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<p>Do the average pumber’s sons and daughters have the same opportunity and ability to prepare for the gaokao in the same manner as the wealthy elite?</p>
<p>^ Before the 1980s reform, Mao’s China used class affirmation action to promote education. Only the peasants and the industrial workers deserved education. The burgeois and and wealthy classes got re-education in the concentration camps. They also considered leadership of students in education and social advancement: basically students needed to participate in the communist youth organizations. Do you think China should go back to this period?</p>
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<p>That is perhaps one of the reasons why admissions to the top universities in the US is an opaque holistic process – the academic criteria are such that there is not enough differentiation at the top of the scale, so that a school admitting 2,000 students may get 10,000 applications from students who are generally indistinguishable from each other using US academic criteria (high school grades and SAT/ACT scores).</p>
<p>However, while using a more difficult entrance test can help distinguish between top students who are indistinguishable from each other using US high school grades and standardized tests, as well as promote more transparency in the admissions process, it is not without its problems. For example, it may promote test-specific test taking skills that may not be that applicable to university work (including tests in university), or to jobs or graduate school after graduation.</p>
<p>^ Between SAT/SAT II/AP/IB/other high level courses/research projeccts/extracurricular competitions, the college admission offices do have means to distinguish top students academically. But the “holistic” approach does not require fine differentiation among generally competent students.</p>
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<p>Hmmm. I thought we were talking about college admissions – ya’ know, academics. </p>
<p>I’m quite aware of the rigors of cheerleading competitions, but it seems to be less popular at high schools with an academically demanding curriculum and a large percentage of serious student. The activity has, yes, community value. I wouldn’t make a judgment pro or con such a student without seeing her academic records in some depth.</p>
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<p>Of course, then availability of such things beyond SAT and ordinary high school courses becomes an issue. Students in high schools where AP, IB, etc. are not available or supported by the school are effectively “capped” in terms of being able to distinguish themselves academically, leading to the same problem of trying to determine who will be an academic superstar versus “merely” a good student. (And, for other reasons, the universities might not want to accept only from elite high schools that offer 20 APs, IB HL, research opportunities, academic extracurriculars, etc…)</p>
<p>Haddon, you’ve got to be kidding. High schools in this country vary hugely in terms of how many AP classes they offer. And the competitions that are so drooled over on CC are disproportionately skewed to a handful of high schools – the rest being largely unaware of Intel, USAMO, etc.</p>
<p>@ Warbrian, In answering your question: Yes. Social economic equality does exist for high school education in my high school during my time. I have classmates from all kinds of social economic status: From the sons and daughters of high official to children of average garbage collector. As far as exam preparation is concerned, we have the same access to classes and prep time. It could be a bit different today than it was back then.</p>
<p>@ Coolweather, Your impression does not refelct the reality of the time. To be honest, it is more of an Hollywood version of the picture for that time. Yes, if you are anticommunist, (an equivalent of social out-cast in this society), and you will not be able to be selected to get into college. Any one with half of a brain will refrain from attracting attention in a way that would negatively impact your chances of getting into a college.</p>
<p>My father moved from Taiwan to the US many years ago because he wanted us to have more freedom in learning. He didn’t want us to be crushed with school work and exams in high school. He also didn’t like the college exam everyone had to study for and let it be the determination of where one goes to college.</p>
<p>Well, we certainly fooled him. All of his grandchildren are taking insane number of APs/IB, have 3-5 hours of homework every night, on top of that with 2-3 hours of ECs, and endless number of SAT exams (just counted for D2, 10 tests, and that’s low because she didn’t APs). If your school doesn’t teach to those SAT II material, then it means additional effort in studying for them. D2 studied 2 hours a day for a month for Math II because her IB math didn’t cover most of the material (same for physics and history). </p>
<p>After it’s all said and done, it is still a crap a shoot to get into any school, not just tippy tops (top schools reject kids all the time, safeties reject you because they know they are safeties for you). The college process in the US is a long drawn out process which in my view just takes up too much of valuable time from those high schoolers.</p>
