My kid has been selected for the PreMed program in University of Washington (resident state), as well as a number of other out of state colleges. The kid has been targeting to study at UCLA since childhood, guess what, she got in to UCLA for PreMed, as well as USC, UCSD with Regents, UCI, USF with scholarship, Santa Clara Univ with scholarship, UNC and several other reputed colleges.
The real decision that we need to make is between UW and UCLA. The kid has great academics, sports, leadership. The interest in med career is about one year old, she has done a bit of work in psychology.
The COA for UW is 140K and for UCLA is close to 350K. We do not qualify for financial aid, but will find it very very tough to afford the 350K expense.
Plus the med career path is so long, for 4year grad college, we would be looking at another 300 to 350K expense, which we will definitely not be able to afford at all, if we choose the UCLA route. If we chose the UW route, we may be able to help a little bit.
Additionally I keep thinking if my kid (god forbid) changes their mind after undergrad, I would have paid 350K for a Psych degree from UCLA, where is the return on investment on that?
I realize that this is a multi dimensional decision and at the end of the day a personal decision. Still posting this here and looking for some guidance from this community.. Help much appreciated.
I think you have your answer. Guess what, your student can excel at most any school - and guess what, it’s not just these four years but med school too (another $400K). btw - pre-med is an intention, not a major. Anyone can be pre-med (UCLA).
The real question is can you afford $140K + med school without loans (you can only borrow $200K total - undergrad and med school combined). If not, you’d need to find an even lower cost school.
I get it - UCLA was always the goal and they got in. But that is essentially throwing away the future - because you can’t afford UCLA today and then you throw on another $400K for med school.
So if you have a choice less than UW, you might consider it as well to give you flexibility for grad school - because you can’t borrow the full amount, etc.
I don’t think it’s a multi dimensional decision at all. The most important part of choosing a college application list is budget, budget, and budget.
Fact is - you needed to take the emotion out and applying to UCLA never should have happened. The only UC you should have applied to is Merced, under the WUE program.
Based on the above, there is only one realistic option.
Are any of the other options equal to, or below, the COA at U Washington in Seattle ?
If yes, then these are the schools that should be under consideration–not UCLA at $350,000 or more (as tuition and other costs tend to increase each year).
Some medical schools are already more than $100,000 per year. Over time the costs increase rather consistently.
An aspiring MD really, really does not want to take this much (times four years) as debt. It is not clear whether it will even be possible to take this much as debt, and it perhaps shouldn’t be possible because this is just too much debt. A new resident who just got their MD does not make enough to both support their life and also pay the interest on this much debt.
Then attending UCLA will very likely straight out make medical school impossible. If your child is majoring in psychology, then another bad piece of news is that UCLA might also make a master’s degree very unlikely to be affordable.
You cannot afford UCLA.
In your original post you listed a number of very good universities. ALL of these are very good for premed students. So are a few hundred other universities in the US. Of the schools that you mentioned, I do not believe that your child’s chances of getting accepted to a very good MD program is going to vary in any significant way regardless of which of these very good universities they attend.
However, your child’s chances of being able to afford to attend medical school is likely to vary quite a bit depending upon which university they attend for their bachelor’s degree.
You and your child need to budget for 8 years of university. The last 4 of these are going to be expensive.
I do not have anyone in my immediate family who is an MD. I do however have a daughter who is a DVM. She is a veterinarian. The required undergraduate classes for a premed student and for a pre-vet student are the same classes. Because of this she knew a lot of premed students as an undergraduate student, and still occasionally is in touch with a few of them. The 8 years of university are very similar, although an MD needs to then do a residency which is not needed for a DVM (except for some specialties). Before she started her undergrad we set a strict budget and would not let her exceed the budget for her bachelor’s degree. She was frustrated by this. Then she graduated with her bachelor’s degree and no debt. At this point she thanked me for not letting her take on any debt. However, my wife and I had been keeping a secret this whole time. Because she stuck to budget, and a few other things went well, we were able to help her quite a bit with the cost of the DVM. This meant that she was able to do it at all. She has since said that most of the other students in her DVM program had taken on way too much debt. She loves being a DVM, but is also very happy now that we set the strict limit on her budget quite a few years ago and were able to help her along the full path.
