<p>The person GFG described sounds like a moocher, and I’ve known just as many poor moochers as rich ones.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>This is about the most puzzling statement I’ve ever read on this site. What if the kid has an academic interest in art history? Do you feel the same about all academic subjects, or just art history?</p>
<p>I know lots of museum directors and curators, auction house specialists and directors, and others in the art world who came from solidly middle class backgrounds (including members of my own family). They are all doing just fine, and those jobs often come with a lot of perks that one would normally have to be fabulously wealthy to enjoy. I know many other former art history majors who have done extremely well in other fields. Isn’t the purpose of education to become an educated person? What do you have against art history?</p>
<p>I agree with you nottelling. I also don’t get the apparent derision over how rich people spend their money - isn’t that what we want them to do? Especially when it directly creates jobs. Warren Buffet isn’t helping the economy by driving old cars and living like he’s middle class.</p>
<p>Well, NotTelling, if you ignore 2/3ds of what I said, you’re going to be puzzled. I have nothing against Art History; what I laugh about is the following:</p>
<p>*Middle class people who
*send their children to expensive private universities, which have a high family contribution, to
*major in Art History.</p>
<p>That is aping the customs of the wealthy without having the resources of the wealthy. Period. </p>
<p>While I agree with OWS on almost nothing, I fully understand why all these 22-year-olds are irate. They were told to go and take out $100,000 in non-dischargeable student loan debt for expensive liberal arts degrees to “follow their dreams” because “it will all work out.” When the predictable result occurs - i.e. the degree clearly cannot pay for itself, but clearly needs to pay for itself - they are furious. </p>
<p>I don’t have anything against Art History (in fact, my second major was in classics) but you apparently have something against reading comprehension. Either that, or I touched a nerve. Please explain.</p>
<p>aries,
It is not a problem to pursue Art History if the parents can pay for the degree. That is what the rich do. What you are laughing at is taking out high loans for an Art History degree. The rich don’t do that. So there is no “aping” of the rich in your example.</p>
<p>If you stretch your budget and forgo more useful/productive investments it could be considered a negative aping of the rich.</p>
<p>Isn’t the lifetime return on a BA $1million over a high school degree? If that is true, then a $100k loan might be a decent investment, but I am not financially sophisticated enough to figure that one out.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Maybe it’s more complicated to handle speeding tickets outside of California. The instructions on the ticket are straightforward depending on if you want to pay or challenge. You can easily search online for suggestions on how to handle the challenge yourself. People who hire attorneys to deal with speeding tickets tend towards serial offenders who are in danger of having their insurance rates skyrocket or losing their licenses. </p>
<p>If there are municipalities that require you or a duly appointed representative to appear in person then I get that you might need a lawyer. My experience with getting speeding tickets while far from home is that you just send in a check. Laundry is more difficult, IMO.</p>
<p>I haven’t had a speeding ticket in almost 23 years (haven’t so much as been pulled over even). If I got one today, I’d probably need help with it. :)</p>
<p>SL,
I live in CA and am going to disagree with you about the speeding ticket. Years ago I received a speeding ticket in a county that was a 4 hour drive from where I live. I thought the ticket was unjustified and wanted to appear and challenge it but the courthouse was just too far away for me to manage it at the time. I was also not permitted to attend traffic school outside that county, which was another reason I wanted to appear and make the request. If I had had an easy resource like a concierge service to find a lawyer to appear up there on my behalf, I would have done it. As it was, it was too much trouble for what was going on with my life at the time so I just paid it and suffered the point on my record and insurance rates.</p>
<p>For those of us who have children who are going to have to support themselves through most of their lives, yet we, the parents have managed to make and accumulate enough money to boy them charmed childhoods right on up through the college years, it is a challenge as to determining how much you are giving to them that is really enabling them to be dependent. It is a thin line many times or a big area of gradations of gray. I don’t know the answer. </p>
<p>It doesn’t end after college. My son has many friends who live in family provided digs in Manhattan with all kinds of services. Most of them are all great kids that I’ve known over the years, and I had no idea that their parents had that kind of money. But, these kids do have a whole other life style and concerns from what my kids will have, as they are not going to have to worry about finding a job or making enough money. Their parents either through previous generations or from making so much themselves have that covered for them. It’s quite an advantage to have that sort of thing covered in life.</p>
