This really depends on the high school. Nobody is expected to take 16 AP’s to prove course rigor. At a given high school (especially those that restrict number of AP’s per year), 7-8 AP’s may indicate high rigor. I think the OP’s main issue may be the choice of AP’s, not necessarily the quantity. I think there is some expectation by schools of this caliber to cover the foundational subjects (English, Science, Social Sciences, Math, Language).
My son is at Hamilton, and was looking for a rural LAC with open(ish) curriculum, strong study abroad options and proximity to snowboarding. He is in his second year at Hamilton and absolutely loves it. His classes have been excellent and the outdoor club is super vibrant and offers lots of weekend trips and on campus events. Skiing is about 80 minutes away, but there is no shortage of snow–so you better love winter if Hamilton stays on the list! My kid also liked Colby, but found the community at Hamilton to be a better fit for his vibe: really friendly, kind of artsy, loves the outdoors, enjoys deep engagement in learning.
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The student said the school offered all the APs. I don’t know how you show you’ve taken the most rigorous course offerings without taking them.
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How are colleges supposed to know how strong your course rigor is outside of the school profile? My school profile I feel really misrepresents how easy is to take APs. I tried as hard as possible to take the more rigorous APs but my application has no way of showing this I feel. Is there anything I can do?
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The school profile should be an accurate representation of what courses are offered and who is taking them. It should list out all the courses and share stats about percent of students taking AP or IB exams and what the scores were.
Do you have to have permission of the instructor or your guidance counselor to enroll?
But also, you’ve got some great college options already and you will undoubtedly get additional offers. You lose nothing by putting in an ED2 application to Bowdoin or another school. Just go for it. I don’t think it will be helpful to try to explain why the school profile is inaccurate.
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Why - these aren’t required.
I agree with @Franklynn that kids should take what appeals to them. But the tradeoff is you then make yourself, potentially, a less desirable candidate. It’s a choice up front. I don’t know what HS law classes are but they’re not a requirement, they’re a nice to have. Many take CS instead of a science. It’s a choice but if they’re not fulfilling a core requirement.
So not a note for you - what’s done is done - but I wish kids realize their decisions will impact.
But I also think if you end up at St. Lawrence instead of Bowdoin, it won’t impact your life. Colby is a great school - but ask 100 people outside of Maine and you’ll be lucky if two have heard of it.
Whoever recommended Bates - they do have a brutally high ED rate in comparison to others.
But ED isn’t a game - and you need to take your shot where you truly want to be. But also know, the name of the school isn’t going to change who you are and what you accomplished.
And there is nothing to write in the additional info section. You knowingly didn’t take the most rigorous schedule - and there’s nothing wrong with that by the way. But that is nothing to note - it is what it is. You note, for example, my daughter only had two years of language because they cancelled the third year during summer - and you have the counselor note it.
Your other question - can you get in RD. Yes, I noted figures up front. You didn’t apply to Wes but they have a 14% or so non-ED yield so need to admit 7 in RD to get 1. Hamilton was 4.5. Colby doesn’t have a CDS so I can’t calculate it but given they are need aware and without much brand recognition, I’d guessing it’s higher.
Skidmore -335 went ED. 670 enrolled so half of enrollees are ED. They admitted 2503 so take 351 out of 2503 (they show 16 ED dropped off). So 2152 got in RD. 335 attended. So they had to admit 6.4 kids RD for just to get enough to attend.
PS - is Dartmouth on your list? If you like NY, how about Rochester and Ithaca? Whitman in Washington - skiing an hour away.
Good luck.
No - you made a choice to take law classes. I’m not sure what that entails in HS.
There are core areas - English, Math, Social Science, Foreign Language, Science
You can ensure you have a varied list of affordable reaches, targets and safeties that you like.
Shoot your shot - but have ensured list of schools you will be happy to attend or that meet your need.
You have - Bing, New Paltz, Bard (odd you applied if you don’t want to attend). You will have CU and UVM. Which UW? CU and any UW (assuming Wis or Was) are vastly different than an LAC.
You have homes so you’re in good shape. Apply to your reaches, find suitable LAC subs because it’s not like Bowdoin, Colby and Hamilton don’t have other like schools - you just like the rank.
Apply - and see.
But don’t come up with excuses - because your profile will invalidate them and it’ll look like excuse making. If there is a story there, have your guidance counselor address it in their submission on you.
My school makes us select “majors” our sophomore year. So I, for example, picked Law, which means I have 3 periods of law classes (Criminal Procedure, Constitutional Law etc.) Junior and Senior year. I could have ask picked, for example, Math, which has classes like Linear Algebra. This leaves few periods a day to take harder APs, and at least in my case, these harder APs were usually offered at periods that conflict with my mandatory major classes. It’s not a process of regular physics or you can elect to take AP physics. Instead, we have 2800 students in two grades competing for 68 spots in 2 AP physics classes, which our school has decided to be completely luck based.
