<p>For our school class rank is frozen at calculation of senior first semester, which have just been released. </p>
<p>I understand the pain of many how the process of determining the NMS is discriminatory, albeit geographically. I completely agree with that. But to NMSC, geographical diversity matters more than anything else. If I take that objective for granted, without necessarily agreeing to their pecking order of preference, at least the cutoff is based on academic merit, rather than the subjective impression of people on a committee to select 16,000 Semifinalists. If you do not want your PSAT to count for any extenuating circumstances, at least you have an alternative to use a SAT test at the discretion of NMSC. </p>
<p>If I look in a similar way, all the components of college admissions and scholarships are discriminatory. That is not at all based on merit, but rather a coin toss for the thousands of equally bright kids (both academically and non-academically talented) that can get into many Ivies or other higher institutions of learning and be successful. The holistic admission process gives admission officer the liberty to pick and choose. The stats of people getting rejected from Ivies are not that different from those getting in.</p>
<p>Elite Private Colleges use a pyramid structure to fill the slots based on their racial and other needs. It’s a competition to get a slot in the layer you are in, rather than a slot in the whole pyramid. If you compare the stats for the University of California system to Ivies, you will get a good grasp of what I have stated here. You will find 40%+ Asian kids in UC System or NM Semifinalist group, but not in Ivies because of the superficial restriction imposed on them. Books and Thesis have been written to justify and counter these claims (see, <a href=“http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/the-myth-of-american-meritocracy/”>http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/the-myth-of-american-meritocracy/</a> and the books by many including Amy Chua for the reasons, both good and bad).</p>
<p>The bottom line is that you won’t see that in the first part of the NMS Competition. But when it boils down to becoming a National Merit Scholar, irrespective of your enviable academic/extracurricular credentials and outstanding essays, there is always a 50% probability of failure.</p>
<p>To me, getting into Ivies or becoming a NMS is not an end in itself. A simple mistake in one question in SAT can take you down from 2400 to 2370. That does not mean that the one with 2370 is academically inferior. If that were the case, you would not have seen the best of Einstein. </p>
<p>As someone said in one of the prior postings, these are extraordinary achievements to be applauded. I cannot agree more to what Wolverine86 has stated before, “High achievement on any standardized test is not a fluke…it’s the product of effort that has been put in over many years leading up to that test. Not performing well on a particular test/day is certainly NOT an indication of anything, but bagging on kids who do perform well isn’t warranted either IMO.”</p>
<p>We live in Connecticut, where the public school system is great, but comes at a very high cost of living. I am telling from my experience, as I had lived in Indiana and Maryland before moving here. My daughter’s school sends many to top notch institutions, but unfortunately a great majority of them are commended scholars rather than merit scholars. But one thing that stands out is that all of them are very special in one way or the other. I wish all of them were merit scholars.</p>
<p>" but bagging on kids who do perform well isn’t warranted either IMO"
I certainly wasn’t doing that. My post had nothing to do with the kids involved. </p>
<p>“I think being valedictorian is a big deal. We don’t have that in our district as grades are not weighted, no ranking, but I understand it’s a huge honor. Aren’t there colleges that give scholarships for val?”</p>
<p>It is so funny how different schools and districts handle the idea of ranking, weighted grades and the like. Our school is the opposite of yours @celesteroberts. Our dual enrollment offerings at the local state college are arguably much easier than their counterparts in AP and the dual enrollment is free of charge to the students so they may start taking courses as soon as the summer before sophomore year. Those 5.0 A’s add up and usually the kids ( and their parents) who know the system will milk it for all it is worth. The kids slugging it through AP Chem, Econ, Calc and the like fight for their 5.0 A’s if they are lucky enough to get one. So the highest GPA 's speak at graduation and that is usually the top 1% or 5 kids. Some of these “top” kids spend so little time on the high school campus because they are spending a good portion of the school day at dual enrollment. What a joke to have someone speak at graduation who is hardly ever on the actual school grounds! By the way, most of the top 1% are not NM Scholars!</p>
<p>Please - love them, celebrate them, ENJOY them. These are great kids and YOU are great parents.