<p>It is a matter of supply and demand. There is only one Harvard, one MIT, one Yale, One Stanford in the whole wideworld. With the race-based quota in place, you are competing with folks in you own race and fight for available slice of the pie. It is a fact of life. So live with it.</p>
<p>^^^and we are, and doing fine with it, thank-you very much. Nothing like stating the obvious.</p>
<p>WOW. Whoever made the comment regarding varsity cheerleading has no idea how hard many varsity cheerleaders work these days! As a former cheerleader and mom to 2 cheerleaders I really really resent the arrogance and frankly, ignorance in that comment.</p>
<p>My oldest daughter would not be a varsity cheerleader and captain of her squad if not for the fact she started gymnastics and dance at age 3 and dedicated hours and hours every week to practice and performance the last 14 years! You can’t just learn to do a standing full when you are 12 -you need to have years of gymnastics training to attain the level of ability required by most cheer squads nowadays. She goes to a small rural highschool and even there if you can’t do at minimum a round off backhandspring tuck and have dance experience you will not make it onto the varsity squad. Cheerleading has evolved from the days of popularity contests to an activity that requires tremendous amounts of skill and innate ability. Not just anyone can be a gymnast, hip hop dancer, have the grace and extension of a ballerina along with being able to perform in front of crowds of hundreds to thousands of people.</p>
<p>This year my daughters squad placed 11th in state for their division and for months they had 3 hour practices 3 days a week. </p>
<p>Most of the girls on varsity cheer drive 45 minutes to an hour twice per week to take gymnastics and many of them do competition dancing which requires an extreme time commitment. It is difficult to make the cheer squad, not only do you have to have the ability, but you also have to submit several teacher evaluations. Most cheerleaders do not have the support of their school in being able to develop their dancing and gymnastics skills - they have to utilize outside dance schools and gyms. Most have to have been completely immersed in dance and acro beginning at a very young age to be able to become cheerleaders.</p>
<p>So, excuse my oft tiresome rants regarding cheerleaders but I just can’t stand to read comments that are so arrogantly dismissive of an activity that requires tremendous ability and lifelong dedication!</p>
<p>Oh, and my daughter may be a hick at a school not “serious academically” but she has tremendous social skills, performance ability and at age 17 could walk into most dance studios and get a job as an assistant. She can choreograph dances and cheers, organize practices, give impromptu speeches at pep rallys and community events and be a leader to her squad. I have no doubt the social/leadership skills she has developed through cheer and dance will benefit her in the future. </p>
<p>Ok, back to the thread and sorry for the interruption.</p>
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<p>A cheerleader heading for a PR job doesn’t need Harvard, which is first and foremost an academic institution.</p>
<p>sorghum,</p>
<p>It appears that Harvard considers public relations a perfectly legitimate pursuit for its graduates: [OCS-Students:</a> Career Areas / Marketing, Public Relations, and Advertising Overview](<a href=“http://www.ocs.fas.harvard.edu/students/careers/marketing.htm]OCS-Students:”>http://www.ocs.fas.harvard.edu/students/careers/marketing.htm)</p>
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<p>Huh? SAT Subject Math II wasn’t hard. I remember taking it after completing precalculus and getting an 800 without doing any test-specific studying – everything on the test was stuff covered in normal high school math up to precalculus (algebra, geometry, trigonometry), which presumably any student in AP Calculus or IB HL math should have completed already. Something like 12% of Math II test takers score 800, so doing so is not unusual (which goes back to the point that academic criteria used in US university admissions is not difficult enough to make a distinction between good and great students in the context of the most selective universities, so the latter depend on opaque holistic criteria to try to figure out whom to admit among numerous applicants with stellar records on US academic criteria).</p>
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<p>I agree, but no one is required to play the game.</p>
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<p>It sure as heck takes brains to do a PR job well.</p>
<p>From Harvard’s website that I posted above:</p>
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<p>mspearl said:
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<p>Possibly you were referring to an earlier comment, because this is what I said:
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<p>And I doubt any admissions committee would make a pre-judgment either. If a cheerleader, like an athlete in a traditional sport, were able to keep up that schedule, yet was a brilliant budding scientist applying to a science program (or ditto for any other demanding program & core requirements), that student would be looked at seriously as a student.</p>
<p>I don’t think that’s “arrogant,” and I know for a fact that I’m definitely not “ignorant” about cheerleading.</p>
<p>Have a nice day. :)</p>