However, I agree that it is more visible and prolonged at “elite” schools that “presumably” go for equal rights at the expense of Jewish students unfortunately.
It is not OK for a school to suggest Jewish students to finish semester online or recommend not to enter through these or that gates… If school cannot guarantee safety to all students it should not operate…
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That is very well said. There is no way that any of that nonsense should have occurred at any campus here in the United States. Shame on those schools that did not stop it. In my opinion, UNC was part of the problem. I will never view that school and some others the same way ever.
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No argument from me….you are 100% right.
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OP, are you happy with the amount of Jewish activity in Boulder? Just trying to get a read on how much you are looking for. If so, then I think she’ll be happy with the amount at most large schools and with sorority life. I was in a sorority in Boulder in the 70’s and when we had about 50 women in the group, I think 7-10 were Jewish and as we grew so did the percentage of Jewish women. I attended my first Seder at the house and many of us enjoyed learning about others’ religions, customs, and culture.
And of course there are the flatirons for climbing.
I’ll also say that many of my friends grew up in Boulder and went to Boulder High or Fairview. I think they went home less often than many of us from Denver or just for short visits to do laundry or pick up something they needed, but didn’t stay overnight or for longer than dinner, a birthday party or maybe to borrow a car to go somewhere. Same with kids I know who grew up in Madison WI or Berkeley, CA or near College Park MD. Some I knew from Gainesville FL didn’t get accepted because all the hs kids from Gainesville who want to go to UF just don’t get accepted. So don’t write off CU yet. Sko’ Buffs.
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As for Jewish life at CU Boulder, we know several families that seem to be happy with the Hillel there. Ultimately I think it is unlikely my kiddo will want to be so close to home. I certainly wouldn’t mind having her a bit closer and saving the money! I think at the end of the day she wants to feel that her academic efforts have paid off and she is attending a bit more highly ranked school as well.
The best thing is its location. It is down the street from the football stadium and I bet makes all the money it needs for the year renting out the parking lot on game days.
“I think at the end of the day she wants to feel that her academic efforts have paid off and she is attending a bit more highly ranked school as well.”
want the higher rank - and she’s a great student
All that said - many choose safeties - both mine did (one, the 16th highest rated of 17 admits) - because it’s right for them. My student at Charleston chose it over a top LAC (W&L), top publics and top Honors Colleges (U of SC, UGA) because it’s right - in her case, the campus is so unique and Jewish life was important. My son chose a school with good Jewish life - but that didn’t factor into his decision - but what was important to him did - and he selected it over a high ranking school in his major.
So please put fit ahead of - higher ranked. It’s hard for students (and parents including me) to grasp - but in the end, I’ve learned it’s the right thing.
A lot of schools with strong Jewish populations are high ranked - but not in good weather or proximity to rock climbing. Others were mentioned - are CU level - whether easier or harder admits - large flagships. Va Tech keeps gnawing at me as - what she wants - just hard to get to 
In the end, remind her, there will be no shortage of kids with her stats (and better) on every campus on the list above - they choose the campus for whatever reason - close to home, merit, special program, Honors - whatever the reason. A school, like Bama just as an example, for years had the most National Merit Scholars in the country. Others like Oklahoma, UT Dallas, and more also had a ton - the point being - she is going to find academic strength and brilliant students most anywhere and everywhere - there’s a lot more strength out there than she realizes.
She will be somewhere for four years - day after day after day.
She should be in the right fit - not just - well it’s ranked highly - that honestly doesn’t buy you much once you’re there and rankings are - well to sell a magazine - there really is no such thing as a top 50 or 100, etc.
OP- I am a bit of a contrarian on CC. I think for some kids there really are meaningful differences between a college ranked #30 (assuming the rankings are based on educational outputs and not just nice weather, fancy frat houses, etc.) and ranked #100.
Whether the rankings matter or not is something we all debate constantly and I don’t think anyone at this point is listening or will have their opinion changed. Whether it’s worth paying more for a higher ranking- again, your money, your choice.
So you know your D, we do not. I know kids who use “rankings” as a shorthand for lots of other things-- and I am sympathetic if a kid doesn’t want to land at the same college as the kids who slept through Trig, were too high to pay attention during Chem, and can barely write a coherent paragraph let alone do college level writing and analysis.
For me, as a non-Colorado citizen, your in-state options seem to be far above that level, but I wouldn’t presume to have as nuanced an opinion as a resident.
I think the path forward is to help your kid understand that there are tradeoffs in life. The house on a gorgeous piece of property is in a sub-par school district. The house in the great school district abuts a busy street with noise from buses and trucks in the early morning. The house with the fantastic chef’s kitchen has a scary basement with a laundry room that looks haunted.
So at some point- all the items on the wish list get prioritized and some stay, and some fall down to the “nice to have” level.
You’ve done this before. But I will say based on my own experience AND that of my kids, nieces, nephews, cousins, etc. some of the schools that have been listed may not work for a kid looking for some semblance of Jewish life on campus. The raw numbers? Grain of salt. The percentages? Bad data is sometimes worse than no data.
I live near a college which does not have a Hillel and has a small Jewish population. Our congregation is very welcoming-- and we have dozens of volunteers for anything the students might need- holiday meals, hosting over vacation if the kid lives too far away to go home (or it’s too expensive to fly), even hosting their families if the close in hotels are booked for commencement/parents weekend.
