There is pressure to do so. Yes, it’s better than when it was a REQUIREMENT. It no longer is - you can say ‘no’, but it doesn’t mean there isn’t pressure to do so nonetheless. Yes, we have come a long way, but I don’t think it’s a reason to stop. And then there is a whole another world of social expectations and body image issues that affect a lot of women.
Makeup options have come a long, long way. I remember going through my mom’s makeup when I was a child in the late 60s. It was very limited. She had a glass bottle of thick beige foundation - I think it was Revlon, a tube of ultra red lipstick, a compact of pressed powder, and a little box of Mabelline mascara - it came in a hard plastic red box that slid open. Inside was a small brush in one compartment and a cake of hard dark stuff in the other. You had to wet the mascara cake to use it. No blush, because it was, apparently, too provocative. I found it fascinating.
I wonder why some have the reaction to makeup, specifically, versus (let’s say) hair styling. Some people wear their hair long and straight - others short. Some people wear braids, others wear ponytails (guilty as charged). Some use rollers or curling irons or hair straighteners. Some people wear bangs and others don’t. Some people wear dreadlocks or afros based on the texture that works best for their hair. It seems that conceptually, makeup is the exact same thing as hair styling, yet there isn’t “paint and spackle” terminology used for hair styling, and we often admire people who have elaborate or interesting hairdos (like the man I mentioned last night). Why is that?
Just theoretically speaking, acollegestudent. What would you feel you were compromising about yourself if you, let’s say, meant to reach for the Burt’s Bees chapstick because your lips were feeling dry, and instead found that you had bought one of the tinted Burt’s Bees that gives a bit of color? Would you not wear it?
Is there a conceptual difference between -
- you look in the mirror, your eyes are redder than usual so you decide to put in a little Visine
- you look in the mirror, your cheeks look paler than usual so you decide to throw on a little blush
“There is pressure to do so. Yes, it’s better than when it was a REQUIREMENT. It no longer is - you can say ‘no’, but it doesn’t mean there isn’t pressure to do so nonetheless.”
My brain is the same brain whether I’m wearing sweatpants and an oversized t-shirt. Do you think it is “unfair” or “wrong” that I don’t show up to my clients wearing sweatpants and a t-shirt? I mean, they are just paying me for my brain, theoretically.
Pizzagirl, I can answer for myself only. I wasn’t the one that used the “paint and spackle” term - never heard that term before this thread actually, and I don’t condemn people who want to wear make up. I think every person should be free to look what they want to look like!
I can tell you why I personally don’t see make up the same way as hair (although I don’t use hair products either) and don’t like it for myself. When you change your hair, it’s still your hair (as you can probably tell, I wouldn’t be a fan of extensions, etc.). When you put on make up, it changes the shade and texture of your skin, the volume or your lips or eyelashes. For me, I want to be me - when you look at me, what you see is my face, with all the natural imperfections or anything else. To me, it wouldn’t feel real to put something on that’s not a part of my face naturally, but is made to look like it is. I would much rather wear purple or green lipstick than one that matches my skin tone, for example. That’s why I personally don’t like make up.
To answer some of your questions, no I would not buy tinted chapstick, although if I already had it, I may wear it, not really sure - probably not. Keep in mind, when I was in middle school/high school, even college, I did use lip gloss on occasion - I even had fake nails once. I have tried make up. I used mascara. I am not afraid of make up - I would paint my nails, for example, and it’s possible that I may use mascara for a special occasion - I haven’t in years, but who knows what the future holds?
As for the sweatpants. There are a few differences between a dress code and make up. The huge one - I think it’s absurd to only subject only one group in the workplace to a “dress code.” What you wear applies to both men and women. However, make up only applies to women - to me, that already makes it unacceptable as a requirement. The second difference is that clothes doesn’t really change the look of your body - it just covers it, while make up changes the look of your face. Unless you wear padding, clothes does not make it look like you have a bigger butt or thinner legs (yes, there are some visual effects, I guess, depending on whether you wear darks or white or stripes, but the bottom line is it doesn’t HAVE to alter what you look like, if you don’t want it to). Not so with make up. By definition it will either change color, texture, or enhance features - unlike with clothes, you can’t wear make up (unless it’s lotion) and not have it change anything. That’s the reason I don’t think it’s acceptable to require women to wear make up, but I am OK with a business suit.