To be fair, some majors have APs built in, so Chemistry major kids will have AP chemistry their junior year. Unfortunately, in fall of sophomore year, I wasn’t aware the influence this decision would have on college apps. The school would tell us that we should just take what seems the most interesting, not anything about rigor. I was hoping I would be able to take AP Physics C this year, and AP Bio instead of APES last year, but they were either not available my open periods, or I wasn’t lucky enough to get in. I’m not trying to make excuses for myself here. I had to fight and talk to several assistant principles this year just to be able to take BC.
Anyways, I appreciate the advice on ED2 quite a lot. I considered Dartmouth, but they seem to really really hate my school only taking 1% of applicants a year, taking none of a 1400 graduating class last year. Cornell on the other hand seems to like my school, with an almost 30% ED acceptance rate.
I never said I don’t want to attend Bard, New Paltz, or Bing, just I would rather attend a reach? Isn’t that the point of a safety?
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It sounds like your school is unusual and also has a track record of placing students at selective colleges. Bear in mind that the people commenting here are just dummies like me who don’t really know the nuance of the situation. I think you just proceed with your plans!!
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But how does placement compare between different “majors”? If the students in the law track could not take the more rigorous courses in the usual college prep subjects, how are their college results compared to those in tracks that include those more rigorous courses in the usual college prep subjects?
Are you asking if the law major usually has worse results because of a lack of rigorous APs? I don’t really have any data, but I don’t believe so. Basically all of our other majors are engineering or STEM related, so kids are usually applying to more competitive programs so I really have no way of knowing.
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Based on your description, I know which SHS you attend. I would bet that the AOs at the schools you’re applying to are very familiar with how your school works and the scheduling challenges given its size. I don’t think it can hurt to add some in in the additional information section.
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Thank you. It’s definitely pretty easy to figure out which SHS I’m going to. I’m going to ask my guidance counselor if she can include anything, and if not I’ll just add a line to my additional info talking about scheduling issues.
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Interesting school. Thanks for the explanation.
I’d have taken the same track. Sounds great. I agree with the school. Take the one that fits you.
You’ve got great college admits so I dontt see you impacted. You could have been STEM and still not gotten into Midd. The acceptance rate is very low and no one ever knows why they don’t get in. And you have GREAT admits with more coming.but it’s presumptuous to think you’d get into an under 15% school if you did one thing differently.
I disagree with this. If Midd, Bowdoin and Hamilton are your favorites for fit and feel, then great. But kids pick safeties over reaches every day. Both mine did. My turned down a school of similar caliber to yours (W&L) to attend College of Charleston. One of her bffs there got into Penn, Vandy and Rice. There are Ivy caliber students at most every flagship.
So picking a school for a rank - that’s anyone’s prerogative but I’d want my to be where I fit - period. My daughter had me take her to 30+ schools. C of C was #4 and I told my wife the night if the visit, it’s where she’d end up. It just fit. I knew right away she was blown away that day
No one in life will care if you go to Bard or Hamilton, UVM or CU. A school name doesn’t assure success. Nor does a perceived lesser name mean non success.
Many schools have unique programs within majors that may fit. So look at curriculums. Example - W&M (not skiing) but their Sociology degree has interesting sub tracks as does Charleston for Poli Sci and Urban Studies.
So liking Bowdoin so you can ski. Great. You want to be in the NE. You want an LAC. There are many of varying selectivity. So you’ll find that as you did Bard. Now look at majors and if one piques your interest look at sub majors (tracks within). Maybe Hobart or Conn College have focus areas that you’re like - wow.
These top LACs are great. But look at career reports. Short of Bucknell and Richmond - ehhh - they don’t publish salary data. Why is that? Likely bcuz it’s not great.
So Mt Holyoke or Wheaton, Smith or Hamilton, Colgate or SUNY Geneseo, look deeper than rank. That’s how I feel. Why ? Because when you are on campus, no one cares and when you get out and say I went to Colby or I went to Hamilton, short of a few elitist type jobs, people will ask - where ?
If you want someone to know your school, go to St Olaf in MN. They have ski hills. @AnonMomof2 kid transferred there from Hamilton. She said everyone asks - is that where Rose from The Golden Girls went? You’d have to know the show to understand. Adults will.
The point - find a school you love, not one US News or a clickbait websites say to love.
There are many that can be that for you, perceived reach or otherwise.
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I really appreciate that insight. I guess part of me wants to be proud of myself and feel like I worked super hard to end up where I am. I have no doubt that I’ll thrive at Bing or Hobart (which I also applied to), but I worry that I’ll end up feeling like I could have done better. Now, what does “Better” mean? I have no idea. Probably a large part of me is just chasing rankings, but its hard to grade “academic caliber” myself. I toured all of these schools (Except Colby) and felt like I’d fit = in.
