably less “perfected” – which is why a much smaller percentage of trans men than trans women end up having any genital surgery at all. Many, if they have any surgery, have only “top surgery,” that is, chest reconstruction surgery to achieve a male-looking chest.) </p>

<p>In any event, it’s far more likely that all Stephen (if that’s actually his name) is contemplating now is doing things like a legal name change, and perhaps beginning hormone therapy. I don’t think 18 is too young for that, for someone who’s obviously been thinking about this for a very long time. Besides, it’s possible to take hormones (testosterone, in this case) for a good while without any irreversible effects, in the event one changes one’s mind. Which doesn’t happen all that often.</p>

<p>So I have no idea what Warren Beatty is actually “beside himself” about. If he really is.</p>

<p>

Unfortunately that’s not true everywhere. I have a friend who is beside herself because her soon to be son, has not been transitioned for a full year. She’s fine with the idea, but is not fine with the rush. (I think the soon to be son is having the surgery in Europe.)</p>

<p>I don’t think we know much about what Warren Beatty is thinking or feeling, but I do remember Cher talking about it being difficult when she found out Chaz was a lesbian (at that point in time that’s what Cher was processing) even though she considered herself the most open-minded of people. I think it’s important to remember that parents also have an identity around the gender of their children from the first revealing ultrasound. They move through life as the parent of a son or daughter, they see their children a certain way, have their own dreams and expectations. I imagine Warren and Annette pictured their child’s wedding day, grandchildren, etc. from infancy. I know I’ve been identified for fifteen years as the mother of three sons and one daughter. It would be profoundly life-altering for me if I was being asked to accept that I no longer had a daughter but four sons.</p>

<p>Whenever I hear someone is “beside (them)self” I say, “good, then there will be 2 of you to handle it.”</p>

<p>"18 is awfully young to make this medical decision. I would try to influence my kid to hold off on the surgery until their mid twenties. "</p>

<p>I think that if someone’s brain has been telling them for all of their life that they are a different gender than society views them as being, 18 is old to have the surgery. They would already have been through years of hell and confusion. I don’t think that anyone would decide lightly to have such surgery, so I believe that being 18 years old would be old enough to have it.</p>

<p>Interesting, mathmom. I’ve honestly never heard of anyone from the U.S. having GRS in Europe. (At least, not since the 1950’s, when people used to have to go to places like Denmark. Morocco was another popular destination once upon a time.) The major overseas destination nowadays for people from the U.S. and U.K. is Thailand, where a couple of the surgeons are considered as being among the very best in the world, and the cost of surgery (even with travel expenses) is quite a bit less than in North America. And, yes, the Thai surgeons, although they do require referral letters from doctors, therapists, etc., do tend to be a little less strict in terms of the waiting period.</p>

<p>Then again, there are a great many trans people who believe that as adults they should have autonomy over their own bodies, and that the kind of “gatekeeping” that trans people have to go through is demeaning and unnecessary. For me personally, the reasons I waited four years after transition to have surgery had nothing whatsoever to do with having any doubts about whether surgery (or transition itself) would be right for me. I always knew it would be. (Assuming I got through the surgery in one piece, which was obviously a concern given my general health issues!) I had no doubts, or worries about potential regrets, at any time. I certainly knew who I really was, on some level, by the time I was 18 (despite strenuous efforts to deny and suppress that knowledge, which lasted almost 40 years). I knew it when I was 3.</p>

<p>PS: I’m not trying by any means to dismiss how difficult something like this is for parents to learn to accept – often considerably more difficult than learning that one’s child is gay. Some never do. I know trans people who, very sadly, have been permanently rejected by their parents, with all communication cut off.</p>

<p>In this case, it sounds like the parents have known about the situation for a long time; it didn’t just come up now.</p>

<p>My father was accepting when I finally told him six years ago, but we’ve never been very close and I don’t think he ever was emotionally invested in a “father-son” son relationship with me. Or much of anything else where I’m concerned, for that matter. (The next time he tells me he loves me will, so far as I remember, be the first time ever. I’m not holding my breath!)</p>

<p>As I’ve mentioned before, I don’t know how my mother would have reacted. She’s been dead for 35 years, as of Monday. I’d like to think she would still have loved me, and would have learned to accept me. I do know that when I was a young child she said a couple of times, based on something she saw about me – I don’t even know what – that I should have been a girl. Of course, I denied it. (Even then, I knew better than to admit something like that! When I was 7 years old, and my father brought home a button for me to wear that said “It’s A Man’s World,” I even pretended to be pleased. I’m sure my parents meant well.)</p>

<p>I can understand the gatekeeping to a certain extent. I don’t think a year is unreasonable, particularly as a patient transitions, does the work it takes with regards to establishing a new identity and wearing opposite gender clothing. This may be the most extensive and radical surgery that exists - can you think of something else that compares? </p>

<p>A breast augmentation could be reversed…but not GRS.</p>

<p>While a patient may have known since they were 3, like you Donna, that doesn’t mean everyone has this early epiphany. It may even be the vast majority of patients - I don’t know. </p>

<p>I do know many young people whose sexual orientation wasn’t completely defined until adulthood. </p>

<p>There are no take backs, after a surgery like this. And I am sure you would be the first to say how absolutely complicated this procedure can be, particularly with your medical complications.</p>

<p>I think 18 is fine, if you’ve been transitioned and it’s been clear for a while that this is the right decision. One year really isn’t very long in the great scheme of things. The parent I know is really very accepting of all her children’s experiences in sexuality, but surgery is pretty permanent.</p>

<p>SamuraiLandshark, I happen to agree with you; I was simply mentioning how some trans people feel. A year isn’t really such a long time to wait, no matter how sure you are. And it isn’t necessarily the most important aspect of transition, either. For some people, learning to live in a different gender from the one they were assigned at birth – and learning to be perceived and accepted as such by others, assuming they care about that, which not everyone does – can take a lot of work, and a lot of time. Sometimes because of issues of physical appearance (and voice) that are pretty much a question of good or bad luck, sometimes for other reasons. To focus entirely on having surgery as fast as possible – even though genital surgery makes no difference whatsoever in how people perceive you on a day to day basis – isn’t always the most productive approach. No matter how creepily fascinated with “the surgery” the media always seem to be. (“She went into surgery a man – and came out a woman!!” Bleah.)</p>

<p>When you are 18, a year may seem like a lifetime. As a parent who isn’t 18, that same amount of time seems like a tiny blip! I drove by a Moon Bounce House today at the park and can remember with great fondness when my kids lived to go play in them at birthday parties. Now they are travelling the world, learning to drive and aging before my very eyes! </p>

<p>Mental preparation for a GRS is probably a much bigger deal than most of us bystanders realize.</p>

<p>I am betting the parents agree to the surgery given that their child would not likely have been able to pay for the surgery.</p>