<p>My kids are lucky in that they do not have any student loans, and we are nearby so that when things get tight, they do have a safe haven, and always a meal, heck all 3 squares and a cot if they so need it. But trying to springboard into independence, particularly the way they were raised is difficult for them. Yes, they were spoiled materially. They got everything suggested, wanted, and, of course needed, while they were growing up. And things did get done for them that most families have to do themselves using kid power to do so. I sometimes wonder how much of a favor we did for them as we got them just close enough so that they felt like they belonged with those who are truly well to do, and I don’t think I did enough to make them understand that they needed to learn to do things on their own as we were not going to continue to provide for them. Though we may be considered upper income, upper middle class, however one wants to label us, that certainly does not hold for my young adults who are still at the low income level, particularly one of them.</p>
<p>Nrdsb4, now you’ve jinxed it. :D</p>
<p>Bay, certainly different than my experience, though in the two cases where I was busted far from home it was a fair cop that I wasn’t going to challenge, and I could take traffic school near my own home. You can comfort yourself with the thought that the cost of hiring the lawyer plus the concierge might’ve been the same hit to your wallet as the ticket + insurance cost increase, or at least a good chunk of it. ;)</p>
<p>I have no idea how other states handle speeding tickets, but I’m going to guess that traffic school in MA won’t nullify a ticket received in VT. That might be a reason to go the lawyer route in the subject case. Of course, we don’t even know where the ticket in question was received or why the appearance was needed so this is all conjecture.</p>
<p>Holy ****, you guys are elitist. I have a physical disability that makes it hard to do many of the things mentioned here (laundry, cleaning, cooking). I can do some of them more know that I have a house better set up for me, but it’s still physically exhausting and in many cases, a harder learning curve (cooking and laundry are a lot harder when you have very little ability to carry things). As a result, I’ve had people (either hired cleaners or my family when I have closer) help with cleaning and laundry over the years. Yes, I’m grateful that I/my family can afford that, but otoh, I went to college for a fraction of what most CCers spend, worked through most of it, and have funded myself all through grad school assistantships for the past three years. And trust me, I’d rather not disabled and cleaning my own house than be disabled and have a weekly or twice monthly maid.</p>
<p>cptofthehouse- You are not alone. Many families, even uber rich ones, worry about how their kids are going to make it having grown up in a land of plenty, and even those who can afford to keep their kids on the dole forever often dont’ think it’s a good idea. I don’t know if you saw the link I posted earlier, but it’s worth a read.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>[Kids</a> and Money: How Not to Raise a Spoiled Brat - CBS News](<a href=“http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505146_162-42140104/kids-and-money-how-not-to-raise-a-spoiled-brat/]Kids”>http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505146_162-42140104/kids-and-money-how-not-to-raise-a-spoiled-brat/)</p>
<p>View are all over the map on this issue, but I can tell you that for many of the super wealthy in this country,one of their biggest concerns is how much to leave to their kids, and how to have them grow up and lead productive lives. My Dh deals with people in this situation in his business daily and hears it over and over. Many of these families set up non-profit foundations, which keeps the money from the kids directly but gives them something worthwhile to do. Some of the wealthiest are the most concerned about wasteful spending, losing their fortunes, and about non-productivity of their offspring. </p>
<p>The answer as to why someone like Buffet drives an older car and doesn’t live the kind of lavish lifestyle people expect him to do is precisely what you are concerned about. He doesn’t plan to leave his kids his fortune, so why have them live their childhoods as if they will be princes and princesses forever? He also has said many times in interviews, the important things in life have nothing to do with money. He likes to walk the walk.</p>
<p>Don’t worry about your 20 somethings if they have to struggle a bit. They may be happier in the long run for having achieved whatever they do achieve, on their own merits.</p>
<p>I saw one of Warren Buffett’s grandchildren on TV and she said most people assume he is paying for their college, apartments, trips to Europe, etc. She said no, he had never given her a dime and had already told her he never planned to.</p>
<p>Didn’t Bill Gates build the largest or most expensive house in the country at the time? He walks differently than Buffet?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Apparently so.</p>
<p>I don’t remember seeing this on CC when it came out- maybe I just missed it. But thinking about people with great wealth and how they spend it, I have to say this guy impresses me. (even though I disagree with much of what comes out of his mouth ;)) </p>
<p>[Bloomberg’s</a> donations to Johns Hopkins top $1.1 billion | MNN - Mother Nature Network](<a href=“http://www.mnn.com/lifestyle/arts-culture/blogs/bloombergs-donations-to-johns-hopkins-top-11-billion]Bloomberg’s”>Culture)</p>
<p>That’s pretty cool.</p>
<p>I don’t really see what driving an old car has to do with raising unspoiled kids. We spend our money on ourselves, supporting the economy and our local businesses and restaurants. We don’t buy our kids cars or pay for their vacations, unless they come with us and we want them to. </p>
<p>I have seen kids from wealthy families do very well in life, and I always presumed it was because they wanted to continue living in the style they were raised. That is how it would work for me.</p>
<p>I think Buffet owes it to the American people to spend more of his money supporting the economy, rather than having it sit in his investment accounts, as someone on this thread already mentioned.</p>