Your child needs to stick with an affordable choice now. They might be frustrated now. They will thank you in 4 or 5 years, and then thank you again in 8 or 9 or 10 years.
UCLA is just plain way too expensive unless you can comfortably afford to pay for both four years at UCLA and four years of medical school.
The University of Washington is very, very good for a premed students. Classes will be very tough (but they will be very tough at UCLA also). Maintaining a medical-school-worthy GPA will be tough (but will be tough at UCLA also).
Let’s suppose that you save some money for medical school. Let’s suppose that your child changes their mind. The money you save could still be useful to help with a master’s degree. If instead they go for a fully funded PhD, you could still help them out a bit (eg, perhaps with a bit of help they won’t need to live as if they are dirt poor for 6 or 7 years of getting a PhD).
And I am wondering this also.
Just as one example, Washington State University is also good for premed students. One oddity there is that WSU has a very good DVM program. There will be some very good pre-vet students in the premed classes at WSU. They will compete for grades in classes, but will not be competing for medical shadowing opportunities because they will be pulling calves out of cows at the same time that the premed students are doing their human-related medical shadowing. This might however lead to some interesting discussions.
You need to be the adult in the room and say no to UCLA. Eventually your child will thank you. This might take a few years.
Same answer as everyone else. Going to college should expand the kid’s options as much as possible. Choosing UCLA over Washington would meaningfully restrict this kid’s future options for financial reasons. That would not make sense to me.
I also wonder if Washington is actually the lowest COA option. But I will just say I think it is a great school, in a great city with a very nice campus. So if that is also the option which is least expensive, then I would take that as a win.
Please consider not just the cost of undergrad, but also the $100,000 a year cost of medical school…should she actually get accepted. The new federally funded loan limits are $200,000 in total…including any federally funded undergrad loans. And loans are limited to $50,000 a year which won’t fund medical school per year. So…if this is a possible plan, you need to look ahead.
There is a lot of time for your daughter to actually choose a major. The vast majority of freshman premeds never actually apply to medical school. Also, psychology is not a MD or DO degree. Does she know that? But she would need at least a masters degree to be a practicing psychologist. Psychology is a fine major for undergrads aspiring to medical school. And if she wants to apply to medical school, she would need to add the required courses for medical school applicants to her course of study. Some of these courses are not part of undergrad psychology study @WayOutWestMom
If we are voting, I would vote for U of Washington which is an excellent flagship research university. I’m not sure I see any advantage to attending UCLA. And added…if she is thinking about applying to medical school in CA, she might want to rethink that plan also…one of THE most highly competitive states for medical school admissions. @WayOutWestMom what did I miss?
You might want to have her look at this site which has lots of health care related fields. Maybe something will pique her interest:
Just adding…many college students change their minds about their undergrad majors. And many switch majors multiple times.
And she can get a undergrad degree in psychology almost anywhere. If she chooses that, she will need to add in the required courses for medical school admissions many of which are not required for an undergrad degree in psychology.
ETA…there really is NO ROI for an undergrad degree in psychology. Student will need at least a masters degree to do anything in this field.
Your D cannot afford to attend UCLA if she has any thoughts about attending medical school in the future.
UWash is a R1 research institute that offer a wide variety of majors and research opportunities. UWash’s pre-med advising office is quite familiar with what it takes to get accepted into the in-state (and OOS) med schools and can help direct your daughter toward the coursework and activities she needs in order to be viable candidate for medical school.
As for her other options…any of the schools you listed will be fine for a pre-med.
Med school adcomms care very little where an applicant attended undergrad.
I’ll also mention that a large study of students at 246 undergrad institutions found that only 17-18% of freshmen who say they want to go to med school actually finished all the science pre-reqs needed to apply to med school. For some they found the coursework too challenging; for most, they found other careers that were a better match for their interests and skills. Also medicine is 4 years of post grad study plus another 3-12 years of training before they are able to practice on their own. Many students don’t want to delay starting their “adult” life until their mid-30s.
So consider what her options are if she decides that medicine isn’t for her. What specifically does UCLA offer her in terms of major and careers that she can’t also get at UDub? Are those different options worth over $200,000?
I understand that your daughter is going to be disappointed about not attending UCLA, but if medicine is the dream–then she needs to understand from the very beginning that a medical career requires enormous sacrifices and a decade or two of delayed gratification.