<p>I honestly didn’t see the point of including a lot of reaches. My now-senior (whose grades came up junior year to put her into a more competitive stratum than we expected) was “in the ballpark” on GPA and scores for any school in the country. But she is the kind of kid who does better when she is perceived as leading, not as bringing up the rear, so we really only had her apply to matches and even safety-ish low matches. </p>
<p>There’s one school on her list that’s a reach, not because her grades/scores are at the bottom of their heap (they aren’t), but because that school seems to like a certain types of students who package themselves certain ways, and also seems to care a lot about rank. If I didn’t know these things about the school, I probably would see it as a match, rather than a reach.</p>
<p>We didn’t think she’d be happy or successful in a school she had to reach for.</p>
<p>Plus: she’s gotten merit scholarships and invited to the honors program at 2 of the 3 schools she’s been admitted to so far. (I think she might have gotten a scholarship in years gone by at school #3 but they recently changed their policies; they don’t have an honors program.)</p>
<p>I will point out one important point that I’ve noticied with kids going off to college:</p>
<p>They pretty much ALL find it hard to adjust that first semester! Even kids who have been away to summer camp and any other program.</p>
<p>They are thrown into a situation where they are no longer with their closest h.s. friends and don’t have mom or dad nearby to have dinner with or any of their familiar routines!</p>
<p>I would highly suggest parents to encourage their kids to work through their stresses first semester of just getting adjusted, and not race to transfer. Especially with the work our group is doing on fit! :)</p>
<p>Yup, we went back and forth on this a lot. I’ll have second thoughts forever. But there is a chance of paying for these schools, and she looked me in the eye and said she wanted to go for it. Another factor is this is - like RVM’s S2 - a younger sibling who never thought she would measure up. H and I thought it meant a lot that she saw herself capable of being at a more “intense” school - her reaches are right for her, I think, just a step up in the same category of school. </p>
<p>But we’ll never really answer this question. I think the most important thing to ask is: What will be the ultimate result of the process, in terms of your relationship and his/her feeling about him/herself? We decided for us that the reaches presented more positive outcomes (even with rejections) than negatives. We didn’t want her feeling we hadn’t had faith in her, or that she truly didn’t deserve as much as her sister - nor that it was we who had pushed her out of her comfort zone, etc. </p>
<p>No rights or wrongs - but that means lots of careful, individual thinking. And I DO so understand the nostalgia for when the choices all just made sense and seemed like they’d fall into place smoothly. I could use some of that right now …</p>
<p>RVM- don’t mix apples with oranges. Some kids need a reach or two; you don’t want them feeling that you sold them short, or were so worried about their state of mind that you shielded them from potentially bad news (either getting rejected, or getting accepted without enough aid to attend). I say let your S guide the process. As long as there are sure bets on the list, and he has logical reasons for wanting to add a few reaches, where’s the harm?</p>
<p>I appreciate you being concerned about the already stretched budget- but S1’s summer plans really shouldn’t impact your ability to fund two extra applications for S2. And if they do, seems to me you need to have “the talk” with S1, not S2. As long as S2 knows what you can pay… and that anything over that would be off the table, I think you need to encourage him to reach. And if he ends up in a school where he has to work his tail off to keep up- is that really a bad thing?</p>
<p>Wonderful and thoughtful posts today, everyone.