I do think quite a lot though about dress codes, because in many ways it’s kind of a superficial thing too (although not entirely), but that’s for another thread.
^the sweatsuit thread, cause PG is dissing those sweatsuits 
Thanks for your answer. I guess I don’t see the conceptual difference between braiding or curling one’s hair (which changes the texture) and putting on makeup (which changes the texture - far, far less, because there’s nothing about wearing blush or eyeshadow that changes the texture of my skin - if anything, it’s plain moisturizer that changes skin texture).
I’m also wondering why you are assuming that a person with makeup is covering natural imperfections. I have freckles; they’re still visible, I’m not covering them with a layer of pancake makeup.
I rarely wear mascara, but I have had lash extensions and plan to do so again one day - I really liked the look. To me, my eyes look better with them - just like my hands look better when I have nice nails. I don’t know. I wonder if you have internalized a message that personal vanity is “vain” as opposed to a viewpoint that one is important enough to care for oneself.
And you know, Pizzagirl, if you are doing it for you, good for you! I really mean it!
It’s not so much about vanity, although I do find the preoccupation with looks off-putting, but that’s not really a make-up thing, more just idolizing people that look a certain way, talking about people’s “hotness”, etc. It’s more about - this is me. I don’t want to put on make up. I am not interested in it. I like just having my face as it is out there in the world. It’s hard to describe, but it makes me feel good. It may not be all good, as there is that pressure and the expectations others have and, yes, even insecurity sometimes (hey, I am surely not immune to that!), but there is something so wonderful and empowering and liberating about it (to me), and that outweighs the rest.
By the way, I come from a culture where women do wear make up. My grandmothers both did, although not so much now that they are much older. My mom did and still does as well. So, it’s not some sort of a weird cultural taboo (if I were living in a culture where women weren’t allowed to wear make up, I would probably wear it all the time, haha).
I think one can be interested in looks but not be preoccupied with them, if that makes sense.
I have a relatively benign medical condition known as rosacea. I had pretty flawless skin as a child-teen-adult, but in the past decade, the rosacea surfaced and it makes my skin look red and blotchy in places. I never wore foundation before, but I do now to even out my skin tone and make all of it look like the areas of my skin not affected by rosacea.
If this is caving in to insecurity brought about by imperfection, so be it. I won’t lose any sleep over it.
That makes perfect sense, Pizzagirl. I am told I am a very “natural” person, yet I wear makeup, color my hair and like jewelry. I enjoy beauty products and use them to enhance my features. I think I look better with some color on my face and with my eyes enhanced. I think it’s fun. I have my own sense of style and dress, and have adapted it (pushing the limits sometimes) to my business casual corporate environment. We have women who dress stylishly and some who don’t. Some women here are really into makeup and some less so. I think most women look a little better with some color and shine, but that’s just my opinion. I run competitively and never show up for training or racing with any makeup on, so it’s not like I’m afraid to be seen without it.
@acollegestudent, I think it’s very good that you feel comfortable and happy in your own skin, without any makeup. I can remember being a teenager and feeling very uncomfortable about the thought of going out and running into someone without having done my hair or my makeup. I didn’t wear a lot, but I got so used to it that I felt naked and uncomfortable without mascara. How could I have gone on a camping trip with other teenagers? It would have worried me.
So, if you ask yourself if you’d be just fine running into a friend at the grocery store, looking a bit schleppy in sweatpants and with no makeup on, that’s great. If the thought of that bothers you, I would worry about over dependance on makeup.