It is not the same as robust Jewish life on campus- led by students, for students. We’ve made some nice connections with college kids over the years-- but I don’t pretend that hanging out with “old people” for Rosh Hashana is any 19 year old’s idea of a good time-- or at least their first choice. The students come to us because there isn’t a big enough critical mass on campus to run anything meaningful. We have a local Chabad couple who would do ANYTHING for the college kids- but again, they run a successful “young professionals” program-- which locally means young married couples with no kids or singles, usually 30+. Do you know college freshman who want to make friends or go to trivia night with a bunch of 35 year old’s? I don’t.
If your D is looking for something more structured than the local synagogue organizing hospitality… some of the suggested schools are just not going to have that. At least right now.
Good luck!
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She is entitled, assuming its affordable, to have any reason she wants for selecting a school. If “rank” is important to her, no problem aiming for what she considers to be higher ranked. And can completely understand her not wanting to attend school 10 minutes from her house. She is likely familiar with the climbing places (indoor and outdoor) in your area and may want new experiences. Good for her!
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To add, its unfortunate she doesn’t want any of the NE schools, as there are lots of beautiful mountains in the area, and Jewish life would be a given at most if not all of them. Would she consider colleges in PA? NC?
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I think the emphasis needs to be on some kids. D went to Utah (which is actually ranked right around #100), her twin brother went to a college ranked #20. The main differences we’ve seen after graduation is that S’s college had far more career-focused students aspiring to prestigious jobs and careers in places like NY, DC, SF or LA (though by no means all, or even a majority of students), whereas most of D’s friends were more interested in staying in the Mountain West for the lifestyle and many were happy to compromise on their career ambitions to enable that.
A kid seeking a prestigious career may make a different choice than one with other priorities.
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I think that’s probably the majority view on CC
(including mine).
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I miss the days when carolyn and pizzagirl used to explain this eloquently.
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I dunno… I get a lot of nasty messages about my alleged elitism… despite my regular and unpaid advertisements for Missouri S&T, U Maine, Beloit, Lawrence, Wittenberg, Muhlenberg and other “less known but fantastic” places to get an education!
And just this week- I find myself defending Rutgers to a bunch of posters who actually live in NJ (and pay the taxes which support their flagship R1 University). But apparently a kid in NJ would rather pay MORE to attend someone else’s flagship- or MORE to attend Adelphi, Pace, LIU, Fairfield. Confounding!
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We often hear from CC participants how everything worked out fine for their kids that attended lesser ranked schools. While I think these claims are earnest they by definition can’t incorporate what would have been had they gone to a more prestigious school. In fact those that have not had first hand experience with elite schools can’t possibly offer an informed opinion on what the advantages of these schools would be. They are blind to the incremental resources, cache of name recognition or alumni network, target schools for IB/MBB and or ignore the reality that the most prestigious of graduate business and law schools typically recruit approximately 50% of their students from 11 schools (ivies, Duke, Chicago, Stanford).
Often those “deciding” on a lesser ranked school either didn’t gain admission to higher ranked schools or made the decision based on financial considerations. Once again while earnest in their assessment it is easy to understand why such folks might be expressing personal biases versus actual experiences. They want to believe their decision or path equates to the same result without any basis to make that determination.
Similarly, I think you will have a hard time finding those that went to highly ranked schools expressing regret with the decision. Obviously in this case personal biases and validation may also be in play.
Point being if rank matters to your kid I would respect that priority as personal and support them while making sure they have options. For strangers however, to tell you how well their kid did (prestige or lower ranked) is nothing more than self serving puffery and a distraction relative to what your kid will experience. Focus on your kid not the general experiences of others.
Good luck.
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I think it all depends on the schools and what is considered “prestigious.” If a kid gets into Duke, but decides to go to a below average public university because they got a full ride, then you are right. However, if a kid gets into a questionable “prestigious” school and has to pay full price or go to a high ranking public for next to nothing, then there is a real debate.
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In this case, if you go back to the beginning, OP was seeking names - for a robust Jewish life, rock climbing, greek life, fun to watch sports teams and nice weather.
There is an entire thread of schools that could work. Many people here provide their experiences, including those at an Ivy League school who have ended up in a start up and raised funds and all of these experiences are worth hearing about, without others taking shots at their commentary.
I’m hopeful OP has received a lot of helpful info for their situation throughout the thread from the many posters who have thoughtfully given advice.
sorry @denb it’s just a generic response - not directed to your fine, well informed to the best of your ability, post.
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As an FYI, there ARE kids who choose their “safety” school for any number of reasons.
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One of my kids applied to three colleges initially and all were viewed as safety schools for admission and she liked them all. And we were able and willing to fund the full cost of attendance anywhere….because we could, we wanted to…and we did.
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Some kids have families that will only fund up to a certain amount for college. Sometimes the sure thing schools are the ones that come in at the price point while higher ranked schools just don’t.
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Some kids find that they feel a great fit with a college that is not highly ranked. And that is fine too.
My point here is…whether reach or sure thing, the student could swing any way and make a decision.
For all we know, when all is said and done, this student will have a different POV than she has now.
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I agree that everything is relative.
It is completely understandable that OP has ranking or prestige as a consideration given the schools her siblings attend. Cheapest option or hard budgets work for some families and others have other priorities that should be respected.
I think it is unfair to superimpose personal circumstances and priorities on others. Lastly given the welcoming and friendly community CC is, I totally respect her personal decision not to retake an exam. That is once again personal.
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Aside from the usual reasons people don’t like to go to their in-state flagship, (1) Rutgers can also be extremely frustrating from an administrative perspective, (2) with the quality/quantity of top students in-state it’s nearly impossible to get into honors, (3) the percentage of in-state students is very very high compared to UDel, UMd, Pitt, etc “, and (4) It’s also a very small state so people do go home.
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