Regarding the transferring issue–My d was always an independent kid, happily went to sleepaway camp for many years-and she had a difficult time adjusting for the first month or two. I was shocked by this. It was so difficult for us to listen to the tearful phone calls by this formerly “together” kid. In the end, after urging her to be patient with herself and to give it time, we finally relented and told her she could transfer to one of our state univs since all scholarships previously offered by other schools were now off the table. From that moment on, she found her niche and has been the poster child for a successful college experience. This wasn’t strategy. We had come to a point where she just seemed overwhelmingly unhappy and she needed to control her own destiny.</p>
<p>As for the costs associated with transportation to Faraway University, part of the deal was that if she wanted to go to this school, she’d come home for the major vacations only. It was just one of the rules that was spelled out from the beginning. </p>
<p>I loved the transfer stories, especially the one about Syracuse and the snow! Yet, the kid is staying in the northeast!</p>
<p>Agree with EmmyBet as to the individualization of the process. It was important to show we had faith in her ability to reach.</p>
<p>I understand the idea behind reaches but in this economy unless you can afford the reach I don’t see the reasoning behind applying to see what happens. I am a little concerned that GC are offering the same advice from years past as if nothing has changed in this uncertain economic time - hence maybe that is why in NJ (other states?) are now requiring Financial Literacy in high school.</p>
<p>I think our reach list will be academic matches but high price tags schools. UVM is an example. Most certainly would get in but with a price tag of close to 50,000 that’s an enormous reach. Merit money would have to be substantial.</p>
<p>With that being said, we might consider UNC Chapel Hill where academic admittance might be a reach, but if we were willing to pay the OOS tuition, maybe they would accept him.</p>
<p>I also will not have him even consider any reach applications until all of the matches are completed and sent. :)</p>
<p>Lots of good thoughts on here today. I agree that the kid should guide the process. If he or she, like Emmybet’s daughter, wants to try for some reaches, then I’d let her go ahead. </p>
<p>Choc and Vitrac make good points about the diffculty most kids have adjusting to college. My D1 was very lucky. She found a great group of friends and got involved in some campus acitivities quickly. We got a few stressed out phone calls, but overall things clicked quickly for her. I still remember when I picked her up for winter break she said that it was wierd to leave her campus home to go home.</p>
<p>I do think that some kids give up too fast. We’ve seen kids leave before classes even started. I think that this generation is less self-reliant than we were. It’s great that they are close to their parents, but I think that sometimes they give up on themselves too quickly.</p>
<p>U of Miami gives out lots of merit money but to qualify your child has to be in the top 5% of his class and have an SAT minimum of 1350. This is only to qualify and no guarantee of any award. My D1 “qualified” but was not awarded any merit money. </p>
<p>I think that RVM’s GC has her head in the clouds. Even with her son’s nice ACT score, Duke, Vandy, Penn…not happening. They are more than reaches. Our private GC told my son that he needed SAT’s of M/CR “kissing 1500” to even consider these schools a possibility (and he is in the top 2% of his class, will have taken 12 AP classes/32 high school credits). Such is the prospects of a white, Jewish un-hooked male in today’s college admissions process.</p>
<p>Cherryhill: It good to remember that a kids grades and scores might improve while you’re looking at schools like they did for many of our hard-working kids. Some of the schools that looked like reaches when we visited colleges last spring were matches by the time my daughter applied.</p>
<p>In terms of cost concerns, most kids can handle things as long as the parents are honest and realistic from the start. It’s tough for a kid to get accepted to a dream school only to find out that it’s financially unattainable. Of course, merit aid policies vary from year to year, and a lot of people are surprised at how colleges calulate their EFC’s so sometimes even the best best prepared families have to deal with tough choices.</p>
<p>Yes, just to be clear - my D did not add schools like Duke and Penn. For her, it was adding Brandeis (might even be considered a high match/reach with her UW 3.6/31 ACT) and Vassar.</p>
<p>According to the Brandeis forum, that answer might come today or tomorrow … So I’ll have a whole new insight for you all in a few days!</p>
<p>I thought I’d add my 2 cents in on the transfer issue. I’m seeing a lot of that this year with both boys and girls. I think it’s important to remind ourselves and all of our kids that it’s ok if their choice doesn’t work out for whatever reason. They can regroup, come home, change plans-nothing is set in stone and there are lots of kids who make changes. The decisions that these kids have to make at the age of 17 just amaze me, and I don’t want my 17 year old to think that as he changes his choices can’t.</p>
<p>I think it’s good for them to apply to reach schools! But if they get in I think it’s very important to find out what sort of support is in place if it turns out that it is too academically challenging. The goal is to not only to get in, but to get out with a good GPA so they can all apply to grad schools and we can keep posting on this list! Also, I think Duke and Penn and Vandy are incredible schools that would offer a great experience. But there are reaches that are less instantly thought of like Colgate or Amherst and maybe those schools might be more likely to offer merit money? </p>