I often feel sorry for men that they can’t conceal darkness under their eyes or blemishes with make-up. I don’t think most of us are putting on make-up to attract men or to call attention to ourselves, we’re just trying to look a bit better. I wear mascara and blush and concealer for a dark spot where I had a melanoma spot removed. It takes me all of 30 seconds to apply what I wear.
Make-up for me depends on what I am doing that day/night. If I am at home working I am usually in yoga pants and a tank, hair in pony tail and no make-up. But if my day takes me elsewhere I apply a very light tinted moisturizer, little bit of concealer if I didn’t get a lot of sleep, mascara and a swipe of gloss or lipstick. Sometimes I might apply an eyeliner. I go for very muted colors - never wear black liner or red lipstick. I think you have to be very careful what you apply for daywear - the harsh outside light can make you look overdone very easily.
Now if you are dressing up and going out for the evening I think anything goes. Have some fun with something you don’t usually do as far as makeup is concerned. Candlelight or dimly lit spaces are very forgiving.
Don’t care for lip liner as often the lipstick wears off and it leaves people looking like the “joker” with the outline left. Really do not care for eye shadow either. Seems dated to me.
“The huge one - I think it’s absurd to only subject only one group in the workplace to a “dress code.” What you wear applies to both men and women. However, make up only applies to women - to me, that already makes it unacceptable as a requirement”
I have never seen a dress code that required women to wear makeup, and I have worked in a corporate environment for a while. What dress codes usually say about makeup is that execssive makeup is against the dress code.
“So, if you ask yourself if you’d be just fine running into a friend at the grocery store, looking a bit schleppy in sweatpants and with no makeup on, that’s great. If the thought of that bothers you, I would worry about over dependance on makeup.”
Looking schleppy =/= no makeup in my books. Sweatpants? No thanks. How hard is it to put on a clean pair of jeans and a tee, and step into a pair of boots or flats? It takes just a couple of minutes. The thought of wearing old, holey sweats with stretched out knees to a store “bothers me”, but it does not mean I am dependent on makeup. The two are totally separate issues.
It is really unfortunate that thoughts about makeup brings up such unpleasant memories for you, greenwitch.
Eye shadow has not gone out of style with young women. They may not wear it the way their moms wore it, but they are still buying and wearing it, especially when they go out on the town.
“So, if you ask yourself if you’d be just fine running into a friend at the grocery store, looking a bit schleppy in sweatpants and with no makeup on, that’s great. If the thought of that bothers you, I would worry about over dependance on makeup.”
You’re not getting it - it’s not about “worry.” It’s about how I prefer to project myself.
Here’s an example. I travel for international business frequently, by myself. So when I’m not working, I’m off exploring whatever city I’m in. Now, I don’t know anybody in this city. I have no one to meet or impress. But nonetheless - I try to plan reasonably cute (according to my standards) outfits to wear, and yes, I’ll wear makeup, even if the only people who will see me are the people standing in line with me at the museum. Because it’s how I prefer to be. It has nothing to do with worrying about how other people see me.
I have a particularly fond memory from a trip I took in Rome in Feb 2012 - when there was a freak snowstorm and my business meetings were cancelled, but tourist attractions were open. I distinctly remember getting up, getting dressed, deciding to put on eyeliner and a black turtleneck and tie a chic little scarf around my neck a la Audrey Hepburn, and walked around the city for 8 hours. It was truly glorious. And part of why it was a glorious day is that I felt and knew that I looked good, that I was channeling that AH-ish spirit. And it just wouldn’t have been the same if I’d been frumping around in sweatpants and an oversized sweatshirt.
Which is not to say that I don’t wear sweatpants and oversized sweatshirts - I do, but they don’t make me feel good.
This is the makeup I wear most for everyday - I like stuff that you can use on lips, eyes and / or cheeks as you see fit, and I’m very minimalist - I don’t like to have a lot of products. There is just no way that this kind of makeup can result in anything that’s artificial looking or unnatural. Sorry, I think some of you really are channeling Tammy Faye Bakker when you hear the word makeup, and that’s unfortunate.