THE most important determinant of kid success is their PARENTS.</p>
<p>In Texas, the valedictorian of every Texas public high school gets free tuition for 1 year at any Texas public university. </p>
<p>Hello all, Clearly we are all fortunate to have kids with enough academic talent that they are in the running for such a prestigious honor. What I do, however, wonder about is how “learning” sometimes takes a back seat to performance. I completely understand @saismom who feels the system in her neck of the woods discriminates against the better prepared HS students. Here in Ohio, dual enrollment students HS GPA’s are not weighted at all for college classes! So trust me on this, my D (who is finishing her HS career with 80 Credit hours at the local research university, including 30 upper division and graduate level hours with a 4.0 GPA in college) will not even stand a chance to be in the top 10. What she has earned is far more valuable than what she has lost. She has learned a great deal from college. The chance to study, research, and collaborate with experts, in combination with challenging classes that value higher order thinking over memorizing content works for her.</p>
<p>Granted, every place, child, and situation, is unique. I still believe all of us who are passionate enough about our children’s education to participate in this forum need to remember the reason we are here, regardless of the NM status, GPA, SAT score. </p>
<p>Value the learning and success will never be far behind.</p>
<p>@Singersdad, Both of my kids are in the same situation. They are at a HS school that is on our local university campus and are considered dual enrolled university students. They may enroll in classes at the U with approval from their HS director. They get HS credit for the U class and they will receive college credits at the same time. The 100-200 level U classes are not weighted. A very few academy classes and 300 and 400 level classes are weighted at a 4.5 level, but none are weighted at the 5.0 level of AP classes, which are not part of our school curriculum. I think a plus for them is that the school is very small and does not rank students. Another plus is that my kids love the school and feel they are more prepared for college than their peers at other HS where they have not experienced college level classes. My D 15 did do very well on the PSAT and is not on the bubble as so many kids are. She still needs to take the SAT (She’s scheduled for May) because she has not been able to fit it in earlier due to her sport. </p>
<p>I think your D is very luck to have had the opportunity to be successful in college. It sounds like she could easily finish her undergrad at the local research U and use the UG money for grad school!</p>
<p>@mtrosemom It sounds like your school has an excellent compromise ! And your kids really have the best of both worlds.</p>
<p>Unfortunately for me, D has big plans 3 years more undergrad at a very rigorous college, double or triple major, a chance to compete in college debate and more significantly, a chance to live “the undergrad experience.” She also hopes to participate in internship and study abroad opportunities.Things precluded by her age up to this point (she turned 16 last month)</p>
<p>I hate the way my sons HS does valedictorian! He has fluctuated between # 1 and 2 since Freshman year! He is currently #1 but cumulatively #2! That being said we have “tryouts” for valedictorian and salutatorian! If you are the best speaker in the tryout group you are awarded the title valedictorian / salut… Last year the V was #10 in the class and the sal was # 30!!! So unfair if you ask me!!! UGH!!!
That being said our principle did announce the cutoff as 201!!! So happy it is down a bit!!!</p>
<p>Wow @pasoccermom, that’s a terrible method! My kid would have never made one of those top spots if it came to tryouts. We base ours totally on final weighted GPA, and I hope that doesn’t change for at least another year.</p>
<p>Our HS does tryouts for Val and Sal, rather than awarding the speaking gigs by GPA ranking. Any senior can submit a speech draft, and the top double-handful are selected by a committee of English teachers. The principal calls those students in to present their speeches to him, and selects two. Makes for great speeches at graduation!</p>
<p>I’m sure it would Michal1! I’m being a bit selfish here and thinking only of myself, LOL! My kids are bright, hard workers, deserving of some honors, but they aren’t natural born public speakers.</p>
<p>I do think you need great speakers too @mihcal1 but I do think working hard all 4 years to earn a top rank should count more! If the top 2 don’t want to speak that is a different story! Valedictorian means first in class!</p>
<p>We have a keynote speaker to entertain the masses. The val/sal speeches are only supposed to be 2-3 minutes, and they are supposed to be an honor earned by merit, in my opinion. Maybe I’d feel differently if my own kids weren’t in the running.</p>
<p>My daughter has been the valedictorian every year. Yep…first in class…every year.Homeschooled. :)</p>
<p>Our district ranks #1, #2 etc., but does not name them Valedictorian or Salutatorian. Any student can try out to speak at graduation, regardless of class rank, by submitting a written speech in advance and giving it before a committee. 2 kids speak at graduation. For my 2 older boys, the speeches were excellent and, according to my boys, the kids were “good kids” although not necessarily kids with accolades seen in the local paper. I think that works well. </p>
<p>We also have dual credit courses, but they are lower level from the local CC. The kids get weighted GPAs for DC, AP and Honors. @Singersdad, I wonder what would happen in Texas with your school’s grading policy. The top 10% in any Texas public HS are auto-admits to any Texas public university. The purpose of the rule was to increase diversity at our universities by ensuring automatic admission to top students from primarily minority high schools. Unfortunately, our universities now have little space left for out of state or international students or for amazing prospects, like your daughter, if they are not in the top 10%. The universities despise the rule because they want kids like your daughter but sometimes cannot accept them (although I suspect they’d find room for her!).</p>
<p>All these inconsistencies about val/sal are probably why colleges often pay little attention to them. And HS administrators, while very well-intentioned, can come up with crazy complicated compromises in an attempt to please everyone. Choosing the best speakers is fine, but it is not what val/sal means. Call it something else if that is what you want to do. And of course there are all the weighted/unweighted/how weighted issues and depending on methodology, you can end up with a above average student who took easy classes and worked hard. Being val/sal is just one honor among many - it is not the be all/end all but it does tell you something about the student.</p>
<p>Be careful about the dual credit thing. It can really burn a student when starting college and finding out that many of the great scholarships available for merit are not available because they are not actually entering freshman. You may save money on tuition for 2 years, but that can be a concern.</p>
<p>From our experience, the dual credit has not affected scholarships, so it may depend on the school. A student may have the credits of an upperclassman, but based on HS grad year, they are “freshmen” for most purposes, such as scholarships, freshmen dorms and clubs, etc.</p>