My decision just comes to splitting hairs. Bowdoin felt like it had the best culture to me, but I’m sure a lot of that just came from where I feel like would be the most prestigious to attend. On the other hand, Hamilton’s open curriculum is lovely, but the town is egregiously small even for these rural LACs. I think Colby would fit me, but I have no way of knowing as I’ve never toured (It has no tours this month either). But honestly, what seems to be pushing me away from Colby the most is it’s lower ranking, which I know is completely silly and ridiculous. Cornell seems to have the location down, and the prestige and feeling of self-accomplishment down, but its obviously such a reach and I’m not sure if I’m truly a good fit.
I hate to say it, but the only school that I immediately like I was a perfect fit for was Midd, but obviously I need to get over it.
Exactly. My son turned down a top engineering school for a lower ranked SEC. I guess I got the benefit. Money. He chose it for getting his own dorm room and shared bath with one, palm trees and close to mom. Of course when we skied at Aspen he realized he should have applied to Colorado Mountain College so he can ski daily. Or when he had his first gig out of college in Ogden Utah he rued that he didn’t go to Weber State so he could ski every day, better skiing than you’ll ever find in the East 20 mins away. I didn’t like him dumping Purdue but he told me rank is for US News sales, and that companies and society don’t care. Given his outcome job offer wise, he’s not wrong.
It was dumb luck but my daughter ended up in a cohort of Honors - so a group of 15 or 20 Fellows. They had a lot of enrichment and May study away. I say dumb look because she didn’t know about it when she applied, didn’t get in via the interview weekend (named an alternate) but got chosen when a student chose another school after she had already accepted
I took she and her bff to dinner - why C of C with Rice, Vandy and Penn admits. He said dad is a Dr, mom is a hospital administrator. They both said where I go won’t matter for med apps and med school cost a lot. So I grabbed free tuition. Plus the medical school is a few blocks away for shadowing. He then asked why mine didn’t go to W&L or the public Honors she got into. Fair enough. Why ? Fit. He was making fun of me - noting it’s all ridiculous
It’s like you are trying to impress mom or friends but in life, no one will have a clue what Hobart, Colby or St Michaels (another near skiing) are just like many don’t know what U Chicago or Washington University are. You probably don’t think much of URI or Kansas but they’ll have plenty of off the charts kids there. Bama has the most, or if not close, National Merit Finalists m. A few years ago 1/4 of U of Tulsa class was NMF So brilliant kids choose myriad school for numerous reasons (in those cases, likely money).
Yes you worked hard and you’ll reap the reward in being prepared and that mom and dad are able to provide this education.
As for grading academic caliber - there’s a thread from a student who is either at UCSD, Cal Tech or Columbia. I think most of us think Columbia. The thread - I’ve learned nothing.
In grad school, my Cornell undergrad roommate had a best friend from Wharton. Our rigor at a west coast public was way more intense. Don’t conflate rank with rigor etc.
anyway, good luck. I know you’re going to land at a school lucky to have you. Midd said no. Their loss. If you look back five years from now and say, these were the best four years of my life, then you made a wonderful choice. But dug into the academic offerings of ea h like I noted up thread. Good luck.
I think that your chances at UVM are quite good, and some merit aid is at least possible. One daughter went there, got a great education, and went on to a very good (and highly ranked) graduate program (where she again did well, suggesting that UVM had helped to prepare her well).
You already have some good acceptances, and I expect that you will get more from this list. I would not count on Colby or Hamilton or Bowdoin or Cornell coming through, but that is okay. You can do very well with a bachelor’s degree from the schools that you have already gotten accepted to, or a bachelor’s degree from the schools such as UVM where I expect you are most likely about to get an acceptance.
It sounds like you took the classes that were right for you, while also completing your high school graduation requirements.
If you might potentially be interested in law, and if your high school offers classes that are related to law, then taking the classes is entirely the correct thing to do. Regardless of whether you eventually decide to go into law, or eventually decide to do something else, this is still a relatively unusual opportunity and one that it made sense to take advantage of. Life is not just about AP classes. Education is not just about AP classes. Exploring options and finding what path is right for you is way more important.
I agree with @Franklynn that you do not have to explain this. You took the classes that were right for you. This is what you should do.
Mine did too. They ended up getting a bachelor’s degree from universities that were a very good fit for them. This is way more important than rank. Then they both went on to graduate programs that were also a very good fit for them, which just happened to also be highly ranked.
Fit is way more important than ranking.
If I am remembering correctly then earlier in this thread you mentioned that you have a strong uptrend in high school. I expect that this was not easy and took a lot of work. You should be proud of yourself. This uptrend is going to help you a lot. It will help with university admissions. However, what is more important is that it will help you to be well prepared to do well once you get to university, regardless of where you end up.
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For perspective, this analysis placed Bowdoin 23rd by selectivity nationally and Colby 28th:
In what world is this a “lower ranking” school? It sounds like a great fit for you, but if you’renot going to feel good about getting in, you shouldn’t ED. What seems clear is that you don’t really have a first choice.
If you’re interested in prestige and rankings, Dartmouth is an overlap with Colby, Midd, and Bowdoin. Why not hold out and throw your hat in the RD ring for that one and apply to all the others and see what happens?
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