The stories of the “golden kids” don’t bother me as much as the spectacle of national signing day when kids (usually football or basketball) who have committed to play sports in college are featured extensively on TV and in local papers. I see articles in papers about kids who have committed to play x sport at Podunk Community College, but rarely is there a story about a kid’s academic achievement.
I have friends whose child made some mistakes which resulted in an expulsion as well as legal issues. Sometime later I saw a FB post where he had gone back to school and was graduating. I have no idea what college it was (it wasn’t mentioned), but seeing him in his cap and gown brought tears to my eyes. All I could feel was happiness for this family.
There is a lot of pressure to go to highly regarded schools because it is so hard to get a full-time gig at a “top” firm nowadays. For example, many firms in Investment Banking and Management Consulting focus their recruiting on just a small set of “target schools”. To a lesser extent, the same goes with some big-name tech companies.
The old adage of “your MBA matters more than your undergrad, so do not worry much about undergrad” is simply not true anymore. To get into a good MBA program, you need awesome work experience. In order to get that awesome work experience, you often need have come from one of those “target schools”. It is a high-pressure situation for everyone involved.
And before the usual suspects advise all of us as to how there are other good jobs in the world and not everyone thinks IB and consulting jobs are the end all, be all…allow me to say that my D wants to be a museum curator. We have examined bio after bio of folks currently working in museums in the major cities in our region. Guess what? The vast majority have graduated from both top undergraduate AND graduate schools. My D’s match and safety schools were nowhere to be found in hundreds of credentials except for one person who attended Rutgers, Mason Gross.
I never understood the story of the Prodigal Son either.
@Hanna - in post #31 you said you were proudest of the students who were expelled, did drugs and commited crimes and then succeeded. I disagree.
I am proudest of those students who never commited crimes, were expelled or did drugs. These are voluntary acts, unlike the illness and the pediatrician example you gave.
Honestly, as someone who applied to college as a lopsided applicant, hearing of the Ivy obsession has always been tedious. As the son of immigrants, I grew up having it figuratively beaten into my head. It frustrates me to no end. I committed to my current school exactly a year ago today and I couldn’t be happier. Hell, I was shut out of an entire state and I still count my blessings every day.
Now, my MBA aspirations are an entirely different story…
I flunked out because I was sick. But if you are less proud of screwups, so be it; we are all different. I think doctors are rightly proud of saving lives of people who did something stupid and self-destructive like crash their motorcycles without wearing helmets. They don’t have to be innocent victims to be worthy of help.
Just wanted to add this http://www.businessinsider.com/students-accepted-to-all-8-ivy-league-schools-have-one-specific-thing-in-common-2015-4
And the article overlooked the politically incorrect obvious hook - all but the one from Bulgaria are black.
@Hanna - flunking out due to illness is not a screw up. I was referring to real screw ups like crime, drugs and expulsion due to academic dishonesty and the like. Students should know that there are some screw ups that cannot be overcome. Just look at any application for professional schools.
Noone should flunk out because of illness. There are accommodations, medical withdrawals, other approaches to avoid that. Sorry that happened to you Hanna but I just want to make sure that anyone reading this knows that there are things that can be done if one gets sick at college.
@TatinG “Students should know that there are some screw ups that cannot be overcome.”
I am admittedly a bit appalled to see this perspective here.
Though students should face consequences for their actions, believing that we should permanently condemn a teenager for mistakes that they made - that “some screw ups…cannot be overcome” is a healthy message or culture for kids - is absolutely wrong. Young people make bad decisions. The reasons they make bad decisions are complex. To come back from that, to accept consequences, learn from them, and mature with a continued commitment to higher education, is something to be commended.
In addition, students who are most likely to make these mistakes come from backgrounds that have already disadvantaged them: extreme poverty, abuse and dysfunction at home, trauma, mental illness, etc. Healing and moving forward from that is a long-term effort that often necessitates support from multiple counselors, mentors, and other healthy adults, as well as an incredible commitment on the student’s part. Such a student might not graduate with the G.P.A and accolades of another, but they nonetheless worked incredibly hard and undertook intense introspection; more than most students will ever need to engage in. It is absolutely fine to be proud of that work.
Students in these circumstances know they face an uphill climb in the way that schools, peers, and the broader culture will see them. They are not being given privileges - often quite the contrary. When they enter college, they have earned it on merit, even if their narratives are non-traditional.
We learn. We change. We grow. Disparaging students who come from difficult backgrounds who manage to move forward and be successful is not O.K.
I think the parable intends to convey that God’s love & willingness to forgive is over the top. Is it hard to understand, from a human perspective? Yeah…that’s precisely the point.
I disagree. Young people need to learn early on, that some screw ups, like a criminal conviction even as a juvenile one, is going to close a lot of doors in life.
Wow, narratives of grace and redemption clearly have no place with some.
None of us make no mistakes. Forgiveness is hard. So yes, I understand what it is about this story that’s hard to grasp. But if you don’t recognize yourself as the prodigal son, you still have some work to do.
“Young people need to learn early on, that some screw ups, like a criminal conviction even as a juvenile one, is going to close a lot of doors in life”
Sure. Is all hope lost, though?
I love harsh, unforgiving “Christian” values. Yep, that’s what Jesus would said. He was well known for his famous saying “tough, loser.”
There are two views being presented here. What @TatinG says is largely factually correct–some mistakes are major enough to close many doors.
What others are saying is that “No, that shouldn’t be the case.”, which is a highly commendable view that recognizes that some people have a much easier road than others.
These are not mutually exclusive views. Caring parents instill in their children that there are major mistakes that can and should be avoided at all costs. But they will still welcome the children back even after a mistake has been made.
I want to be a parent who “throws a party” for the obedient child who doesn’t squander what he’s been given and works hard. It’s easy to overlook the good kid and forget to gratefully acknowledge that he isn’t causing himself or his family any trouble, simply because we think that’s what’s expected of him–he SHOULD be behaving that way. It may be expected, but not everyone does so.
It’s great to encourage and help the young person who messed up so that he can overcome and succeed despite a rocky start. God is indeed the God of second chances. However, what some were responding negatively to was the idea that we should be “prouder” of the ones who made mistakes than of those who did not. We should be proud of both. I also think it’s dangerous to universally confer victim or hero status on young people who screw up and get into trouble. People have free will and make choices. Not every kid who goes down a bad path has had a bad upbringing to blame it on. And there are plenty of kids from equally bad backgrounds who don’t screw up and stay on the straight and narrow despite the opposition.
Good point @TheGFG it all matters the context. It’s never good to make generalizations of whole types of people. Judge on the individual circumstances for accuracy instead.