<p>From my standpoint on the faraway school issue it’s as much a matter of time as it is of cost. S2 got into Elon and I would rather pay extra for a non-stop flight than incur the 8 hours of flight/layover time! In the event of homesickness where my son just needs a “home” fix it worries me that it would take that long to get home.</p>
<p>blossom - I assure you the cost of adding another 2-3 apps is not an issue - then we would really be in a bind! Not quite that dire. I was simply in the mindset that he did not need any reaches as merit aid opportunities are better with safeties/matches and I’m not convinced he can handle the workload if he got into a reach. But, I really do want it to be his process and his choice - so we can add a few reaches if he wants - they just seem to all be very expensive schools. But - you know I love visiting colleges and was actually feeling sad that we might be done with visits this spring - I shouldn’t really object to keeping going!</p>
<p>Just caught up on comments from the last few days. Many interesting comments. </p>
<p>RVM, While I know you are stressed, I will share a story. D1 and I spent a great deal of time researching schools, visiting many, and enjoyed the process. She realized that there were many schools that she could be happy at. She had all her applications completed and submitted by sept. 15th. On Oct 4th of her senior year, she had been admitted to her safeties(indiana, Pitt) when we went to look at Wisconsin. She fell in love with Wisconsin that weekend. She said that is where she would go if she got in. On the plane home, she decided she wanted to apply to one more school. She thought michigan. I suggested Texas. Her private college counselor told her she would never get in. Needless, to say, she got in. After visiting, she went there. She is home this week. She told me last night, that she knew she would be happy anywhere, but can not imagine anywhere else being as good as texas. She loves Austin, the spirit, her major, the greek life, and everything else. This is a long way of saying, that a last second whim turned in to the best decision for her. Let the process unfold for your son, let him come to his own decisions, be open minded, and all will work out well. As control freaks, it is difficult for those of us on this sight. All will be good. He will find his school, you will have financially viable choices, and all will be good. A couple of months ago, you were worried about him. Now he has stepped up his game, and done well. Be proud and Enjoy this journey. All will be good.
Enjoy the weekend.</p>
<p>I agree with seiclan about merit aid at U Miami being tough. A friend’s child applied this year with a 2300+ SAT and a 3.7 UW from a very academically-demanding high school of the sort that is well known by adcoms. The student was admitted, but no merit money. The same kid was admitted early to Tulane with lots of merit money. </p>
<p>RVM, if your GC can say that they’ve had kids be accepted to Duke, Vandy, Lehigh etc this year and last with similar stats to S2, then OK. It sounds more like the GC wants to play the lottery. :)</p>
<p>For those of you with seniors, what sorts of activities are your youth groups or synagogues providing for the 12th graders? D1 went to a USY Shabbat dinner for local high school seniors at the nearby state U Hillel and had a great time. I went to the same Hillel during grad school, though it’s now housed in a brand-new building. Such a nice way to encourage the students to help transition to college Jewish involvement! Our shul is doing a “how to talk about Israel on campus” evening and a money management for college students evening.</p>
<p>Took awhile to get all caught up. Congratulations to everyone on all of the great acceptances. I hope the good news keeps coming for everyone.</p>
<p>Rkvl - I think the GC was smoking something! Seriously, Penn, Duke, etc. I looked at Naviance and they don’t seem like viable options. I don’t know why she would encourage those kinds of reaches. I do know of a student a few years ago, who got rejected at all of her schools (all top tier schools) other than college park. Almost perfect GPA and SAT scores. After hearing the schools the GC recommended, I can’t help but wonder if she was led to believe she would get into one of those schools. Should be interested to hear what the GC tells my D next week.</p>
<p>Anyway, I do think it couldn’t hurt to add Miami and/or Tulane to the list. With the understanding that without merit money, it’s not happening. Check out the Tulane and Miami threads, there does seem to be money out there for kids with your S’s stats.</p>
<p>Hi there. I’ve been following the discussion here and wanted to ask: What does RVM-son think of those suggestions?
Maybe some of this needs to wait until you have a better understanding of what your EFC will be with two in college…you may be pleasantly surprised.
That said, Tulane has the advantage of rolling admissions if you are early enough in the process. You may have an answer by October (we did). Miami has an EA choice, but doesn’t notify until January.
Your GC may be calling Elon and Susquehanna safeties, but these are by no means schools that are populated by slackers. Your son will find very bright, motivated students at either.
I don’t remember,but if they are available, does your son take mostly AP classes? If not, the GC will not be able to check off “most demanding” schedule on the evaluation form and this will not be to your son’s advantage at all.
Obviously there’s no harm in applying to reach schools as long as you and he are prepared for the consequences…acceptances that are unaffordable or possible rejections that sting.
As long as no one has blinders on, let him take the lead on this.</p>